Sam Carter/Amanda Tapping Discussion/Appreciation

[antoa]

In terms of Sam's reaction to Pete's hissy fit and walk out...to her retrospectively forgiving him for the stalking in Affinity...I have to admit that I'm torn. Do I think its OOC? Hmmm. Well, we'd only ever glimpsed Sam's personal reactions back in The First Commandment with her exchange with Jonas H and there again, she does come across as not being particularly confident in her personal interactions. I do think her Chimera reaction was probably in-character especially as Sam wanted to succeed at the relationship and didn't want to fail -- and Sam by all accounts had been out of the dating game a long while.

Was it a good thing from a Sam as role model perspective? Possibly not but I know several women who are kick-butt, intelligent, strong women in their careers but who struggle to be confident in their relationships and do go 'but it has to be something I did' when its blatantly the man's an idiot

Having said all that, I would still have preferred the whole Sam/Pete arc to have been written better full stop.

For some reason, I am starting to think that her reaction wasn't so out of character. WE've only gotten a glimpse of one previous relationship (Jonas) and he turn out to be a real creep.

As strong and capable a soldier as she is, Sam is still *very* insecure in her relationships. I think that being in such a boy's club has forced her to hide her feminine side so much that she is reluctant to let it out. And when she does let it out, she is very weary and maybe a bit blind and forgiving (and puts the blame on herself).

I think the relationship with Pete was the kick in the butt she needed to realise that she didn't need to be so passive in a relationship. And when she learned that, there was nothing left keeping here in it.

It's early. Am I making sense?

[resurgamlaura]

For some reason, I am starting to think that her reaction wasn't so out of character. WE've only gotten a glimpse of one previous relationship (Jonas) and he turn out to be a real creep.

As strong and capable a soldier as she is, Sam is still *very* insecure in her relationships. I think that being in such a boy's club has forced her to hide her feminine side so much that she is reluctant to let it out. And when she does let it out, she is very weary and maybe a bit blind and forgiving (and puts the blame on herself).

I think the relationship with Pete was the kick in the butt she needed to realise that she didn't need to be so passive in a relationship. And when she learned that, there was nothing left keeping here in it.

It's early. Am I making sense?

Perfect sense. And when you add in the complications she's had with her close male relatives...oi.

[Skydiver]

i think sam also, with her job, has been so focused on her job that she doesn't have much of a life outside of work, thus her dating pool is rather shallow. and it's often a big issue to date folks that you work with. not only does she have to mess with frat regs, but also the double standard that any woman that dates within the ranks is some sort of object or subject of rumors and gossip (even in the military a man that dates around is a stud, a woman is a slut)

so i think she had ample reason NOT to date and experiment and just used those reasons to kinda hide behind, and in think she also got so caught up in them that she didn't realize how much time was slipping by until it hit her one day and she was like 'omg, i'm 40 and i have no life' and so - after grace - she literally threw herself into having a life..a.nd by god she was gonna make it work no matter what!!!! (hence pete and her forgiving him when she should have slapped him)

[resurgamlaura]

And when you think about the previous horror that occurred when she dated a military guy- bad enough that he gets possessive and you break up; socially awful and awkward that you get assigned to the same base; that you then have to deal with him when he's gone off-world, gotten all meglomanical and even more vicious and tyrannical, and is then killed? And then the frat regs and possible team dynamic implications of the O'Neill issues? She also had what must have seemed like a secure support network in her team and Janet, but ultimately she needed something else in terms of comfort and understanding- something I have found myself, having such a reasonable amount of male friends, and in general friends who are all so closely bound together. You need something outside of that.

[ForeverSg1]

For some reason, I am starting to think that her reaction wasn't so out of character. WE've only gotten a glimpse of one previous relationship (Jonas) and he turn out to be a real creep.

As strong and capable a soldier as she is, Sam is still *very* insecure in her relationships. I think that being in such a boy's club has forced her to hide her feminine side so much that she is reluctant to let it out. And when she does let it out, she is very weary and maybe a bit blind and forgiving (and puts the blame on herself).

I think the relationship with Pete was the kick in the butt she needed to realise that she didn't need to be so passive in a relationship. And when she learned that, there was nothing left keeping here in it.

It's early. Am I making sense?

I think you make perfect sense.

I know a lot of career women who excel in the workforce. They have great jobs, but they absolutely suck when it comes to relationships. While most are extremely intelligent and confident in the workplace, they tend to be very timid and unsure of themselves when put into a situation of the heart. I've also found that many of these women have been in past relationships where they have been abused at some point in time, whether emotional, physically or mentally. The sad thing is a woman who's been abused physically is much easier to identify than someone who's been abused psychologically and emotionally.

Someone very close to me was in a relationship in her early twenties that was very violent. The person she was with didn't so much beat her up as he beat her down. He would constantly tell her that she was lucky to be with him. That without him she'd be alone. That no man would want her. She was a whore who was unworthy of love. It took us nearly two years to finally get her out of that relationship and by that time the emotional damage had already been done. Twenty years later and she's still incapable of being in a relationship. She simply will not allow herself to get close to anyone in that way again.

I can see Sam being much the same way if her past relationship with Hanson or anyone else was abusive in any way. We already see her putting up walls even with people she cares about deeply. She has no issues with being friends with a man, but once they express that they like her, she tends to shy away. She doesn't seem to believe that she is worthy of their interest. Which would explain why she allowed Pete to treat her the way he did in the bedroom. Sam reacted like someone who had been verbally abused, she cowered and accepted the attack as if it weren't the first time it had happened. Or at least that's the way I interpreted the scene.

Kat

[antoa]

I think you make perfect sense.

I can see Sam being much the same way if her past relationship with Hanson or anyone else was abusive in any way. We already see her putting up walls even with people she cares about deeply. She has no issues with being friends with a man, but once they express that they like her, she tends to shy away. She doesn't seem to believe that she is worthy of their interest. Which would explain why she allowed Pete to treat her the way he did in the bedroom. Sam reacted like someone who had been verbally abused, she cowered and accepted the attack as if it weren't the first time it had happened. Or at least that's the way I interpreted the scene.

Kat

I think the 'shipper' part of my brain blocked most of Chimera out of my consciousness, because I really don't remember any details from the ep. I was watching the Pete vid at the con (played before Daivd DeLuise came on stage) and didn't remember half of the clips!

I think I need to watch it again. When I do, I am sure I will agree with your interpretation of that scene (which I don't remember atm). It's the only way to justify her response with what we know of Carter. It's also why I can see that she was at least emotionally abused by Hanson (dude they need to branch out with the names - too many Jonas/Jonah).

[Rachel500]

I think you make perfect sense.

<snipped>
I can see Sam being much the same way if her past relationship with Hanson or anyone else was abusive in any way. We already see her putting up walls even with people she cares about deeply. She has no issues with being friends with a man, but once they express that they like her, she tends to shy away. She doesn't seem to believe that she is worthy of their interest. Which would explain why she allowed Pete to treat her the way he did in the bedroom. Sam reacted like someone who had been verbally abused, she cowered and accepted the attack as if it weren't the first time it had happened. Or at least that's the way I interpreted the scene.

Kat

Verbal and control abuse is very insiduous, and rarely leaves visible bruises to alert others that it is happening. I've had a similar second hand experience and it's heartbreaking to watch it happen to someone you care about.

I have to admit when I rewatched The First Commandment there is the sense that Sam did have some kind of an abusive relationship with Jonas - little things like the way she notes he was all about control and the scene between them; the way he backhands her at the Gate. In my character bible, I tend to interpret it that Jonas tried to control Sam but Sam figured out what Jonas was doing and managed to get out.

Sam's reaction in Chimera is very much 'what have I done? Don't be angry with me. Let me fix it.' which I agree would indicate that it was a learned response. That's not to say though that I believe Pete was abusive like Jonas...I tend to think Pete was just too immature and unthinking about some of his actions rather than deliberately abusive or controlling...but then that's because I put a lot of his actions down to immature and unthinking writing...

[resurgamlaura]

Verbal and control abuse is very insiduous, and rarely leaves visible bruises to alert others that it is happening. I've had a similar second hand experience and it's heartbreaking to watch it happen to someone you care about.

I have to admit when I rewatched The First Commandment there is the sense that Sam did have some kind of an abusive relationship with Jonas - little things like the way she notes he was all about control and the scene between them; the way he backhands her at the Gate. In my character bible, I tend to interpret it that Jonas tried to control Sam but Sam figured out what Jonas was doing and managed to get out.

Sam's reaction in Chimera is very much 'what have I done? Don't be angry with me. Let me fix it.' which I agree would indicate that it was a learned response. That's not to say though that I believe Pete was abusive like Jonas...I tend to think Pete was just too immature and unthinking about some of his actions rather than deliberately abusive or controlling...but then that's because I put a lot of his actions down to immature and unthinking writing...

That kind of reaction is also a very 'female' reaction in some respects. 'It must be me', 'I have to be the one to sort things out', 'I should be depended on'. It normally exists in little things- my mum always doing within certain things for us, and never letting us do the same- but in Sam's case (and here the points made throughout yesterday and today are very relevant) she has to do that in everything, and especially in relationships- because she's so unsure and the hints of control-issues in previous relationships also play a part.
I think the last point that Rachel made is very true. Pete has good qualities- he's mostly pleasant, dependable and caring. And the frustration he feels sometimes is normal for partners of people who are as devoted to their work. But for him to react like that so early on, and in that way? It smacks of poor-thinking on the part of the writers, and because of that ill-thought and immaturity, they alienated a lot of audience in respect of his character-and it didn't need to be like that.

[Skydiver]

i too don't see pete as a physical abuser. i see him as a man on the rebound who was just as desperate as sam was to make things work. she was a mystery, he wanted to solve that mystery and didn't think much about it when he did it and how she'd deal with it (and sam had to have found out...even if she didn't specifically, folks in a job liek sam's have their lives watched and anyone running a background check on her would trigger a 'eh, what does he want to know?' issue within part of the govt. hammond definitely found out and jack was likely told. whether or not they told sam...i dunno.

the people that date/married to folks in classified jobs are just as bound by the rules and it's not uncommon for the spouse of a classified employee to have to have a background check. and if hte spouse fails, the employee has two choices...lose the spouse, lose the job.

[resurgamlaura]

At the risk of sounding horribly sexist, in many ways it is a very male reaction-wanting to solve the problem, get to the bottom of things, make things work. At the same time, it is a little extreme and from what I've gathered, the writers knew right away that they hadn't done it quite the way they should have.

[majorsal]

Wow very nice little peek into the filming and lovely pics, Amanda gives a lovely insite into her filming and her thoughts and i so wish she would do a blog
(((((((Amanda)))))) thankyou

you know one thing i'm really curious about? the bathroom situation.

i'd heard that they used bedpans in the hooches. i'm sorry, but i'd go outside before i'd use a bedpan *in front of everyone*! (especially #2)

amanda: uh, guys, wake up.
the girls: what?
amanda: i have to go.
the girls: bye.
amanda: NO, i have to *go*.
the girls: ......
amanda: get out!
the girls: amanda, it's ridiculous below zero out there, we ain't going!... wait, where are you going?
amanda: if you think i'm using this pottypan in front of you... and i'm going to personally make each one of you suffer if i get a frostbitten butt!


i have no idea where that came from.





sally

[majorsal]

Interestingly (or not), I did expect a lot of S9 to focus on Ben's new character. He was coming in as lead male and I figured there would be an emphasis on his character with lots of stories focusing on him at the start to imbed him in but then it would be an ensemble of the four of them as equals. I figured that they would use AT's absence to take the opportunity of doing just that as they would only have BB, CJ and MS to cater for in terms of stories. What I didn't expect was:

(snip)

3. Sam's absence and return to be so crappily explained on-screen with no character reaction to suddenly finding herself without a command either in SG1 or at Area 51 - EDM should have been all about Sam coming to terms with being back at the SGC and about her perceived step backwards instead of the...

Spoiler:

Ba'al clone-beam-an-entire-building-into-space

farce that is was.

oh, yes.

it's still hard to imagine that they really did this. this was a HUGE thing for sam to have went through, and they totally took away the emphasis from *her* perspective and just through her back in. (daniel: is that you, sam? sam: yes. daniel: hi. sam: hi.)

(also the fact that SG1 BROKE UP, and, again, the emphasis on this situation was pushed aside for the daniel-vala show.)





sally

[resurgamlaura]

you know one thing i'm really curious about? the bathroom situation.

i'd heard that they used bedpans in the hooches. i'm sorry, but i'd go outside before i'd use a bedpan *in front of everyone*! (especially #2)

amanda: uh, guys, wake up.
the girls: what?
amanda: i have to go.
the girls: bye.
amanda: NO, i have to *go*.
the girls: ......
amanda: get out!
the girls: amanda, it's ridiculous below zero out there, we ain't going!... wait, where are you going?
amanda: if you think i'm using this pottypan in front of you... and i'm going to personally make each one of you suffer if i get a frostbitten butt!


i have no idea where that came from.





sally

Neither do I
Although watching you try to go outside, only to rush back in once you had been *exposed* to the below freezing temperatures would be very amusing indeed. Who's up for sending majorsal to the Artic? Plenty of fun to be had with polar bears too...

[majorsal]

Neither do I
Although watching you try to go outside, only to rush back in once you had been *exposed* to the below freezing temperatures would be very amusing indeed. Who's up for sending majorsal to the Artic? Plenty of fun to be had with polar bears too...

(this is why i would have tried to kick *them* out )

i would have paid BIG money (big for me is $100... i'm poor) to be able to go up there with those guys!!!

if one of the ptb said i could either visit the studio and see an ep being filmed or go up to the arctic and be there while there's filming, i'd have picked the latter! TOTALLY! this whole thing to me -besides hanging with amanda and rick - would have been like literally visiting another planet! how flippin' awesome!!



sally

[jckfan55]

I agree 100% it was likely the puerile fantasies of the writers and showrunner shining through in spades. Also I do recall a few instances wherein AT publicly expressed concern and regret for some of the scenes and how they were handled, in particular she was irked about the ending of affinity - as was I - so much so she went to cooper about it, in his infinite wisdom, he would not change it (too bad for Carter since it was another black mark in that "reationship" arc) drivel at its best and OoC beyond the realm. Overall though every time she discusses or mentions this arc it is in a positive light (her opinion and her right) and I have disagreed with her take on it since day one (my opinion and my right).

I would say that my one wish would be to delve into the detail of this nightmare with AT and really discuss it with her at great depth to see what her actual and true feelings are, beyond what often, to me, seems to be expressions of how much fun it was to play that kind of part, how great working with DD was, etc. I often think that since so many of them, including AT, have said they do not watch the show as aired that they project their thoughts and feelings about an episode based on how it was to film it and obviously they have fun filming together so I often wonder how much of the comments stem from that aspect, as well as from a deep need to convince the many myriads of fans who expressed dislike, displeasure and hatred of the "relationship" for the damage it did to the character, that it was a "good" thing for Carter.

Excellent points. Maybe as a coping mechanism she's convinced herself it was good. I'm glad she got a love interest that was not just the "alien of the week" but boy did they mess up Pete IMHO. It was very hard to get beyond the stalking thing for me & then they wrote him to set him up to be turned down in the end. And the way they did it, I thought made Sam look kind of bad. The only good thing about Affinity re: Pete was the way they worked together on the case. I thought that was a little glimpse of what might have been.