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    Originally posted by scjon
    I've been wondering that for a while. I've come to the conclusion that something must have been said or communicated somehow prior to D & C. In that episode he says "oh that", when Sam talks about the things they can't admit to given their military ranks.

    The first time I saw it, I thought I must have missed something, but I'm now assuming that either they discussed it off-screen between Nemesis & Small Victories (there is definitely a more relaxed feel to their (working) relationship at the beginning of Small Victories). If this was the case, the off-screen nature of such a discussion would be really frustrating for us shippers.

    or

    They simultaneously realised that their feelings for each other were mutual when they were stuck on either side of the forcefield in Upgrades/D & C

    or

    I'm on the wrong track completely in both cases.

    Obviously, I've spent way too much time thinking about this
    Oh... I don't think you're on the wrong track! If you are then I'm stuck on the wrong train right along with you!

    IMOHO by S3 J & J had gotten to know each other pretty well after the multitude of intense life and death experiences they’d had up to that point. I think they knew (but had chosen not to act on) their mutual attraction… I mean they’d had a year to mull on (S1’s) TBftGoG’s implication that they were an item.

    Then came PoV which to me seemed like a turning point. While TBftGoG was just about S & J having gotten engaged, PoV introduced ‘our’ S/J to the idea of a ship serious enough to get to the point of commitment - a full-blown year-long marriage between AU S/J. IMO, that was when Jack really began to look at Sam in a more serious ship way. Sam had her ‘Eureka! I really do love the guy’ moment not long after that in A Hundred Days.

    Then that fishing invite in the S3 season finale - Nemesis! They finally were nearly at complete ease with each other personally and professionally, knew there was some sparkage and were ready to see about acting on it. So Jack put the invite out there. ‘Course events, as always, intervened…..

    Ok…. All that sets the stage for your question/musing…. I wholeheartedly agree that during that infamous few days (or week) that S & J were stuck on that planet alone with Teal’c that talking (at a minimum) went on. Big time flirting and I’m sure some instigation by the biggest shipper himself, Mr. T… also went on...

    *big grin* Oh scjon, to have known what conversations and actions went on during their time on that planet would have been wonderful! Whatever it was, the two of them came back even more at ease with each other than before. I mean I know Small Victories was the first episode of the S4 season and the actors had come back refreshed and very happy to see each other and to be there for another season (not to mention that friendship between AT and RDA coming through in their acting…), but in the context that this easiness and gentle playfulness the characters showed on-screen... yeppers…. I sure think some talking got done or some truly heavy duty flirting that was still within regs (for being stranded off-world ) got done that made things pretty clear to the three of them... (and yessssss… it’s very frustrating to know we’re supposed to always fill in the blanks on these things!!!!)

    I think when Upgrades happened it just reinforced what had happened earlier. It was the culmination of all of those years and of that past year especially… the situation pressed Jack between that proverbial rock and a hard place and he decided he couldn’t/wouldn’t hide it anymore. He had to make a choice… and he chose Sam.
    Convention Pix Shore Leave ('06 to '09), AT2, AT3, & AT4 ('06, '08, & '09), and Vancouver ('07)
    My SG fanfic! ..Click Here.

    Comment


      Originally posted by Gatetrixer
      I don't get it! She did tell Unless she means telling him about her individual adventures. And unfortunately I don't think she would have got to tell Jacob, since the the Tok-ra didn't let her leave until she said came up with the idea to have him receive the Sekmak symbiote.
      S9 "Stronghold"
      Spoiler:
      She seems to be implying that she would have considered telling about the Stargate even if the USAF had told her to stay completely quiet. This, of course, completely contradicts the basis of the impediment to a S/J resolution all these years. If she felt she didn't have the right to decide which regs she would or would not follow re: Jack because of the importance of the program, why would somehow warrant such consideration? If this line stays in the episode, it's another massive blow to Sam's integrity.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Rogue
        And you know what is really stupid?
        Spoiler:
        She dates this guy for 2- 3 weeks and they decide to tell him about the stargate. Three weeks! You don't tell a casual bf or gf about the goverments most top seceret base. I can't believe they gave her persmission to tell Pete when she couldn't even tell her dying Dad what she was doing. If he couldn't accept her without knowing what she did, then he wasn't the right man for her.
        I absolutely agree. And don't forget that Jacob was an air force general, and he was still deemed unsuitable to tell about the Stargate. There is no *way* they'd let a civilian cop know.
        - Mary
        SG1 needs it's Fifth Man - Why should we settle for less? Bring back Jonas Quinn!
        Jack O'Neill would die for any member of his team. But there's only one he'd live for: Samantha Carter.

        Comment


          Originally posted by majorsal
          yep.

          for *years*, we've been told that sam and jack couldn't be together because of the regs. then, in the last two-three years, they changed it to that they couldn't be together serving on the same team. then they added on with them on the same team and same base. well, isn't ALL of those barriers gone now???



          sally
          Joe replied to me once (before I unsubscribed from his thread and became a happier person) that once Sam and Jack got together, that would be the end of them ever going through the stargate together again. Of course, you know that my response is, "Well, why?" But that goes back to that Hart to Hart and McMillan & Wife discussion we've been having. But aside from that.....if Joe truly believes that, maybe they don't want to totally commit because they think RDA will come back......

          Lookin' for a little slice of heaven here, ladies!

          Comment


            Originally posted by Gatetrixer
            Okay, but just wanted to say that has anyone else noticed that all of RDA's exes are dark haired, adding that I shouldn't say all, since I only know of the ones mentioned in RDAnderson.com., and I'm going by memory of their hair. But--no Sam copies. Oh, yeah,I know RDA is not Jack, really I do.
            naw, he went around with deidre hall, from days of our lives. and she's blond!


            sally
            sally

            sigpic

            Comment


              Originally posted by sugarshaker
              Anybody have a good puking smilie? I wish I had one to insert here. One more mention of is two too many. How can Cam be torn between telling him or not as he really doesn't have a choice? The regulations are the regulations - right? Oh wait! No! They're only the regulations when it comes to ship. (insert sarcastic tone here).
              How's this one?



              or



              or



              or



              or



              Okay, maybe that was more than you wanted, but every single one of them reminds me of and/or TPTB
              - Mary
              SG1 needs it's Fifth Man - Why should we settle for less? Bring back Jonas Quinn!
              Jack O'Neill would die for any member of his team. But there's only one he'd live for: Samantha Carter.

              Comment


                Originally posted by stargate barbie
                yes but people are flawed, all people. and just because they make decisions like settling to marry someone that they know is not the all time love of their life, it does not make them bad people. some of the lines of conversation here lately are sounding decidedly anti carter. like its all her fault that they didn't get together and jack was the victim. before sam had pete, jack had kynthia and laira and alternate sam.
                my point here is that neither of them are at fault, they've both hurt each other equally and been equally good for each other.

                just because people do these things, it does not make them bad people. in my view, sam is one of the most pure, best written and least corrupt characters on television, while still being realistic. now i know that there are people here who disagree, and thats fine. its why i spend more and more time on the sam thread, to feel better.

                your above comment actually helps to prove my point in a way though. 50% of marriages end in divorce because people do what sam did. so what she did is fairly normal. in a way she did the same thing jack did in a hundred days. thought she couldn't have what she wanted, so tried to settle, and started to become happy. then discovered that she could have what she wanted, was a little torn about hurting someone she had grown to love, but did the right thing for all concerned in the end.

                Actually, I have to take issue with parts of this. Firstly, I do believe it was mostly Sam's fault, because she "moved on" without ever having had "the talk" with Jack. I totally support her right to move on, but since they'd acknowledged mutual feelings in D&C, she owed him at least that much. She should have gone to him and said, "if we can't figure out a way around this, I'm going to move on," and let him either come up with a way to be together or he'd know he has to step aside.

                You cite Kynthia, Laira, and AU as cases where Jack was intentionally hurtful to her, and I find that very unfair. He never did anything with the knowledge that it would hurt her, I don't believe. Sam *had* to know that would hurt Jack. With Kynthia, Jack was drugged. With Laira, he waited a long, long time until he was completely convinced he was *never* getting home. And AU Sam was one kiss, for nothing more than comfort's sake. That doesn't even *count* as a relationship any more than Graham Simmons does with Sam. (Remember Sam comforting him in the infirmary? <g> Actually, I like him a lot, and he's a cutie, but not for Sam.)

                But all that aside, just because she did, IMO, something that was very hurtful to Jack does not mean she's a bad *person*. There's an old expression, "hate the sin, love the sinner." A person can *do* a bad thing without *being* a bad person. Jack probably hurt *all* his teammates quite a lot when he turned on them in Shades of Gray - Sam in particular - but that doesn't make him bad either.

                I really don't think that any of the regular Stargate people (Season 9 notwithstanding, since I'm not watching it) could ever be construed as bad, even if they do bad things from time to time. Bad people would have to be somebody like Colonel Simmons, the Goa'uld, or, yes, Pete. <g>
                - Mary
                SG1 needs it's Fifth Man - Why should we settle for less? Bring back Jonas Quinn!
                Jack O'Neill would die for any member of his team. But there's only one he'd live for: Samantha Carter.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by majorsal
                  naw, he went around with deidre hall, from days of our lives. and she's blond!


                  sally
                  Ok, didn't know that-- like I said I don't know all of 'em (who could?) and anyway don't know anything about her at all.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by sueKay
                    Hey everyone!

                    fly by post...

                    had flick through all the new Sci fi mags that were out this week...In one, there was an interview with RDA which was basically just a roundup of what he's been up to. One non-shippy quote was

                    "The time has finally come when it feels right in all counts to say 'bon voyage' to my stargate family"

                    Hello! Am I the only one bothered by this? That quote really upsets me! I mean, we don't know what mag it came from, and we know their journalistic integrity may not be the best, but still.....

                    In the discussion we had here over the last couple of days on the future of the ship, trupi mentioned that Don Davis had told her that RDA thought fans were angry with him for leaving the show. We talked about letting him know how much we miss him and how he needs to wrap up his storyline. We talked about doing this through a web site, but I think I have a way that would be more effective--by sending letters to his agent and Gekko. I contacted minigeek, and she got the addresses below for me. I think mail sent to one or both of these places would be much more likely to reach him.

                    Here's the information I have.

                    Richard Dean Anderson
                    c/o Gekko Film Corporation
                    1122 South Robertson, Boulevard, Suite 15
                    Los Angeles, CA 90035, USA

                    Richard Dean Anderson
                    c/o ICM (International Creative Management)
                    8942 Wilshire Blvd.
                    Beverly Hills
                    CA 90211, USA

                    minigeek also suggested checking the Screen Actors Guild for addresses that might get mail to him, but I'm having trouble navigating their web site. So, I'd suggest these for now.....and I'm going to write. I'm also going to post this message on the RDA/Jack Thunk Thread. You know those Gutter Gals!

                    How many would write? Could you post here and give us an idea?

                    Comment


                      Don't forget that Jack was also involved with
                      Spoiler:
                      Kerry Johnson
                      .
                      (does season 8 still need spoiler tags?)
                      I don't blame Sam for getting involved with . We all make mistakes. I actually felt bad for the guy, because I don't think Sam ever 'let go' of Jack after 'Grace' like TPTB seem to think. Sam was just confused and wanted a life away from the SGC, and grabbed onto someone who she thought could provide that. People get married for the wrong reasons sometimes, hoping that in the end it will all work out. Sam (and all of SG-1) have been through a lot and sometimes I am surprise they are not ALL a little crazy.

                      I will write!!! I had been thinking about that since I heard what Don Davis said!! Hmmm. I've never written a fan letter before. What should we say?
                      sig by PM

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by sg-1fanintn
                        How many would write? Could you post here and give us an idea?
                        ((((sg-1fanintn))))
                        Count me in!!! In addition, what about letters to TPTB in Vancouver? Even if RDA won't get letters sent to Vancouver, I want TPTB to know that we miss him!!!!
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                          I will... it would be sad if the negative voice was heard only because the positive was silent. Great idea!



                          Originally posted by sg-1fanintn
                          Hello! Am I the only one bothered by this? That quote really upsets me! I mean, we don't know what mag it came from, and we know their journalistic integrity may not be the best, but still.....

                          In the discussion we had here over the last couple of days on the future of the ship, trupi mentioned that Don Davis had told her that RDA thought fans were angry with him for leaving the show. We talked about letting him know how much we miss him and how he needs to wrap up his storyline. We talked about doing this through a web site, but I think I have a way that would be more effective--by sending letters to his agent and Gekko. I contacted minigeek, and she got the addresses below for me. I think mail sent to one or both of these places would be much more likely to reach him.

                          Here's the information I have.

                          Richard Dean Anderson
                          c/o Gekko Film Corporation
                          1122 South Robertson, Boulevard, Suite 15
                          Los Angeles, CA 90035, USA

                          Richard Dean Anderson
                          c/o ICM (International Creative Management)
                          8942 Wilshire Blvd.
                          Beverly Hills
                          CA 90211, USA

                          minigeek also suggested checking the Screen Actors Guild for addresses that might get mail to him, but I'm having trouble navigating their web site. So, I'd suggest these for now.....and I'm going to write. I'm also going to post this message on the RDA/Jack Thunk Thread. You know those Gutter Gals!

                          How many would write? Could you post here and give us an idea?
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                            parsifal I agree 100%.Sam would not break Regs for Jack but Sam would break Regs for Someone who stalker her.This would be another big hit for the Sam character.You have to wonder do TPTB even think about what they put in the Show anymore?

                            Comment


                              Mary could not have said it better myself.Jack was not at fault with both Women and both happened before D&C.Sam had the right to move on.I just think it would have been nice to see Sam and Jack have the Adult conversation in Chimera.IMO Sam owed it to Jack.I would say the same think about Jack if Jack was the one who moved on first.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by sg-1fanintn

                                In the discussion we had here over the last couple of days on the future of the ship, trupi mentioned that Don Davis had told her that RDA thought fans were angry with him for leaving the show. We talked about letting him know how much we miss him and how he needs to wrap up his storyline. We talked about doing this through a web site, but I think I have a way that would be more effective--by sending letters to his agent and Gekko. I contacted minigeek, and she got the addresses below for me. I think mail sent to one or both of these places would be much more likely to reach him.

                                Here's the information I have.

                                Richard Dean Anderson
                                c/o Gekko Film Corporation
                                1122 South Robertson, Boulevard, Suite 15
                                Los Angeles, CA 90035, USA

                                Richard Dean Anderson
                                c/o ICM (International Creative Management)
                                8942 Wilshire Blvd.
                                Beverly Hills
                                CA 90211, USA

                                minigeek also suggested checking the Screen Actors Guild for addresses that might get mail to him, but I'm having trouble navigating their web site. So, I'd suggest these for now.....and I'm going to write. I'm also going to post this message on the RDA/Jack Thunk Thread. You know those Gutter Gals!

                                How many would write? Could you post here and give us an idea?
                                i'll write.

                                i'll write for jack. i'll write for rda. and i'll write for s/j ship.


                                sally
                                sally

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