Vala: What did they do to her!?

[esoap524]

I think some of the changes--less innuendo, more understanding and care for her fellow beings--is good. I agree with you, though, on the parts you don't like--namely the "little girl" stuff. Vala was so damned cool in Prometheus Unbound. I didn't even mind the leather clad thief who walked through the gate, and I certainly understand the change brought about by being the mother of super baby (there could even an element of guilt, possibly).

I don't like the little girl stuff. I think Vala usually works much better without Daniel around. That aside, though, I've had the chance to see the next three season 10 episodes--11, 12 and 13. Yeah, the pigtails are still there but she's not as dependent and there are some darned good scenes in Quest 2 between Daniel and Vala, and mitchell and Vala.

I'm hoping we get more of this and less of the other as the show gets a little more heavy duty serious/arc thing. i don't mind the humor at all--I usually think she's pretty funny but I don't like the stupid, girly stuff, unless it's for show to manipulate certain situations.

For the record, I love Claudia Black too; she's the reason I jumped on this SG1 wagon. they distanced Vala from Aeryn the minute she stepped onto the screen--or, should I say, she did. And as shabbily as the character is sometimes written, I shudder to think of what a lesser actress might have done with it.

having seen the "future", though, I have to say these first three have been the best since the "new" incarnation of SG1. Everyone seems very comfortable in their roles and with each other.

ETA: Oh, just read the "nerd" theory. LOL--that would have been awesome. And a very big departure from her Farscape character who was known more for her firepower and big time emotional issues vs her intellectual prowess.

[sueKay]

I much prefer Vala now compared to the Vala we saw in S9

[ShardsofGlass]

I can't stand Vala now. She's a whimpering little girl who is just annoying. I can't figure out what she's doing on the team. And I miss the smart thief from last season.

[Mitchell82]

I agree that the Vala of season 9 was a lot of fun, and while that version of her was what got me interested in SG-1 in the first place, I'm glad for the changes. Like other people have said, she couldn't have remained the same person she was if she wanted to join the team...it would get old real quick. It also created a more antagonistic relationship with the team that she simply couldn't have as a bonafide member (not to mention that they could never trust her if she was still a thief).

Overall, I don't think the current version of Vala is too different from the original one. There were episodes/scenes where we saw some of the Vala we see today (specifically) in "The Powers That Be." There was a distinctly more vulnerable side to her character there, and I think they just amped that up a little more this season.

She's still strong, resourceful, and smart....just not with the overexaggerated behaviors she was exhibiting earlier. She's matured, found that she's not alone (both because of her place in SG-1 and because of Tomin). I know for many people, they only started liking Vala (or found her tolerable) after she started settling into SG-1 this season, after she became a human character rather than a caricature.

As for the school girl look, I'm not overly fond of it. It does bring down her maturity a bit but I think they were trying to maintain the character's somewhat playful nature, and that decidedly non-militaristic hairstyle suited that purpose.

-Stef

I agree with everything you said including the schoolgirl thing. They were just toneing her down though IMO so it didnt bother me too much. I love Vala and really missed her in RNT.

[unknown.entity]

I must admit, after watching "The Road Not Taken", I am starting to find Vala's constant child-like portrayal annoying and very unrealistic to the nature of the show. Sure, occasionally it may add some quick entertainment or humour to a particular scene, but now they're starting to overdo it. It's not cute or funny anymore, it's just stupid.

[Mitchell82]

I must admit, after watching "The Road Not Taken", I am starting to find Vala's constant child-like portrayal annoying and very unrealistic to the nature of the show. Sure, occasionally it may add some quick entertainment or humour to a particular scene, but now they're starting to overdo it. It's not cute or funny anymore, it's just stupid.

Funny I loved her brief scene in "Road Not Taken". I thought it was nice how she showed Carter how much she missed her.

[iheartvala]

I agree, I thought if at all, The Road Not Taken showed Vala as an adult member of the team who was genuinely concerned for her team mate and friend. I don't see anything childlike in that at all. hmm, weird.

[Amanda Eros]

My reply would sound something like this...

In the early episodes, Teal'c was a very one-dimensional charcter. He should never in a billion years be allowed to run around an American military facility. Because he has killed hundreds, he probably ordered millions of people to die, he cheated his old bosses, he kidnapped people from the SGC in the first episode. "But he's fun, so all of that is okay."

Admittedly, Teal'c was never created to be a recurring character first and *then* to become a regular. But he had to soften his image as well. Now he's a teddy bear. If the series had shown more of his life before he joined SG-1, his change would sound as miraculous as Vala's. If we're honest, all we have for Teal'c isn't even "oh he went though so much, it's okay he did all of those bad things." The writers only gave him some piece of doubt in "Children of the Gods" and "Threshold", and that's it. And they made him stop being all violent and tributary because the story wouldn't work any other way.

With all of this, I want to say: For a military story to work, there isn't much leeway for the writers to have "bad" people as regulars, because the military regulations wouldn't allow for that. So former bad people have to change. Who changes them? the writers.

The writers are only doing a bad job if they can't give a reasonably explanation for the change. In the case of Vala, I'd argue she was given more than enough reason, even if it sounds very much like "with all she has been through..."

At least with Teal'c he was put into solitary confinement for an extended period of time until he had earned the right to move to a VIP room. Teal'c was a solider that was able to take orders, and followed those orders from Jack. Teal'c respected Jack enough to not make him look bad. He knew his place. His crimes were not against Earth. Apophis was the one that kidnaped that one woman, and Teal'c was following orders. Teal’c was a slave. He disobeys orders and dies. Plus, he hardly ever left the SGC while living on Earth except for that one episode where the crystal took over Jack's memories and then later in season six. He didn’t get to get an apartment until season eight!

Prior to Teal'c coming to the SGC, he worked for Apophis who was his god. That was the culture he was brought up in. He slowly started to feel that belief was wrong, and the first opportunity presented he changed sides. He felt that what he was doing would benefit his family and people one day. He became a freedom fighter.

Teal'c and Vala are two completely different characters with two completely different background stories and personalities they really should not be compared.

[sgeureka]

At least with Teal'c he was put into solitary confinement for an extended period of time until he had earned the right to move to a VIP room. Teal'c was a solider that was able to take orders, and followed those orders from Jack. Teal'c respected Jack enough to not make him look bad. He knew his place. His crimes were not against Earth. Apophis was the one that kidnaped that one woman, and Teal'c was following orders. Teal’c was a slave. He disobeys orders and dies. Plus, he hardly ever left the SGC while living on Earth except for that one episode where the crystal took over Jack's memories and then later in season six. He didn’t get to get an apartment until season eight!

Prior to Teal'c coming to the SGC, he worked for Apophis who was his god. That was the culture he was brought up in. He slowly started to feel that belief was wrong, and the first opportunity presented he changed sides. He felt that what he was doing would benefit his family and people one day. He became a freedom fighter.

Teal'c and Vala are two completely different characters with two completely different background stories and personalities they really should not be compared.

You're absolutely right (although I could delve into some aspects of your post, but that would be off-topic). I wasn't even trying to compare the two characters. I was trying to make the point that the negative feeling some audience members have about Vala is not necessarily so much the writers' fault/incompetence but their own expectations without taking into account what (a) needs to be done in a story arc** and (b) what has already been done in similar story arcs in the past.

I just remember some mindless anti-Jonas forum member at gateworld some years ago, who could/would not accept that aliens can be part of SG-1, and he went on and on about how Jonas shouldn't even be able to speak English as an alien etc., and how TPTB are too stupid to realize that. Until someone (I?) pointed out that all he was saying was complete rubbish if you took the Teal'c character into account.

So, I'll stand by what I said earlier. Given Vala's backstory, and how other characters with questionable backstories have been treated on the show or on the SG-1 team, Vala is well within reasonable limits. Her time in the Ori galaxy provided her with an attitude change that's IMO so believable that the writers could build on that to include her in the SG-1 team. Sassy-early-S9 Vala could not have achieved that, but the writers have also got to be careful not to ignore her essence and make her a pet dog.

**Whether telling a certain story arc at all or not is a completely different matter.

[Mitchell82]

I agree, I thought if at all, The Road Not Taken showed Vala as an adult member of the team who was genuinely concerned for her team mate and friend. I don't see anything childlike in that at all. hmm, weird.

Different tastes different people. Oh well I loved it too and here it is and I truly think it's just sweet.

Spoiler:

[fastfoodninja]

I think Vala has been written very well this season, and far from being changed from her original concept, she's as smart as ever.

As a character, she's smart but impulsive, sexy yet aloof. I think too much is made of her innuendo in Seasons 8 and 9. Sure, she tells Daniel, "We could have just had sex." But then she slugs him. She was (very wisely) exploiting a typical male weakness and distracting him. It resulted in him taking quite a few licks before he captured her. It doesn't mean she's a slut, it means she's aware of the effect she has as an attractive woman, and uses it to her advantage.

Considering how paranoid other characters are about her, and her own nature as a thief/former gu'ould host, she has likely gone quite a long time without having any close friends or relationships. What she has with Daniel (and the rest of the SG-1 team) has grown into mutual respect and trust, something she's unfamiliar with, but clearly likes.

As she is prone to, she rushes in where angels fear to tread and overcompensates. They started to like her more and treat her like one of them when she helped people and tried to be good. So she makes herself extra-good, hoping they'll like her more. And being unfamiliar with Earth customs, she gets it a little wrong. Hence the cutesy, I'm-an-innocent-girl act. She's afraid of losing her new family. Eventually, she will realize it's not working and not needed, and we'll probably see a balancing of her current and former selves.

[BewareofthePhil]

I don't MIND her "girly" face now, since she's been through a lot and led a "normal" life in the Ori galaxy for the best part of a year, plus she's got to live with all the stuff her Goa'uld did whilst posessing her body. It's probably as much a way of escape from her past as anything, a new Vala.

Having said that, I'd love to see a little more Vala/Daniel conflict. There's been relatively little of that this season.

[Petros]

Wow, I started quite the discussion on my first post.

Someone earlier said that Teal'c had become cuddly like a teddy bear, that I could understand given that they showed the development a little better. Although at time I miss seeing Teal'c seriously kick ass with a staff weapon.

Saying this may get my face bashed in but I think the Ori are better villains than the Goa'uld, they're a threat on a much larger scale than they're villanous predecessors. However the way the team has acted in these last two series has kinda been like a parody of itself at times. The Ori are a more serious threat and I kinda hoped at the start of Season Nine that this would kind of be a return to a more serious hard-hitting SG-1 show like it was when it reached it's prime.

There's been a lot of lacking in old allies and old enemies too, it's been all too much about the Ori, I know what I'm saying is somewhat contratictory but they Asgard have barley shown up in SG-1 and have you seen the Tok'ra once since Jacob Carter/Selmak died?

I like Teal'c being a lot softer than he was, but that development took years and wasn't all that great a change. Wheras with Vala is was like, one episode she's a sexy vixen, the next BAM! She's "preadolscent teen"! The change in Teal'c was not only longer but he still remained Teal'c deep down. That's what character development is, still having that main core of the character deep down. Like Daniel no longer is such a nerdy geek but he's now more serious and a little militarised but he still gets all exicted when he finds out new arhaelogical things, believe me, I study archaeolgy, I know that look on someone's face.

What I'm trying to say here is that whilst Vala's change was nessiscary, they completely warped her character over night without even showing us really into how it happened. They turned her character on her head changing her very core. She's the complete antithesis of what she used to be.

I just feel that Vala's extreme change was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. With the lack of any of the old SG-1, the should be dark and serious with the new villains but instead, it's kinda become a little bit of a mockery of itself, which I suppose is natural for a series that's been on so long, it's happened to alot of the greats out there e.g. Friends.

PS: I can't help the long posts, it's in my nature.

[Stef]

I must admit, after watching "The Road Not Taken", I am starting to find Vala's constant child-like portrayal annoying and very unrealistic to the nature of the show. Sure, occasionally it may add some quick entertainment or humour to a particular scene, but now they're starting to overdo it. It's not cute or funny anymore, it's just stupid.

Yes, but look at her in "Line In the Sand" or "The Quest Pt 2," for that matter. Sure, Vala was "sweet" (I wouldn't say "childish") in the little snippet she was in, but look at the maturity and intelligence she displayed when talking with Tomin in "Line in the Sand." Or even look at her in "The Quest Pt 2" when dealing with her fear for Daniel. Then go back and look at episodes like "Momento Mori," "Counterstrike," or "Crusade." She isn't a one-note character. In my opinion, she's displayed several distinctly different traits in these last three episodes alone. She's not just the playful version all of the time, there's more to her than that.

Of course, that's not saying that there aren't episodes where they play up the comical side to her characer a little too much (ie "The Quest Pt 1"). I'll admit, there have been times when I wish they would tone down the clown act, but that hasn't happened much and certainly not in the new episodes. To even try to edit out that side of her would be like neutering the character.

Besides....I liked the hug between her and Sam (and it looked like Sam appreciated it ).

-Stef

[Mitchell82]

I think Vala has been written very well this season, and far from being changed from her original concept, she's as smart as ever.

As a character, she's smart but impulsive, sexy yet aloof. I think too much is made of her innuendo in Seasons 8 and 9. Sure, she tells Daniel, "We could have just had sex." But then she slugs him. She was (very wisely) exploiting a typical male weakness and distracting him. It resulted in him taking quite a few licks before he captured her. It doesn't mean she's a slut, it means she's aware of the effect she has as an attractive woman, and uses it to her advantage.

Considering how paranoid other characters are about her, and her own nature as a thief/former gu'ould host, she has likely gone quite a long time without having any close friends or relationships. What she has with Daniel (and the rest of the SG-1 team) has grown into mutual respect and trust, something she's unfamiliar with, but clearly likes.

As she is prone to, she rushes in where angels fear to tread and overcompensates. They started to like her more and treat her like one of them when she helped people and tried to be good. So she makes herself extra-good, hoping they'll like her more. And being unfamiliar with Earth customs, she gets it a little wrong. Hence the cutesy, I'm-an-innocent-girl act. She's afraid of losing her new family. Eventually, she will realize it's not working and not needed, and we'll probably see a balancing of her current and former selves.

She has been written very well and very interested to see how her character is written in the last 7 eps and 2 movies.