S10: Critique & Contemplation

[RealmOfX]

And so it begins...

methinks we better make an "I agree to disagree" smilie

[leiasky]

And so it begins...

methinks we better make an "I agree to disagree" smilie

LOL! I think I - agree!

I don't like to contemplate much over season 10. There were a few good episodes but for the most part, I just didn't enjoy it at all.

[Mandysg1]

I think they tried to tone things down in S10 like Cam and Vala, but the problem I had with it, was it was too late. It's hard to get over those first impressions, in RL as well as on TV shows.

[RealmOfX]

I think they tried to tone things down in S10 like Cam and Vala, but the problem I had with it, was it was too late. It's hard to get over those first impressions, in RL as well as on TV shows.

I think it had more to do with that they had two caricatures rather than characters and that they had to basically break canon to bring them in the previous season so when they tried to "fix it" they had both hands tied behind their backs. Take away what some people considered the bad or annoying parts and you were basically left with nothing much to work with. The damage was done in the previous season, I think this is possibly why I intensely dislike Season 9 but think Season 10 is merely "meh".

Oh and here's the new smilie
If anyone wants to play around with it to make the background transparent or make others with different characters then feel free to snurch it. I'd do it but my eyes are not good these days and it just about killed them this morning to make this one.

<added>
never mind - I fixed it

[jckfan55]

For me, in trying to integrate the new characters they forgot about the great existing relationships to a large degree. Sam, Daniel and Teal'c have a long history and I think they could have continued to develop those relationships while adding new characters.
Cam got better in S10, but as RoX says, a lot of the damage was already done for me.

[hedwig]

My 2 cents worth on Cam being assigned to SG1 (and maybe it's only worth 2 cents, too):

For 2 years prior to walking up the ramp to the gate in the first episode of Season 9, Cam hadn't commanded anything except maybe a wheelchair and a walker. He'd been so severely injured in the battle over Antarctica that there had been doubt he'd even live, much less walk again. So he spent the majority of those 2 years learning to walk again, not commanding anything. He apparently also spent a lot of that time reading mission reports filed by SG1 (a comment of his that he'd spent a really long time in a hospital bed and those mission reports were riveting). Reading mission reports is nothing like being in those situations himself, and certainly doesn't give him experience like SG1 had in the field, going on those missions personally. Cam spent a really long time in rehabilitation, and I doubt if when he was fit for duty again that he was given a command of any kind, so how does 2 years of inactivity qualify him for command of the SGC's frontline team, over and above the 3 other members of the team who have gone on to other things (or tried to go on to other things).

Obviously, I realize that for purposes of the story, there had to be some reason to bring the 3 original members back, but putting somebody in command of them that had no clue as to how to actually lead a group like that just leaves me stumped. It's like putting Pete Pan in charge of a group of seasoned marines and telling them to tag along after him.

Really sorry if this annoys other people, but it's just my humble opinion. Plus, I eventually grew to like Cam, but not him being "leader".

[humanityspotential]

My 2 cents worth on Cam being assigned to SG1 (and maybe it's only worth 2 cents, too):

For 2 years prior to walking up the ramp to the gate in the first episode of Season 9, Cam hadn't commanded anything except maybe a wheelchair and a walker. He'd been so severely injured in the battle over Antarctica that there had been doubt he'd even live, much less walk again. So he spent the majority of those 2 years learning to walk again, not commanding anything. He apparently also spent a lot of that time reading mission reports filed by SG1 (a comment of his that he'd spent a really long time in a hospital bed and those mission reports were riveting). Reading mission reports is nothing like being in those situations himself, and certainly doesn't give him experience like SG1 had in the field, going on those missions personally. Cam spent a really long time in rehabilitation, and I doubt if when he was fit for duty again that he was given a command of any kind, so how does 2 years of inactivity qualify him for command of the SGC's frontline team, over and above the 3 other members of the team who have gone on to other things (or tried to go on to other things).

Obviously, I realize that for purposes of the story, there had to be some reason to bring the 3 original members back, but putting somebody in command of them that had no clue as to how to actually lead a group like that just leaves me stumped. It's like putting Pete Pan in charge of a group of seasoned marines and telling them to tag along after him.

Really sorry if this annoys other people, but it's just my humble opinion. Plus, I eventually grew to like Cam, but not him being "leader".

Brilliantly put!!

I really liked the character of Mitchell also but hated the fact he was in command.

That sentiment aside, the writers didn't give the character anything in the way of leadership decisions in S10 at all. No one but Vala got any character development in S10. I kept hoping that they were going to give his character something that made me think 'yeah, he belongs there' but they just left him out in the cold.

They spoiled him in the very first episode of s09 by making him and SG1 fanboy and then putting him in 'command' of the team. How can you lead people you've been looking up to and fantasizing about for 2 years? It would have worked a lot better to have the fanboy as a junior member of the team.

[Allie_Kreek]

My 2 cents worth on Cam being assigned to SG1 (and maybe it's only worth 2 cents, too):

For 2 years prior to walking up the ramp to the gate in the first episode of Season 9, Cam hadn't commanded anything except maybe a wheelchair and a walker. He'd been so severely injured in the battle over Antarctica that there had been doubt he'd even live, much less walk again. So he spent the majority of those 2 years learning to walk again, not commanding anything. He apparently also spent a lot of that time reading mission reports filed by SG1 (a comment of his that he'd spent a really long time in a hospital bed and those mission reports were riveting). Reading mission reports is nothing like being in those situations himself, and certainly doesn't give him experience like SG1 had in the field, going on those missions personally. Cam spent a really long time in rehabilitation, and I doubt if when he was fit for duty again that he was given a command of any kind, so how does 2 years of inactivity qualify him for command of the SGC's frontline team, over and above the 3 other members of the team who have gone on to other things (or tried to go on to other things).

Obviously, I realize that for purposes of the story, there had to be some reason to bring the 3 original members back, but putting somebody in command of them that had no clue as to how to actually lead a group like that just leaves me stumped. It's like putting Pete Pan in charge of a group of seasoned marines and telling them to tag along after him.

Really sorry if this annoys other people, but it's just my humble opinion. Plus, I eventually grew to like Cam, but not him being "leader".

I think this really goes back to what a few of us were saying earlier in the thread about being annoyed that Carter wasn't given command. For me, as I've said before, I was annoyed and I think if they had Carter in command and Cam as 2IC the dynamic of the team would have worked a lot better. The struggle Carter would have between being a soldier and a scientist. There would be conflict between Carter and Cam. Maybe even conflict between Carter and Jackson. Plus I think it would have been so much easier to accept Cam as a member of SG1.

[leiasky]

I think this really goes back to what a few of us were saying earlier in the thread about being annoyed that Carter wasn't given command. For me, as I've said before, I was annoyed and I think if they had Carter in command and Cam as 2IC the dynamic of the team would have worked a lot better. The struggle Carter would have between being a soldier and a scientist. There would be conflict between Carter and Cam. Maybe even conflict between Carter and Jackson. Plus I think it would have been so much easier to accept Cam as a member of SG1.

I agree. I would have loved there to be some conflict between Cam and Sam over decisions made in the field. You'd have seen how Sam had grown from the Captain looking in awe at the Stargate to a leader competent enough to now head the SGC's frontline team. Daniel would always be a nag to a military man (like Jack, and maybe to the younger version of him in Cam) so there would have been some nice conflict there. Daniel, at the outset, wouldn't have respected or trusted him like he did Jack. And then Daniel would have to get used to Sam now being in command where she used to have to follow Jack's orders.

It's a dynamic I really wish we could have seen, and felt was only a natural progression after RDA left. But, unfortunately, when he left, he took not only Jack O'Neill with him, but the reins, and believable character direction, of the production as executive producer.

[AGateFan]

First I think Carter should have been in charge, she clearly earned it over the years and it was disrespectful to the characters and the fans (not thinking we could handle it I guess). However, if they just HAD to put her out of command I would have been OK with it had they replaced her with a clearly more seasoned military officer and had given her logical side story saying why she was not in charge (having the character be slightly annoyed but professional about the demotion may have helped us fans in that case as well as we could understand the frustration and sympathized).

But what really annoyed me about Cams entrance was the stealing of General Hammond’s moment in the sun. He was the one that lead the attack over Antarctica and saved SG-1 and SG-1 was the one that saved EARTH. Cam was one soldier among many (many who died) in that battle and did nothing special but his job. Give him a purple heart for sure but MOH and his "choice of command" is ridiculously unbelievable and smacks of the worst kind of fanfic. Taking stories that would have been better suited for other long time characters (Teal'c) who were suddenly treated like so much background baggage to the new hero was also insulting.

SG-1 was about SG-1 O'Neill, Carter, Daniel and Teal'c. RDA had to leave but SG-1 should have remained about SG-1 (Carter, Daniel and Teal'c) and how they dealt with the new General and a new teammate. They should have showed everything through THEIR eyes not Cams. We should have learned to like Cam slowly like we did Jonas in S6 (they did some hard sell there but no nearly what they did with Cam). Cam could have been that fresh new face who could have helped SG-1 and then overtime we the fans could have embraced him as part of SG-1. Instead they wrote it like he WAS SG-1 and disregarded the other characters as sidekicks. Cam even treated them that way from time to time.

Cam could have worked well on the show, much better then Vala who didn’t belong on the show as anything but a Maybourn like Anti-hero. It didn’t help so much that they seemingly re-wrote the Daniel character either..... but those are statements for another time.

[Allie_Kreek]

Cam could have worked well on the show, much better then Vala who didn’t belong on the show as anything but a Maybourn like Anti-hero. It didn’t help so much that they seemingly re-wrote the Daniel character either..... but those are statements for another time.

It is like someone (sorry but I don't remember who) said the Vala character was really just the stereotypical spacebabe. It is a shame because CB is a very good actress who could have done so much more then standing around making snippy comments, moaning about her nails and twirling her chewing gum.

How do you people feel about the Ori storyline?

[leiasky]

How do you people feel about the Ori storyline?

I didn't like it, but I can't explain exactly why. It might have been more enjoyabale if the character situation hadn't seemed forced. Because once they started tossing the unbelievable at me, (read above) my mind just shut down and I probably didn't give the actual storyline as a whole the chance. As someone else said as well, I REALLY disliked season 9, by the time Season 10 rolled around I just wasn't interested anymore. It had been ruined for me.

[Alan]

It is like someone (sorry but I don't remember who) said the Vala character was really just the stereotypical spacebabe. It is a shame because CB is a very good actress who could have done so much more then standing around making snippy comments, moaning about her nails and twirling her chewing gum.

How do you people feel about the Ori storyline?

Didn't like it at all. Bunch of religious nuts knocking on the doors of alien worlds preaching fire and brimstone unless people follow their religion. Hmmm...sounds vaguely familiar to something closer to home really. They were nothing that a good throwing of the door in their collective coupons wouldn't solve.

In all seriousness...I just never felt the threat from them and their soldiers were definitely no Jaffa or Super soldiers. The Goa'uld had big, interesting personalities. The Ori were just plain bland.

[LoneStar1836]

Well I wanted Col Dixon (from the ep Heroes) to take command of SG-1 but Adam Baldwin was doing other things and wouldn't have been available if asked anyway. For me he would have been perfect. Seasoned officer with actual field experience. Where as Mitchell had command experience, but had never stepped foot through the gate and yet gets handed the premier team. I just thought that was absurd. And don't get me started on that MoH they handed him.

As much as I would have loved for AT to have been the lead for the show, I just don't think Carter would have been that great a CO. Granted she would have been way better than Mitchell, but I just didn't think she really had what it took. Though she might have if tptb could actually write for the character. I thought the character was treated badly in S8 because while she officially had command of SG-1, we rarely got to see her in command. And ditto for her time on SGA as base commander.

Though this could have worked...

For me, as I've said before, I was annoyed and I think if they had Carter in command and Cam as 2IC the dynamic of the team would have worked a lot better. The struggle Carter would have between being a soldier and a scientist. There would be conflict between Carter and Cam. Maybe even conflict between Carter and Jackson. Plus I think it would have been so much easier to accept Cam as a member of SG1.

...if the writers had been willing to write for Carter.

I get they wanted to shake it up a bit and have a character that was new to gate travel so you get that kind of wonderment of exploration that maybe the others didn't have any more after 8 years of work, but having him command just did fly. His place was as a subordinate.

And I was really looking forward to S9 and BB being on the show because I really didn't like S8, but his introduction left a sour taste. It felt like the character was forced on us and shoehorned in as the lead. I wanted to like Mitchell, but it was too difficult to ignore what I thought were terrible writing choices. He got better in S10 though. Character didn't grow very much but at least he wasn't as annoying.


I thought S10 had some really good eps like Quest 2 which is my favorite, but overall it was a meh, but an improvement over S9.

Let's see....I also liked Flesh and Blood. I thought the Vala/Tomin relationship was good throughout, and that Tomin's character growth over the course of the show and into the movie was interesting. I liked the crossover with SGA. Counterstrike was a good stand alone ep with a classic SG-1 feel to it. I liked Line in the Sand, especially for the Vala/Tomin stuff. Road Not Taken was pretty good.

And I liked Bad Guys fairly well. I suppose because BB and CB got to work together well in that one. Being a huge Farscape fan, I think those two work well together, but on SG-1 I didn't really like how the writers wrote scenes for those two most of the time (Mitchell always seemed abrasive towards her)...and it took a BB penned ep to get a chemistry I enjoyed. The premise of the episode was rather stupid, but still entertaining enough. Not that I had any interest in Mitchell/Vala having any kind of relationship like Crichton/Aeryn did on Farscape or that I wanted those two actors paired up a lot, but most of the time I didn't like what little interaction those two characters had until Bad Guys and then in Bounty they weren't too bad even though that was a wretched episode. Oh and when she had him handcuffed to the bed in Memento Mori and then Sam making the crack about him being pants-less once again. lol. That bit is about the only reason I have to watch that episode as I was no fan of the whole Daniel/Vala ship.

And on the other end of the spectrum, I can't stand Family Ties. Worst episode of SG-1 ever...closely followed by Insiders which is pure stupidity on the part of the SGC which I just couldn't take. That episode is just painful to watch.

As to the Ori....*yawn*. I think Tomin was the only good thing to come from that story line. Oh and the Giant Pottys of Doom. I didn't find those badies to be very interesting or compelling.

[jckfan55]

I agree. I would have loved there to be some conflict between Cam and Sam over decisions made in the field. You'd have seen how Sam had grown from the Captain looking in awe at the Stargate to a leader competent enough to now head the SGC's frontline team. Daniel would always be a nag to a military man (like Jack, and maybe to the younger version of him in Cam) so there would have been some nice conflict there. Daniel, at the outset, wouldn't have respected or trusted him like he did Jack. And then Daniel would have to get used to Sam now being in command where she used to have to follow Jack's orders.

It's a dynamic I really wish we could have seen, and felt was only a natural progression after RDA left.

How do you people feel about the Ori storyline?

Let's just say there's a reason many of us call them the Bori.

It didn’t help so much that they seemingly re-wrote the Daniel character either..... but those are statements for another time.

Don't get me started. I understand that characters grow and change. Not that they get complete personality transplants. Certainly his manhandling of Vala etc was nothing like the Daniel I knew. I wish I remembered who (too lazy to look) first posited that descended Daniel was really Anubis. or Danubis as I like to call him.