Avalon, Part 2 (902)

[Hatcheter]

Good points - nepotism in the military? Kree shak! or whatever. You've got me thinking on that one - I'm going to call one of my military buddies and see what they say....seems implausible, though....

hey, i'm a mature symbiote now. Always wanted to be a mature symbiote

I started a thread on that very topic here, and still haven't found a conclusive answer after a month and a half. If your military buddy can quote the exact regulations, post them there, will you? Any additional info or case examples on civilliams working under a military relative would be appreciated as well.

[Jace021903]

Sorry, not buying it. She was burnt to a crisp before his eyes and there was no way Daniel could have known she wasn't still toasty. If you look closely you can see her body was still smoking after scary guy did his magic! Yet Daniel showed not the least hesitation in touching her immediately. I think a much more normal reaction would have been to be at least a bit hesitant.

Yes, I know, why am I looking for normalcy...?

How about this:

If the body was still hot, Daniel would have felt the heat coming from it as he approached. So he knew the scary guy took care of the heat too.

On another note, I love your sig picture.

Jace

[klae]

Is anyone else bothered by the fact that the Ancients used the same numerals thousands of years ago that we use now? (When Mitchell had to put the tiles in order) The Ancients use a completly different alphabet/word system, so their numbers would be different also. Kinda bugging me.

[Vicious]

Merlin was the ancient who most likely created those puzzles and by that time the numeral system was influenced by the romans giving us the current numeral system in which browder could figure out. They were in england mind you.

[AGateFan]

Still loving this show, still anxious for the next episode!

About the fight scene... Someone smarter than me explained it this way:
The ancients could care less whether you can out-sword fight a knight. It was all about determination and spirit. In the beginning, the HoloKnight is programmed to fight just one notch higher than the person it is fighting. The purpose is to wear down the opponent and bring him/her to the brink of defeat. It is what the opponent does at that point that is important. If they escape to the rings, than they have failed. If they find, within themselves, the courage and resolve to get back up and fight, then they will win. At this point, HoloKnight fights one notch below the opponent, maybe starting at an equal level to see if the opponent's resolve holds, but allowing the true in spirit to eventually win.
It had nothing to do with whether or not you can hold a sword correctly, but whether you will keep fighting.
I thought this was an excellent analysis and I agree wholeheartedly.

Someone said that the sword work and foot work wasn't correct. This is also explained by the theory above. Mitchell didn't know how to fight with a broadsword, so why would he be fighting correctly? And the knight is only programmed to stay one-step ahead, so he isn't going to be showing off any clever moves, since Mitchell didn't know any. Put in this context, it make sense that no experts were called on the set to get the moves right.

Great post.
And for TV I thought the fight was really well done. Mitchell looked very tired after 3-4 swings as someone who has never weilded a Boardsword before should be, those things are heavy. I did think it was another test but my brain just missed the "fighting to the level of you opponent" idea. I did get that it was all about his strength of will and never surrendering though.
The fight was much, much better then I thought it would be when I heard about it.

[Mongo's Girl]

First time post, though I've been lurking for about a year.

I had to weigh in a little about the sword fight. I will say that I don't know much about the broadsword, but I do know it's two-handed slashing technique is totally different than the one-handed approach used with the epee or foil traditionally in fencing.

So my first thought is to cut Cam some slack on his footwork or strategy (plus college was a little ways back for the Lt. Col. to just snap back into expert fencing footwork). Actually, you'd probably find Mitchell's outright adeptness the more implausible action.

Anyway, I liked the way that the action was shot. I thought it very good quality, especially on a TV budget. It seemed like it had more flow to it, with longer pieces of action that were not played exclusively in cuts. The fight told a story with Mitchell getting the crap kicked out of him while he just tried to defend and not get sliced up.

As the fight continues, the right-handed Mitchell took a blow to his dominant hand and continued his defense solely with his left hand. That's got to be difficult with a broadsword that is meant to be wielded with two hands. The moves were different, the flow was different and he was obviously still losing.

So the flashback made sense to me in the "fight or flee", "never give up, never surrender" sense. A little "Rockyesque" I'll grant you, but still good character stuff.

The push off from the flashback even matched the flashback in the fight scene.

To me they obviously took great care to do it well.

Just my .02

I like your .02

As far as the puzzles go, I didn't have a problem with them being too easy. I would have had a problem if they were difficult, and they solved them in 10 seconds while the ceiling was about to squish them flat as a pancake.

[SGMike]

Merlin was the ancient who most likely created those puzzles and by that time the numeral system was influenced by the romans giving us the current numeral system in which browder could figure out. They were in england mind you.

You got a point there -- I really never thought of that!
After watching those two episode of avalon, it makes the King Aurthor and the Knights of the round table story for me never the same again if you know what I mean. It has a whole different twist

[klae]

okay, I'll buy that. then maybe a better question is, if the puzzles were created to be solved by humans on earth, why is the writing in Ancient, and not in the olde English in use during Merlin's time? There's definitely an inconsistency there.

[akimbo]

I like your .02

As far as the puzzles go, I didn't have a problem with them being too easy. I would have had a problem if they were difficult, and they solved them in 10 seconds while the ceiling was about to squish them flat as a pancake.

Thanks! I can't speak for the technical side, but it looked good to me.

I also like the idea expressed above that the fencing comment was a joke and he continued the self-depricating idea saying that he flunked. That would make him a total novice and much more likely that the holoknight was fighting at just above his level to measure his metal.

I think solving both puzzles requires that you can read Ancient. Which, apparently, is no small feat. After that, they were relatively easy unless you were also being squished.

I really enjoyed this episode. Much more action than Avalon, pt 1 and understandably so with the setup required in part 1 (which I also enjoyed).

Although I really liked the sword fight, some of my favorite parts were where we see a widening gap between Mitchell and Jack's character. Jack may have made the comment about Daniel finding the only book in a pile of treasure, but he probably would not have asked him to relate the story in the book. He also wouldn't have given Daniel back what the story meant when asked, feigning ignorance. There are a couple other departures in the ep and I like the trend.

My favorite parts belong to Daniel and Vala. Their repartee continues to impress and has toned down a notch (which is great). Daniel's reaction to the burning was spot on Daniel and very well done and I think we saw a crack in Vala's shell as a result of the burning experience which makes her more sympathetic to us and to Daniel.

And Daniel was talking fast and he could slow it a tad, but I thought it was in character of the wide-eyed Daniel Jackson that I love.

WooHoo! Bring on Origins!

[rhade]

What a fun episode I think they did a real good job since there was so much to introduce in these episodes. I thought the new characters were real good. Daniel was great and Vala was toned down but fun and I liked what we saw after the burning. That fire scene was great I would of loved to see the more graphic version they had before. I really like the General, he isn't a copy of Hammond and he is just getting started so its all new to him we get to see how he reacts to these situations. I like the energy they have shown it makes the show seem new and old at the same time. It is great that they are bringing new conflicts to esablished species like the snakesheads with the new Jaffa nation. I thought that the transition between the first and second act was somewhat jarring but understandable given what they need to get through. Tealc did a great job as usual. I can't wait to see what these Orii do now that they know we are here.

Here is a question?

Since the Orii are ascended and you can only fight their priors and doci it makes them seem more menacing than the bad guys we have seen so far. Its like they can't be bothered to come and convert us themselves so they send missionaries. These bad guys seem less a one season threat and more of a multi year season threat. How do you fight a group of beings that have no physical form. Even if there is a way to eliminate them in no way does it stand to reason that it is something mere mortals could do on our own.

It makes me wonder if a final confrontation between Earth and the Orii wouldn't be a fight with spaceships but between us, the Ancients and the Orii. Maybe this will get those ascended folk off their collective asses and pay attention to these lower planes of existence.

[Avatar28]

Perhaps if/when they try to intervene directly THEN the ascended ancients from OUR galaxy can step in to block them, thus leaving the fight to their mortal "servants." Almost a classic God vs Satan thing. They aren't allowed or can't (for whatever reason) really interfere directly, so they leave the contest to us humans. Or something like that anyways.

[valainna]

First time posting! Yay me!

Okay, Part II... I enjoyed it. I would have liked to see more CM but that's just because I'm a BB fan. Can't help it.

Vala being burned, I knew it was supposed to happen and I still I admit my first thought after the initial shock was, wouldn't she smell? Call it firsthand experience coming into play in my viewing of the episode but I couldn't get the thought of the real thing out of my head. But Daniel going to her and just being Daniel. I don't want any Daniel/Vala ship but it was nice to see him go to her and hold her. And the tingles comment was priceless. Vala is trying so hard to not show her vulnerability but the look on her face and the way she held so tightly to Daniel betrays that confident exterior.

Don't really have anything to say about Landry/Lam. I don't mind either but it's still early for me to give a solid opinion on them. Separately, they seem interesting.

As I said I would have liked to see more Mitchell. I thought the fight was good especially since he probably didn't know what he was doing and was going on pure determination. Makes me wonder a little. Does anyone think it's possible he flatlined at least once after the crash? I mean I'm amazed he survived to begin with since it looked horrible. Maybe he knows more about death than just seeing it, he's been there. And I think that because the determination with the puzzle (however easy it might have been) and then the not giving up with the holoknight had something to do with it. He's faced so much already, to have it end because of a puzzle or a hologram would almost make the entire recovery pointless. At least that was my take and I have known to be wrong many times.

I would really like to see more with the Orii. They creep me out and that's always good. Though I hope they're more than just creepy. Dimension would be nice. Nonetheless I can't wait for Friday.

[PsychoWarden]

okay, I'll buy that. then maybe a better question is, if the puzzles were created to be solved by humans on earth, why is the writing in Ancient, and not in the olde English in use during Merlin's time? There's definitely an inconsistency there.

Excellent observation. I think the easiest explanation for this is that the Ancient writing was a defense mechanism. Myrddin/Merlin wanted to make sure that whoever found this area was in fact worthy of the treasure, and not a thief (like Vala), someone who just happened to stumble upon the cache, or even worse of all, one of the Ancients' enemies. Since very few people speak Ancient, the person(s) worthy of the treasure would have had to be someone who not only studied and understood the Ancient language, but also could understand the cryptic clues Merlin left.

Sure, the cache was shielded quite effectively to begin with, but it seems likely that the Ancient writing was a last line of defense, just in case some random person or one of the enemies of the Ancients managed to find a way into the mountain looking for the treasure.

Or it could've just been because Merlin felt like writing in his native language...

[the fifth man]

Come on, Friday. Get here already. Geez, it seems like forever since I saw the last episode. Can't wait to see how they wrap it up. Seeing the Ori should be pretty cool, and just want to get more of a feel on where this season is heading. Quite pleased so far though.

[sparklegem]

That fire scene was great I would of loved to see the more graphic version they had before.

I also would have liked to see the earlier cut of the fire scene. It was a horrific event, and the more realistically it comes across, the more powerful it is, the more it moves me and pulls me into the story and conflict.