Bounty (1015)

[RealmOfX]

You know, while you have every right to your opinion I think that you are being a bit hard on the fans that enjoyed this, and on the actors. You may have more of a point about the writers. But not every episode has to be part of the massive plot arc that SG-1 has accumulatd over 10 years. In fact I'm sure that has what has lost viewers. Sometimes it's too much effort to pick up every reference to the past.
Also with reference to RDA...'slapstick ...gags that mock the audience for watching and the actors for participating were not his thing'. Are you sure about that? SG-1 has always been pretty self-referential and there have been many occasions that Iv'e felt a hint of mockery for the audience. But hey, I think they always come in useful when I'm starting to forget that it realy IS just a TV show and not RL.
Anyway, I can't feel sorry for finding this a delightful episode. When I watch I want to be entertained. Soemtimes I want meat, sometimes I want sugar!

Looks at golfbooy's post
Looks at this one



Golfbooy wasn't being hard on fans, he didn't mention them at all in that context. I get the feeling that you are taking Golfbooy's comments about the episode personally. If you want to take offence at golfbooy's not liking the episode and wanting SG-1 to live up to it's previous standards as he sees it, then go right ahead but don't bring it onto the forum. It's not about you, it's about the episode.

Golfbooy mentions RDA in context of him not allowing juvenile junk like this get on the screen (my abbreviated interpretation). He also mentions he doesn't like how Beau can't seem to pronounce Goa'uld properly after 2 years and he doesn't like it. To me it seems a fair enough expectation for a professional actor to be able to pronounce a simple word like Goa'uld; three syllables "goo a uld", it isn't that difficult. I don't see that as being too hard on the actors, is that what you are referring to?

You also might try to get your quotes correct, you substituted actor in an instance where golfbooy used character.

Nobody asked you to feel sorry for liking this episode, how did someone expressing their opinion of an episode become about you??? As for your meal choices, well one would hope that you are adult enough to realise that everyone will not make the same choices as you and respect that.

[Pitry]

Quite the opposite, I'm afraid. I believe I've liked it for too long, and with too discerning an eye. I approach it with the expectations of the past, not the reality of the present, and as such find it lacking where there is no chance for remedy. This was not an episode that exhibited professional quality or in any way met the standards the show has set for itself. That's the long and the short of it.

See... kinda odd. I mean, I agreed with a lot fo what you said in your initial post - not all of it, as I did find several parts of this episode entertaining to some degree - but msot of it. But I actually find that in its silliness and bad humour it actually is differnet from seasons 9-10 and not at all in line with them. If there's one episode I think Bounty resembles it's Prometheus Unbound, only in PU they managed to have the dumb comedy work, and ehre they haven't - quite possibly (IMO) because the episode fits PDL's sense of humuor a tad bit too much... don't get me wrong, I think he's a very good director (and a writer, and he;s a great actor ) and I usually enjoy his episode,s but I think Bounty had too much of the humour appealing him in roder to have some balance.

[phibi]

I like the part where the woman trying to kill Daniel cross the road and got ran over by the bus. LOL.

oh yes!!! i loved that scene... i laughed my head off *still chuckles

[suse]

It soesn't bother me that this episode has nothing to do with the rather "flushable" Ori. Not at all. It's nice to tatke a break. Again, it comes down to how the break is taken. I LOL several times. Vala does have some great one-liner's. I was usually also rolling my eyes. At least they didn't put her in the dominatrix outfit again. That must have been recut for her baby girl. Another couple inches of material wouldn't have done amiss. At least I (and yes, it's all about me ) might not have been jarred out of enjoying the ep into wondering what was going on in the writers/directors/costumers heads. Then realizing what a dumb queation that was. It wasn't the OTT stuff I found funny. I found the bus thing cringe-worthy. And not because she was run over. <sigh> It was the actors expressions mostly. Because this ep was seriously weak on plot. But has several amusing moments.

While I agree with much of golfbooy's assessment I'm a bit more mellow about it. I've lowered my expectations to expect something just above drivel (storywise). So I'm not usually disappointed much. And can even find amusement where I'd have ... not ... before. I do still have a bit of melancoly for the "good ol' days" when I could expect more though. Ity's been a tough adjustment

suse

[Rachel500]

You want pithy? Don't bother watching.

It's not Stargate. It's not anything. It's just a bunch of random scenes strung together by the flimsiest of "plots". It's not even full of sound and fury, it's just plain old nothing. And there's certainly no signifying going on. Bounty is far and away the worst episode of season ten, and probably one of the absolute worst, most pointless episodes that the show has ever, ever done. And SG-1 has done more than 200 of them.

The wrongness of this episode is not Mitchell's fault. Well, it's not his fault in the same way that Stronghold and Off the Grid were his fault. No, this was the writers totally and willingly abrogating all responsibility to tell a story that is in any way coherent or in concert with the rest of the show, season, whatever. The only way that the awfulness of this episode can be attributed to Mitchell is in the necessity to write something, anything for the character. It's episodes like these (and there have been way too many of them) where the character's weakness is fully revealed. These writers don't know how to fit Cameron Mitchell into a Stargate story. They don't. So, instead of producing a mutated monster like Off the Grid, they just decided not to write an SG-1 episode at all. My God, I can't believe how bad this sucked. The idea that something this ridiculous passed the muster of so many people while it was being made is enough to scare me off of the whole show.

As things go, I didn't expect the teaser to be the best part of the episode. I've never liked the Lucien Alliance. The idea is somewhat sound, but the execution has been horribly slipshod, resulting in me be subjected to regular visits from cartoon characters like Netan and sundry bounty hunters. Here again the Alliance and its cohorts are displayed as a comic book regime, full of arch villains perpetrating evil acts upon each other and the general populace, with nary a thought being given to their motivations or objectives. And speaking of motivations, I still haven't figured out SG-1's. Why are we destroying kassa shipments? Are we protectors of the galaxy at large? Do we police the universe, are we the intergalactic DEA? Aren't there bigger fish to fry? And did we just release a bounty hunter on a mission to assasinate the head of the Lucien Alliance? What?

Bounty tries to make up for it's lack of plot by conjoining as many "cute" moments as the writers thought they could resonably get away with. Daniel's assault at the library is bizarre and pointless. Not to be outdone, Sam's and Dr. Lee's "performance" on stage at the conference with goofy space guns is equally asinine. Only Teal'c's ambush is played straight, and the intelligence with which Chris Judge imbues the character is the only thing to save this segment from descending into bufoonery as well. He must not have gotten the memo on this story's tone. Either that, or he got a different director. Each moment could have been used more effectively. The conference was perhaps most worthwhile for the glimpse as to how alien tech is disseminated, but the manner in which Dr. Lee is portrayed at this point just makes me cringe. Of course, my face is permanently contorted after seeing how Daniel dispatched his assasin. I like Loony Tunes more than the next guy, but wow.

For all the criticism that gets slung around about how Richard Dean Anderson joked too much as O'neill in the later years, and how he became "Cosmic-giddy Jack", there is no way this cartoon would ever have been made while he was still around. Slapstick, goofball sight gags that mock the audience for watching and the characters for participating were not his thing. It's too bad that the show has lost that respect. If this is the epitome of the show's humor these days, then by God I'm thankful it's been put down. It was a mercy kill.

I'd talk more about the plot, but I am unable to locate it. Neither can I expound upon how Bounty fits in with the current storyline. Nor can I really talk about the great character development that Bounty afforded the team. In fact, the only thing I can find to talk about is how bad it is. So, I'll stop. Oh, who am I kidding? I can't stop yet. Doors that slam shut at the push of a button, a patented Krusty the Clown hand buzzer that knocks a guy out after we get to delightfully watch his head bob around, and bad guys shoving other bad guys into broom closests all help Bounty to convey its utter crappiness. And let's not forget the stellar performances of the guest characters in this one. Cam's bumbling friend, all the inept bounty hunters, the stereotypical high school flunkies, and, yes, even Mitchell's remarkably uninteresting or unique family all highlight the mediocrity of this script.

After a handful of episodes wherein the character has grown and been used to great effect, Vala here is again reduced to simple slapstick comedy. There's no real depth behind her words or actions, save in the quick scene where she mentions Tomin with melancholy. It's the worst kind of regression, with the writers ineptly falling back on a character's barest traits and totally ignoring any growth that may have been achieved through previous experiences. For a better look at the writers performing similar criminal acts, see Rodney Mckay on Atlantis, who often exhibits similar bouts of develoment followed by regression.

This was supposed to be a Mitchell episode, but I kind of think that Vala stole most of "his" scenes from him. There's almost no interaction between Cam and his parents, or between Cam and Daryl. The best stuff in the episode for Mitchell was between him and Amy, but even that never aspired to be more than the worst kind of cliche. I'm glad that there's the hope of something more there for Mitchell as I think it would help develop his character some, but I'm also astoundingly certain that it will never, ever come up again. Go figure. Overall, I expected Cam to be front and center more in this.

I briefly mentioned Sam, Daniel, and Teal'c above, and now I find there's little else to say. I find such scant use of so many characters criminal, and am left dumbfounded at how little work the actors have to do sometimes. I suppose in some wholly mercenary way, this is the sweetest deal imaginable for Amanda Tapping, Michael Shanks, and Chris Judge.

I hate that Beau Bridges can't, even after two years on the show, come anywhere close to saying "Goa'uld" correctly. And Landry continues to be the most incompetant commander ever created. "Yeah, Colonel, there's a pack of bounty hunters after you. What's that, you can't hear me? Eh, nevermind then. You have a good time." I'm shocked that he even bothered to hurry SG-1 along to save the day. Backup is not Landry's usual M.O.

Ultimately, I can't fathom a worse indictment of TPTB's ability to produce 20 quality episodes in a season than Bounty. This is the point where I once again express my abundant joy at SG-1's end as a weekly series, and it's move to a less quantitative, but hopefully higher quality format. I don't think the concept is dead and I do think that the writers, especially Cooper and Wright, are capable of producing great stuff centered on SG-1. But I've almost no confidence left in anyone else. Mitchell didn't deserve to have yet another atrocious episode pinned to his character, yet here it is. I feel sorry for everyone involved.

ETA: I forgot about the hand waving of the whole event, including Asgard beaming tech, rings, personal shields, and ray guns. I imagine this was something akin to The Dead Parrot Sketch. So, General Landry sent in a bunch of goons to strongarm the guests into signing nondisclosure agreements. Right, good one. That definitely solves that.

So...are you saying you didn't like it?

I think comedy episodes are always a bit hit and miss; if someone finds it funny then the flaws of the episode are forgiven more readily; if someone doesn't then the flaws are more evident. And it admittedly had a lot of flaws;

I do think the story had a structure and a plot; cliche ridden and lacking in surprises though it was. I'm not a fan of the Lucien Alliance; they've never gelled as an enemy and I agree with you over the whole releasing of the bounty hunter - I was 'huh?' I wondered what the heck this was doing after The Shroud in terms of production airing and it had no place in the overall arc beyond killing Netan and hopefully concluding the LA sub-arc.

I personally no longer worry about the believability of the existence of the programme remaining secret to the general public since

Spoiler:

they beamed a whole building away in EDM

but accept this story added to that whole debate.

I accepted that Vala was going to be used primarily for comic effect, HATED the Daisy Duke outfit, and was surprised actually that she got a couple of good 'real' moments, one with Daryl about Tomin and one with Cam's parents at the end. But I also found her funny especially with Cam's Mom and I agree she did steal the show from Mitchell. Mitchell got his back-story put on-screen and a girl friend but little actual character development...unless one counts getting a girl friend...

I also didn't mind Sam/Teal'c/Daniel taking second chair on this one...Sam's had a good couple of episodes recently as has Daniel and I sincerely hope Teal'c will get something before the end of S10. What warmed my heart was seeing the three oldies blocked together in scenes and riding to rescue their newer team mates.

I'm personally with you on Landry being an incompetent SGC leader; I'm not a fan.

So having said all that, I actually thought it was OK, amusing enough and funny in places. I probably enjoyed it say as much as Urgo comedy wise. Possibly out of the S10 episodes since The Quest this would be the one I would most likely not to choose to watch again but I'm still giving the prize for the worst ep overall to Insiders.

[Dutch_Razor]

The Daniel hunter scene owned, that bus was really unexpected

[Tukka]

That reminded me of the first Final Destination movie

Hey I got the same feeling!
I liked this ep, it was differend, and nice to watch.
Hard to express my self now, but anyway. Just cool!

[Pitry]

I personally no longer worry about the believability of the existence of the programme remaining secret to the general public since

Spoiler:

they beamed a whole building away in EDM

but accept this story added to that whole debate.

I kind of hope that by the end of movie 2 they will reveal the existance of the Stargat eprogramme to the general public, TBH. They wanted to do so in Lost City and changed it when they realised SG1 would continue with SGA. Now that this isn't the case, I hop they'll finally solve all those annoying little nitpicks and just show the SGC revealed...

[golfbooy]

Question. Is their a single episode you do like? You pretty much say thatSG-1 has had 200 crap episodes, so why the hell do you even watch? landry is far from a incompetant comander he is in fact a great comander and Landry is not the only one who has a problem sayin goa'uld corectly. TPTB have done a great job in coming up with 20 solid eps a year.

Ha, ha. Nope, I don't like a single episode of the show; they're all trash. And I believe it's 214 crap episodes, now that I think about it. And I watch so that I can write posts like that one about Bounty, all in the hope of truly ruining your day. I'm so delighted that it's finally worked after ten years that I can hardly contain my joy. Thank'ee, for validating a decade of effort.

Orignally Posted by spaceangel
Anyway, I can't feel sorry for finding this a delightful episode.

Crap, foiled again! At least I got Mitchell82. I'm sure he feels bad enough for both of you.

In all seriousness, this post isn't about you. It's not designed to make anyone feel badly about themselves or their convictions (which could apparently be a little stronger). It's all about me. Stargate is all about me. These posts I write on this board, they're all about me, too. They say a whole lot about me, Golfbooy, and not much about anyone else who posts here. Think me an ass, think me grossly arrogant, think me unjust, think me a fool (one of Shakespeare's, preferably). But please, think only of me.

SG-1 has always been pretty self-referential...

I agree. But I didn't get a feeling of self-reference here. Here, I feel like the writers wrote a terrible script, knew it was terrible, and threw it at the audience anyway. In fact, when spoilers for this episode first came out, there was a large enough outcry that they released spoilers for The Shroud in an attempt to divert attention and quell the discontent. There would have been NO indication at all of Daniel's turn as a prior if Bounty hadn't created such an immediate firestorm of criticism. The self-referencing charm of past comedic episodes, of Urgo, Window of Opportunity, The Other Guys, or especially 200, isn't to be found in Bounty. It's humor as a cover for poor quality, not as an accoutrement.

Originally Posted by suse
While I agree with much of golfbooy's assessment I'm a bit more mellow about it.

I'm mellow. But I was also once such a fan of the show to really care about it. I cared (and still do) enough to fritter away my time at an online forum about it. I can't think of a stronger recommendation of my appreciation for, if not the present, at least the past of yesteryear. Much to the dismay of some, I believe you'd be hard-pressed to find a bigger fan of Stargate SG-1 than me, and I could tell you all the reasons why I've been so, too. But I won't. You'll just have to take my word for it.

[spaceangel]

Looks at golfbooy's post
Looks at this one



Golfbooy wasn't being hard on fans, he didn't mention them at all in that context. I get the feeling that you are taking Golfbooy's comments about the episode personally. If you want to take offence at golfbooy's not liking the episode and wanting SG-1 to live up to it's previous standards as he sees it, then go right ahead but don't bring it onto the forum. It's not about you, it's about the episode.

Golfbooy mentions RDA in context of him not allowing juvenile junk like this get on the screen (my abbreviated interpretation). He also mentions he doesn't like how Beau can't seem to pronounce Goa'uld properly after 2 years and he doesn't like it. To me it seems a fair enough expectation for a professional actor to be able to pronounce a simple word like Goa'uld; three syllables "goo a uld", it isn't that difficult. I don't see that as being too hard on the actors, is that what you are referring to?

You also might try to get your quotes correct, you substituted actor in an instance where golfbooy used character.

Nobody asked you to feel sorry for liking this episode, how did someone expressing their opinion of an episode become about you??? As for your meal choices, well one would hope that you are adult enough to realise that everyone will not make the same choices as you and respect that.

Well thanks for setting me straight on that one. I don't see how any of my comments merit such a snippy retort but maybe I'd feel more chastised if it was golfbooy doing the response. How come you can make such a personal attack on me but I can't mention my own preferences in what I considered to be a pretty mild way.
On second thoughts, there's no need to answer that. I don't really care. I will not enter into any further discussion on this matter.

[spaceangel]

When I said 'self-referential' I meant that there are many instances when SG-1 makes knowing references to it's own fallabilities or to its nature as TV rather that RL. I was thinking about Carter humming the theme tune in the lift, or Jack saying that Teal'c was not a Jaffa he just played one on TV. There are many others. This is the opposite of self=reverence.
I just thought I'd clear that up.
As for the idea of 'getting' another poster, I thought this was the place to express opinions and have semi-mature debate. If I'd realised there was another game being played I would have written a different post.

Oh well.

[meredithchandler73]

I'm slightly afraid to post here! Let me just say that everyone has their own opinions and I don't *think* that someone who thoroughly dislikes this episode - finds it stupid, illogical, whatever - is attacking the people that do like this episode.

Can't we all just get along?

That being said, I really enjoyed this episode. And these are my thoughts - in no particular order:
--I liked that most of the team were off doing their own thing. (As someone else mentioned - sorta reminded me of Sunday on SGA.)
--I loved all of Vala's different looks and outfits in this ep. It would be just like her to go away for a weekend and pack 20 outfits, don't you think? Someone mentioned Vala's black dress being similar to Sam's in TRNT. Why can't we find an excuse to have both of these women looking beautiful in the same scene? Not that they aren't always beautiful. You know what I mean.
--Liked seeing Cam get flustered around Amy. The falling out of the chair was just perfect.
--More Vala appreciation. I just loved her interaction with everyone - from begging Cam to bring her to the reunion, to talking to Cam's parents and then his friend Daryl. And I loved that she brought up her husband Tomin. She definitely had real feelings for him and still thinks about him. Awwwww.
--Sam's look after Dr. Lee starts talking to the girls eyeing him was priceless.
--I liked seeing so many different races represented in the bounty hunt.
--Daniel's Scooby-Doo reference ROCKED.

One thing that got me scratching my head - how much of what Vala has said about her past is the truth? If we believe everything she says about her past (except where she tells Cam's folks that they've been having lots of sex), then she was sold into slavery when she was still in school and she has been married a few times. When does this fit in with her having a fiancé and becoming host to a Gou'ald? I am also remembering Vala's first appearance - Prometheus Unbound. She told Daniel that she was stealing the ship because she needed it to relocate her people to save them from Ba'al - who has been going back to worlds that used to belong to Camulus. That wasn't true. She was supposed to trade the Al'kesh for naquida.

Anyway, lots of really fun moments.

[ixoy]

Actually agree with goofboy's comments - thought this was a very poor episode with the humour off the mark generally. There seemed a fair few scenes (and shots) that had poor pacing, with the characters seeming to stand there pointlessly as if waiting for the director to yell "Cut".

Oh well - did anyone else catch the name on the board beside Mitchell when he was on the payphone? It was Damian Kindler (well clearly meant to be - some of the letters were cut off). Mildly amusing!

[spaceangel]

[QUOTE=meredithchandler73;6301104]I'm slightly afraid to post here! Let me just say that everyone has their own opinions and I don't *think* that someone who thoroughly dislikes this episode - finds it stupid, illogical, whatever - is attacking the people that do like this episode.

Can't we all just get along?

I apologise if I made you feel uncomfortable. Post away!

[the dancer of spaz]

While I agree with much of golfbooy's assessment I'm a bit more mellow about it. I've lowered my expectations to expect something just above drivel (storywise). So I'm not usually disappointed much. And can even find amusement where I'd have ... not ... before. I do still have a bit of melancoly for the "good ol' days" when I could expect more though. Ity's been a tough adjustment

suse

I'm in the same category. My expectations have lowered since Avalon Part 2 (and certainly after The Ties That Bind), which is why I found myself re-reading my review of Bounty in shock. When I first read the sides and spoilers last summer, I thought that there was no way I'd even remotely find this episode entertaining.

Sadly, since then, after the announcement that this is the last season, I've kinda found myself taking what we get and finding the good in it - whatever little that may be.

I rarely watch original episodes anymore (though that'll probably change), and it might just be because TPTB effectively closed a door on that chapter of Stargate a looooong time ago. If I don't actively look for what was, and I focus on what is, I won't have these inflated expectations of what could be.