Pretense (315)

[Chaka's_Mum]

Zipacna was also fun - he had a nice line in sneering. <g>

He did, didn't he? He also had possibly the worst dress-sense of any Goa'uld we've ever seen!

Spoiler:

I bet Kevin Durand was delighted to find he wasn't going to have to wear a vest, mini-skirt, sandals and thick eyeliner for 'Summit'!

. I imagine it was unintentional (after all, who amongst TPTB in Vancouver will have seen 'Rainbow'?), but I couldn't help but be reminded of a certain opinionated orange muppet with a zipped mouth when Jack started calling him 'Zippy'.

Oh one thing which really cracks me up is Daniel declaring to Travell that Narim 'didn't explain the triad too well'. LOL. Bit rude. <g> Especially with Narim standing right there at the time.

Not the most diplomatic of statements, was it? Quite surprising that it came from Daniel - he's normally more tactful than that! I'd have gone along the 'has given us a basic overview of triad, but there wasn't enough time to go into practical details'.

Thus spake the civil servant...

[QuiGonJohn]

I liked this one. It really got good when Teal'c went to Lya for help. I just thought that he was going to have Lya do more, like make the Tollan think they were being attacked so they would realize Teal'cs warning was accurate. Still good how it played out.

[Believer]

Just saw this episode for the first time.

What Albion pointed out struck me too. How could either Klorel or Skaara have "private" conversations with their respective legal counsels without the other knowing the full content of the conversation?

Also, is it just me? I didn't see anything resembling a DHD by the Tollan gate. Maybe it, like the gate, just had a different design...

I liked the cat too. Don't have a GDO? Send a cat...

Just a thought. As the Nox can open the Gate without a DHD, perhaps the Tollan can as well. Remember, it was the Nox who rescued the Tollan from Earth and settled them on their new homeworld.

[Chaka's_Mum]

I liked this one. It really got good when Teal'c went to Lya for help. I just thought that he was going to have Lya do more, like make the Tollan think they were being attacked so they would realize Teal'cs warning was accurate. Still good how it played out.

To be honest, I would have been most surprised if Lya had agreed to undertake such a deception. She, like her fellow Nox, is completely committed to pacifism - and would not (not could not, would not) take any action whatsoever that would provoke overt aggression in another; not even if that aggression was solely to counter the aggression of an external party. I think that makes sense if you don't read it too many times...

Instead, by keeping that one ion cannon hidden from Zipacna's sabotage parties, Lya has simply ensured that the Tollan have the means to choose their own fate in extremis - even if it was Teal'c who got the thing to fire in the end. She hasn't fired the weapon herself, nor has she personally and directly provoked anyone to do so. It's a bit of a tight squeak, but her conscience is clear. And those pesky Goa'uld are defeated yet again. Hurrah!

[Perriman33]

A good storyline but OMG those Tollan people really annoy me (I'm quite glad about what happens to them later) the gits. TPTB really enjoy these schizophrenic episodes (two people one body), and they do it well I enjoyed the courtroom battle. I thought 'Zippy's' arguments were quite good. And any episode with the Nox in gets full marks. They are everything the Tollan's should be, considering they both hate war etc. I was happy for Skaara he escaped at klorel at last. A good ending to his story.

[Chaka's_Mum]

Oh yes - that tiresome superiority complex they have.

Their motives for denying a less advanced civilisation access to their rather exciting, whizz-bang technology are sound - it's just the awfully patronising way that they express their refusals; not to mention the veiled insult in using the word 'inferior'.

Much as I like Narim, and although the Tollans are technically (pardon the pun) our allies, you don't half enjoy the moment when their smug superiority gets them into bother and SG1 - admittedly with Lya's help - have to step in to save their butts.

[Perriman33]

Yeah, narim is like martouf ,the one redeeming quality for both their races.(I still count jacob as human for some reason)
I suppose they have to have a bit of variety for the different peoples but I'm amazed the tollans got to this technology level without stealing some of it or having loads of enemies wanting to pummel them to death.

[Stricken]

Good episode although the Tollens a real pain in the backside!

[Ascendant]

Best.
Opening sequence.
Ever.
Ohmygosh.

There's that one long shot with the glider running away from the motherships, then I'm guessing they had to blow up a couple of trees and a bunch of dirt before adding in the CG glider crashing down. Wicked.

Also, is it just me? I didn't see anything resembling a DHD by the Tollan gate. Maybe it, like the gate, just had a different design...

Maybe they use those little touchy-slidey hand devices like the Asgard use in the season 5 finale. Old Cassandra used one in 1969, too. At any rate, I thought it was SO COOL that they build their own stargate.

I like the Tollan because they're an obvious parody of the characters in Star Trek and their Prime Directive. It's almost a rebuke to an idea that I've always had a problem with. Like "See, this is what the other guys feel like!"

Love this episode. Tollana is a gorgeous world, and I love the little pools of glowy water set into the archetecture. It's also a happy ending to the original quest (i.e. getting Skaara and Sha're back), something that was much-needed after Sha're's death. It does seem a little halfhearted, though, almost anticlimactic. I guess it's because the focus was more on saving the Tollan's lives. Still, the Goa'uld attack - any episode with death gliders rocks.

Oh, and one more thing - I just got the Battlestar Galactica miniseries on DVD, and I was surprised to see Tollan show up in the second scene with that blonde bombshell. They showed that area with all the pillars holding up the overhang, as well as that little square pond in the middle of a lawn. And the more I think about it, the more sure I am that they used that same location (on the other side of the pillars, looking down that long flight of steps towards the huge overhang) in the Andromeda episode "The Prince."

It's totally off-topic, but in the scene previous to that in the Battlestar Galactica DVD there's a hidden Firefly ship cruising through the skies of their homeworld. It was just a rather weird series of cameos that left me feeling like all science fiction shows were linked in some mysterious cosmic way.

But anyway, yeah. Great episode!

[walter_MacChevron]

I dont like the Tollans much or this episode...........it does not seem memorable because i have watched all episodes from S1 to S7 three times and i can not remember one minute from this episode

[adk06]

personally I liked this episode
and I thought the tollan just wouldn't trade weapons technology?
I mean we never really did ask for anything else, (at least it didn't show us asking for anything else)

I also found it funny when there weapons are disabled Oneill makes a fuss and Carter says "Sir based on what i've seen in the last 5 minutes it doesn't look like they would do much good anyway"
I mean since the Tau'ri haven't upgraded to energy based weapons in all that time meaning that a bullet is just as good as a energy weapon, except the tollan probably have defensive shileds that could block bullets

[captain jake]

personally I liked this episode
and I thought the tollan just wouldn't trade weapons technology?
I mean we never really did ask for anything else, (at least it didn't show us asking for anything else)

The main focus of the sgc is military weapons.

[Sheppard]

yeah that is true

[Chaka's_Mum]

personally I liked this episode
and I thought the tollan just wouldn't trade weapons technology?
I mean we never really did ask for anything else, (at least it didn't show us asking for anything else)

I think the Tollan won't trade any form of 'superior' technology with an 'inferior' race (their description, not mine ). Sooner or later even the most innocuous scientific breakthrough gets considered for its military potential. They've been down that road before and ended up watching another civilisation destroy itself as a result.

I suspect that background diplomatic activity between Earth and Tollana has probably raised the issue of sharing/taking on technology for non-military uses (and been rebutted just as firmly as Jack keeps on being). Given that seeking out and securing alliances/technology from off world sources for defence purposes is one of the goals of the Stargate Programme it's perhaps inevitable that we'd only see the search for weaponry/shield technology when SG-1 go asking. Besides, Jack really fancies one of those Ion cannons!

[tommiekins]

Another fantastic episode of season 3. I really like the Tollen and to see Skaara again is fantastic, but having Lya in this episode is just brill. I love the Nox and can't believe they haven't been in more episodes, but still, there are more (hopefully many more) to come!