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**Gatetrixer** · 29 May 2006, 04:26 PM

Originally posted by ReganX

Spoiler:

Apparently not, as later Cam

Spoiler:

**Gatetrixer** · 29 May 2006, 04:34 PM

Was going to rec Sue Corkill's fic a while backbut got sidetracked. Probably most of you have read her stuff, but maybe she will be new for some. Much RST. I like "The Greatest Gift of All"

Her website: http://www.sjhw.net/tolerance/

However, one of my favorite ones, "Letters from the Abyss" (NC17) doesn't seem to be on there so:

http://samandjack.net/stories/sjarch...fromabyss.html

**anne87** · 29 May 2006, 05:47 PM

Seeing as we're on fics atm, I'll pimp, sorry, promote a drabble I just knocked off...

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2963950/1/

And speaking of bad ships, the Sam Cam thing would surely be a SCam??

Sorry. Couldn't resist.

**ParadoxRealities** · 29 May 2006, 05:57 PM

Originally posted by meimei

A lot of civilian companies have rules against people related by blood or marriage working together. It can harm the business. I've seen it happen where several members of the same family worked together. One got fired, her brother and her husband walked out.

The military wouldn't put family together on a team. In WWII there were several brothers who served on the same Navy ship. The ship went down with all hands lost. A whole family was lost. They stopped assigning family to the same duty.

Even friendship is covered by UCMJ. Being friends with someone can lead to percieved favortism. Perception is in the eye of the beholder. Just because you and your friend know there's not favortism, at least not deliberate, it's bad on morale if the other team members think there's something going on.

Usually, the regs are strictly enforced between enlisted and officers or anyone in direct chain of command. You can't help but be friends with your team to some degree. Adding sex to the mix, can make bad go to worse.

However, the UCMJ, like all legal documents, leaves 'outs'.

Ex: Sec 3 - The rules regarding personal relationships must be somewhat elastic to accommodate differing conditions and operational necessities; however, the underlying standard is that Air Force members are expected to avoid those relationships that negatively affect morale, discipline, respect for authority and unit cohesion.

So an exception can be made when necessary to the operation.

The biggest part of what has bothered me about Jack and Sam's relationship vs the regs, is the SGC itself. They are in a top secret unit which requires them to spend eight or nine years together. One of the reasons the military moves people around every few years is to avoid close personal relationships from becoming an issue. In the case of the SGC, they can't move people in and out per standard operating procedures.

If Jack admitted to caring too much about Sam (D&C), they should have been separated immediately. But it wasn't in the best interest of the SGC to do so. But Jack and Sam both have close relationships with Daniel and Teal'c. They were family because of being forced to stay together as a team for too many years. And they didn't allow it to become a problem.

Jack shot Sam in Entity, he shot Daniel in which ever ep that was. Teal'c shot Daniel with a zat. They did what had to be done in spite of their close relationships. If Jack and Sam took it one step further, that wouldn't have changed.

And it appears I went off on a rant... *blushes* I researched all of this when I was writing The Things for Love series and included a lot of it in the story. Plus being ex-military, I've witnessed my share of frat issues, even had a couple of my own. But that's not a story for the shipper thread! Sorry to get so long winded...

yeah. fine. listen to the person who writes a full page.

you're right (duh), it wouldn't have changed, not really. I think it was more in Sam and Jack's minds that it would have. That 'extra step' would have changed a lot for them, and I think they knew it. So while technically (or not technically, however you want to look at it), on the face of it, the same reg would have remained broken, and that difference of extent doesn't really matter (

), what it would do to Sam and Jack's mindset would. At least that's how I see it.

but I'm going to second trupi. honestly, what haven't you done? really, I want to know.

now you got me writing my 'I's capital and everything

**ParadoxRealities** · 29 May 2006, 05:57 PM

Originally posted by anne87

Seeing as we're on fics atm, I'll pimp, sorry, promote a drabble I just knocked off...

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2963950/1/

And speaking of bad ships, the Sam Cam thing would surely be a SCam??

Sorry. Couldn't resist.

yep, sure is.

**minigeek** · 29 May 2006, 06:02 PM

And speaking of bad ships, the Sam Cam thing would surely be a SCam??

The Sam/Cam shippers have rose-tinted spectacles with fisheye lenses attached...just ignore them!

C'mon guys. You know how you all (we all?) feel about enjoying our S/J moments. Whether ours is more "canon" than theirs or not, t'aint fair to belittle the folks who like other pairings here any more than it would be fair for them to belittle us. We all know how that feels, so lets rise above that. Live and let live. It's ALL fantasy at the end of the day, and the fact is, S/J has a far greater chance of "seeing" resolution on screen than any other 'pairing on SG-1. So smug we can do. Smug we deserve after 10 frickin' years of waiting!

But condescending? Not so pretty.

Sam/Cam makes me cringe as much as it does the next S/J shipper, but the folks who like that pairing do have a right to not be belittled for it, if you ask me. Even obliquely.

BESIDES - all fantasy aside - there's just no chance for it on screen, so they have to have somewhere fun and safe to play in the imaginary sandbox. Sam and Cam can't ever happen on screen. How it would look for Sam Carter to have fallen in love with and pined for Jack all those years, with only the regs between them - and then as soon as he leaves, she falls for the NEXT military member of SG-1? The next guy she can't be with because she's serving on the same team and their both Air Force? What kind of a pattern would that set? Yeeeow. Talk about your Shark Jumping.

All fantasy and fanfiction aside, Sam's canon feelings towards Jack on the series (the stuff we did see on screen) make a storyline like that into a very detrimental thing for Sam's character. I see zero chance of it actually happening on screen, therefore. So we've got nothing to be insecure about where that's concerned in canon. And since we have no insecurity there, we also have no reason to make fun of those who want to write fiction or discuss the fantasy of it happening, either.

We have the unique privilege of sitting here and partying hardy, safe in the knowledge that S10 brings some very sweet possibilities for Sam and Jack ON SCREEN - in CANON. Yeah baby.

mg

**jafacakes** · 29 May 2006, 06:05 PM

Originally posted by majorsal

can someone give me a direct link to 'the band' fic? i can't find it.

sally

It was posted here a few days back, this link is for the first part out of 8

http://www.sg1-heliopolis.com/helio2...11/theband.php

**gwenhwyfar** · 29 May 2006, 06:06 PM

Originally posted by minigeek

C'mon guys. You know how you all (we all?) feel about enjoying our S/J moments. Whether ours is more "canon" than theirs or not, t'aint fair to belittle the folks who like other pairings here any more than it would be fair for them to belittle us. We all know how that feels, so lets rise above that. Live and let live. It's ALL fantasy at the end of the day, and the fact is, S/J has a far greater chance of "seeing" resolution on screen than any other 'pairing on SG-1. So smug we can do.

Condescending? Not so pretty.

As to Sam/Cam - all fantasy aside - imagine how it would look for Sam Carter to have fallen in love with / pined for Jack all those years, and then as soon as he leaves, she falls for the NEXT military member of SG-1? Yeeeow. Talk about your Shark Jumping. All fantasy and fanfiction aside, Sam's canon feelings towards Jack on the series so far (the stuff we did see on screen) would make a storyline like that really detrimental to her character. I see zero chance of it actually happening on screen. So we've got nothing to be insecure about where that's concerned in canon.

mg

I agree. Saying stuff like that has caused problems in the John/Liz thread that I for one would prefer to avoid here. So please, no more making fun of others Ships?

**ParadoxRealities** · 29 May 2006, 06:10 PM

...but....it really is called scam....??

shark jumping? AT mentioned something about shark jumping. i believe it was that there was to be a lot of it in s10.

detrimental to her character, ay? well we all know nothing like that'll ever happen. and its not like some of TPTB don't already think its going to happen. or that in AU it has. and its not like sam stands to close to him and almost kisses other guys or anything like that. yeah, yeah. i'm sure we're fine.

i'm sorry mg. its not you, honest. you're all optimistic and HCR and i'm...ahem...not.

((((mini))))

**gwenhwyfar** · 29 May 2006, 06:12 PM

Originally posted by ParadoxRealities

...but....it really is called scam....??

shark jumping? AT mentioned something about shark jumping. i believe it was that there was to be a lot of it in s10.

detrimental to her character, ay? well we all know nothing like that'll ever happen. and its not like some of TPTB don't already think its going to happen. or that in AU it has. and its not like sam stands to close to him and almost kisses other guys or anything like that. yeah, yeah. i'm sure we're fine.

i'm sorry mg. its not you, honest. you're all optimistic and HCR and i'm...ahem...not.

((((mini))))

It was supposed to be a lot of

Spoiler:

Calm down, lol!
Is there any Shipper cookies left to calm her down and make her more optomistic?

**ParadoxRealities** · 29 May 2006, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by gwenhwyfar

It was supposed to be a lot of

Spoiler:

Calm down, lol!
Is there any Shipper cookies to calm her down and make her more optomistic?

oh, really? oh. ok. what is WITH me today? wait...

Spoiler:

**minigeek** · 29 May 2006, 06:22 PM

Originally posted by ParadoxRealities

...but....it really is called scam....??

shark jumping? AT mentioned something about shark jumping. i believe it was that there was to be a lot of it in s10.

detrimental to her character, ay? well we all know nothing like that'll ever happen. and its not like some of TPTB don't already think its going to happen. or that in AU it has. and its not like sam stands to close to him and almost kisses other guys or anything like that. yeah, yeah. i'm sure we're fine.

i'm sorry mg. its not you, honest. you're all optimistic and HCR and i'm...ahem...not.

((((mini))))

Hey, be as non optimistic as ya like - I'm just sayin', lets also be tolerant of the other 'shippers out there. We don't have to discuss the ship pairing positively, but I think we do owe it to the community here at large to be respectful of the other shippers out there themselves. Saying "Sam/Cam really squicks me out" is different than saying "Those Sam/Cam shippers are crazy!" (know what I'm sayin'?)

As to Shark Jumping - that occurs when a plot or character moment turns really cliche or maudlin, over-the-top, silly, or just plain bad. Sam and Jack getting together while on the same team, for example, would have been jumping the shark. Sam and Jack getting together after he retires, or they are no longer in the same chain of command, not so much. Teal'c in silver body paint would be jumping the shark. Carter making out with General Landry. Falling in love with the next military guy she serves with. Y'know, stuff like that.

mg

**ParadoxRealities** · 29 May 2006, 06:35 PM

yes'am. i know. and stop giving TPTB ideas. i was just pointing out that it is indeed called "scam", to the best of my knowledge, at least. apparently some people like the rhyming names thing.

what's wrong with teal'c in silver body paint?!!

**Gatetrixer** · 29 May 2006, 06:41 PM

Originally posted by minigeek

Hey, be as non optimistic as ya like - I'm just sayin', lets also be tolerant of the other 'shippers out there. We don't have to discuss the ship pairing positively, but I think we do owe it to the community here at large to be respectful of the other shippers out there themselves. Saying "Sam/Cam really squicks me out" is different than saying "Those Sam/Cam shippers are crazy!" (know what I'm sayin'?)

As to Shark Jumping - that occurs when a plot or character moment turns really cliche or maudlin, over-the-top, silly, or just plain bad. Sam and Jack getting together while on the same team, for example, would have been jumping the shark. Sam and Jack getting together after he retires, or they are no longer in the same chain of command, not so much. Teal'c in silver body paint would be jumping the shark. Carter making out with General Landry. Falling in love with the next military guy she serves with. Y'know, stuff like that.

mg

Did somebody say "Jump the Shark?" Great! It's an opening

for me to mention that the episode with the Fonz jumping same will be shown on WGN come Wednesday.

**minigeek** · 29 May 2006, 06:42 PM

Originally posted by ParadoxRealities

yes'am. i know. and stop giving TPTB ideas. i was just pointing out that it is indeed called "scam", to the best of my knowledge, at least. apparently some people like the rhyming names thing.

what's wrong with teal'c in silver body paint?!!

Nothing! I love that shark. Yummy. And I call it SCAM too, btw. I also call S/J Salmon Jack, so I'm equal opportunity.

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