S10: Critique & Contemplation

[Skydiver]

teh frat regs are written deliberately vague
Jack giving sam a ride to work every single day would lead to feelings of favoritism from the other team members and start rumors.

daniel rooming with jack for months on end would do the same thing.

the regs are written to back up those that see an issue, yet allow leeway for those that don't

any commanding officer (like hammy over jack) can choose to look the other way. He's just gotta know that, if jack screws up and does something bad, hammond will have to testify 'yep, i knew about it and chose not to take action' so hammy would be blamed

which is often why CO's don't want to officially know. 'don't make me need to know' etc.

don't behave in such a way that i have to notice and i won't notice and i won't care

[EvenstarSRV]

I agree, at least in principle of what you're trying to say. But then again, it depends on the particular situation. Is it two girls? Best buddies? Even if it's a male-female dynamic, there's still no rule saying they can't go for drinks after work. Whether that will stir up rumors or not is another issue altogether. That's what I meant by the quality of the working environment. But frat regs don't forbid friendships.

I agree, and as Skydiver said, it'd probably become more of an issue if it happened on a constant basis. Like going out for drinks after work occasionally is probably ok, but not everyday. Same with giving rides, rooming together and such.

But you said, the type of working environment and the type of commander likely is a factor, and a highly classified project like the SGC could be more lenient on the issue than a conventional Air Force base.

[slurredspeech]

I agree, and as Skydiver said, it'd probably become more of an issue if it happened on a constant basis. Like going out for drinks after work occasionally is probably ok, but not everyday. Same with giving rides, rooming together and such.

Gotta love the vague, right?

But you said, the type of working environment and the type of commander likely is a factor, and a highly classified project like the SGC could be more lenient on the issue than a conventional Air Force base.

You know, that's what I often wonder about. I'm pretty familiar with how your 'regular' (= not contractually obliged to drive a meteor through Earth) military works but if there was such a thing as SGC would it in fact give more leeway or inforce the existing rules with that much more force? Honestly, it could go either way if you think about it, though I'm more partial to your statement simply because it's convenient because it would appear that way. Not talking about Sam-Jack or Sam-any male team member here, but simply other things they'd gotten away with over the years (pre S9 as well as later). Someone mentioned earlier the fixedness of teams for such a long period of time, and that would be a pretty good (and non-controversial) example.

[Crazedwraith]

What annoyed me more were things like him not forgiving Woolsey in Prototype, his attitude in the Shroud and Bad Guys, and his treatment towards Vala in Company of Thieves, Family Ties, and especially Unending.

You mean yelling at her or sleeping with her? I found that scene hilarious in the way it portrayed Daniel as being in the wrong and as insensitive jerk when really I agreed with him 100%.

Being optimistic and kind and all that rubbish doesn't have to mean you have to let people walk all over you.

[RealmOfX]

Carpooling breaks the regs?!?!

If it's *just* them? I can see it. Relationships (and I don't means "ships") develop during that time. It just doesn't look good. Now if several of them did it? Safety in numbers...

Is it a written rule? I doubt it, but it would come down to spending non-work time together.

Someone call JenniferJF.

suse

Guidlines and policies yep, specific rules no. However things like Shared Activities are specifically mentioned in that they CAN BE deemed unprofessional (not a categoric ARE unprofessional).

(I'm not shouting just highlighting the different emphasis)

From the Air Force instructions -
"Sharing living accommodations, vacations, transportation, and off-duty interests on a frequent or recurring basis can be, or can reasonably be perceived to be, unprofessional."

[suse]

Guidlines and policies yep, specific rules no. However things like Shared Activities are specifically mentioned in that they CAN BE deemed unprofessional (not a categoric ARE unprofessional).

(I'm not shouting just highlighting the different emphasis)

From the Air Force instructions -
"Sharing living accommodations, vacations, transportation, and off-duty interests on a frequent or recurring basis can be, or can reasonably be perceived to be, unprofessional."

Thanks Duckie.

I've been watching way too much NCIS.

suse

[Skydiver]

so, in english : every once in a while, no one will likely care, on a constant basis, people will talk. and once people talk, commanding officers are obligated to notice

[Allie_Kreek]

What annoyed me more were things like him not forgiving Woolsey in Prototype, his attitude in the Shroud and Bad Guys, and his treatment towards Vala in Company of Thieves, Family Ties, and especially Unending.

THE SHROUD!!! Wooo! Yeah!!!! I'm not celebrating the episode! I'm celebrating the fact that I hated that episode and forgot the name of it and now I know it again I can spend the next few hours forgetting it again. (Suse, it's called the Shroud!!!!!)

I did not like the Shroud. First time I watched it I thought it was nice having Jack and Daniel banter but after a second watch Daniel's attitude starts to grate. Jack is doing what Jack is supposed to do (Jackisms) and Daniel is doing what he should not be doing (attempting Jackisms). It just doesn't work. Plus I'm still not completely in favour of Teal'c having hair...


And as for Unending... wtf???

[Mandysg1]

THE SHROUD!!! Wooo! Yeah!!!! I'm not celebrating the episode! I'm celebrating the fact that I hated that episode and forgot the name of it and now I know it again I can spend the next few hours forgetting it again. (Suse, it's called the Shroud!!!!!)

I did not like the Shroud. First time I watched it I thought it was nice having Jack and Daniel banter but after a second watch Daniel's attitude starts to grate. Jack is doing what Jack is supposed to do (Jackisms) and Daniel is doing what he should not be doing (attempting Jackisms). It just doesn't work. Plus I'm still not completely in favour of Teal'c having hair...


And as for Unending... wtf???

Um, don't worry... it never happened

[suse]

Um, don't worry... it never happened

<<spew>>

suse

[Petra]

Especially when it seemed liked it was supported in canon with Mitchell saying in Uninvited, I think, that he didn't really command Daniel or Teal'c because they were civilians. That line just confused me, because I didn't think it was ever a question that Jack could command Daniel and Teal'c (and Jonas) when he was SG-1 CO.

It confused me as well. And when you think about it in the first 8 seasons it was never an issue, for anybody. In "Spirits" Sam was congratulated on her "first command" even though at the time she commanded only Daniel (civilian) and Teal'c (alien). The same situation lasted throughout season 8 and nobody said "But Sam wasn't really in command because the guys weren't military". Okay, some people, defending Mitchell's "right" to lead did, but their complaint was more along the lines of "Sam wasn't shown to lead so apparently she wasn't that good" Furthermore both Daniel and Teal'c served ocasionally on other SG teams; so are we supposed to believe COs of those teams weren't in command of them either?

One thing that saddens me about seasons 9-10 is how I felt the Daniel character changed from what I'd seen in the previous seasons. Daniel had quickly become one of my favorite characters when I started watching, and what I probably liked best about him was his sincerity, empathy, and ability to forgive. I felt like we saw little of that in S9-10, and it did feel like quite of bit of that was in reaction to Vala. It wasn't my cup of tea either.

While I loved seasons 1-6 Daniel I started having some issues with him right at the beginning of season 7 but seasons 9-10 were what it took to turn me off his character completely. What's worse they now taint how I view Daniel in earlier seasons

It always cracked me up when i'd see slash fans using the regs to say why sam and jack is bad and evil but say that daniel is exempt from the regs, no, he's not. He's just as subject to them as she is.

the only difference is, jack and sam could both be courtmartialed but if it was jack and daniel, jack would be courtmartialed and daniel would just be fired and lose his security clearance

Really? Thanks for sharing, I had no idea..so does anybody know how slashers respond to this? I'm just curious.

[Skydiver]

depends.

usually I'm just told that i have no idea what i'm talking about, they're right and sam and jack destroyed the show as did the writers with their pathetic attempt to force sam and jack together in defiance to the complete and total jack/daniel chemistry

[Petra]

depends.

usually I'm just told that i have no idea what i'm talking about, they're right and sam and jack destroyed the show as did the writers with their pathetic attempt to force sam and jack together in defiance to the complete and total jack/daniel chemistry

Sounds familiar..

[EvenstarSRV]

You know, that's what I often wonder about. I'm pretty familiar with how your 'regular' (= not contractually obliged to drive a meteor through Earth) military works but if there was such a thing as SGC would it in fact give more leeway or inforce the existing rules with that much more force? Honestly, it could go either way if you think about it, though I'm more partial to your statement simply because it's convenient because it would appear that way. Not talking about Sam-Jack or Sam-any male team member here, but simply other things they'd gotten away with over the years (pre S9 as well as later). Someone mentioned earlier the fixedness of teams for such a long period of time, and that would be a pretty good (and non-controversial) example.

Aside from the definite convenience for the show, I am inclined to think that more specialized divisions of the military would likely get more leeway with enforcing the rules. Like with the teams, since it likely requires a more specific training process for SGC recruits, the pool for new members is probably smaller than at other operations. And I'd think a smaller pool of candidates would mean that teams that should get new members maybe can't.

You mean yelling at her or sleeping with her? I found that scene hilarious in the way it portrayed Daniel as being in the wrong and as insensitive jerk when really I agreed with him 100%.

Being optimistic and kind and all that rubbish doesn't have to mean you have to let people walk all over you.

I think Daniel had every right to ream out Vala for her treatment of him, though it made me wonder why he'd never done it before. But what I objected to was him then turning on a dime and sleeping with her entirely on his terms. And the normally irrepressible Vala, who can make a quip before getting burned alive, not saying a single word in response to his rant.

THE SHROUD!!! Wooo! Yeah!!!! I'm not celebrating the episode! I'm celebrating the fact that I hated that episode and forgot the name of it and now I know it again I can spend the next few hours forgetting it again. (Suse, it's called the Shroud!!!!!)

Heh, sorry for reminding you.

I did not like the Shroud. First time I watched it I thought it was nice having Jack and Daniel banter but after a second watch Daniel's attitude starts to grate. Jack is doing what Jack is supposed to do (Jackisms) and Daniel is doing what he should not be doing (attempting Jackisms). It just doesn't work. Plus I'm still not completely in favour of Teal'c having hair...

What I personally found disappointing with the Shroud was that, aside from the opening sermon, Daniel acted and sounded just like Daniel so I never bought that he had been converted into a Prior. So that probably intended suspenseful element of 'is Daniel good or bad' just didn't work for me, and as that seemed to be the main drama of the story, the episode as a whole was rather flat.

[Allie_Kreek]

Um, don't worry... it never happened

lol. i'm getting a little concerned with the way shows are starting to have very boring last ever episode. I think I'm going to have to do an Enterprise and disregard Unending.