For me it just seems that the writers haven't learned how to work with RDA's reduced schedule. They seem to be only able to focus on one Jack relationship at a time and the latter half of season 7 seemed to be the Jack/Sam relationship and the Jack/Daniel and Jack/Teal'c relationships seemed to fall by the wayside. I truly believe that with some creativity they could find a way to show all of the inter-team relationships even with RDA's reduced schedule.
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
The Jack O'Neill/Daniel Jackson slash and friendship thread
Collapse
X
-
Originally posted by ShipperahoyFor me it just seems that the writers haven't learned how to work with RDA's reduced schedule. They seem to be only able to focus on one Jack relationship at a time and the latter half of season 7 seemed to be the Jack/Sam relationship and the Jack/Daniel and Jack/Teal'c relationships seemed to fall by the wayside. I truly believe that with some creativity they could find a way to show all of the inter-team relationships even with RDA's reduced schedule.
It wouldn't take long in any of those cases, only a few seconds perhaps, to inject some friendship. The D/S chat over 'Signs' lasted for all of three lines, and yet it's one of the moments everyone remembers.
Madeleine
Comment
-
Originally posted by LiebestraumeOkay, I'll bite and ask the stupid (and, perhaps, anathema) question: is this relationship still the most important on the show? And if so, why? (Knowing that we each have our own preference, I haste to add that I am merely asking the question, not to suggest what the answer should or shouldn't be.)
Jack has go to bat for Daniel many times early on. Remember in the ending arc of S1 where Jack and the team followed Daniel's plan to stop Apothsis. And they did it on just Daniels word. I fell that Daniel has done many things not just for the Team but or to find his wife(her son stop the gould save the planet...) but for jack. And Jack has deffred to Daniel's judgement on many occaisonsI'm not here man
Hello it was me
Comment
-
ITA: I totally agreeI'm a girl! A girly girly girl!
Okay, you got me. I can't accept change. This message may look like it was typed on a computer and posted on the internet, but it is actually cave drawings delivered by smoke signals.
Naquada Enhanced Chastity Belts -SG1 edition. On sale now! Heck, I'll give them away
Daniel Jackson Appreciation and Discussion -because he's more than pretty
http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=89
Daniel Jackson: The Beacon of Hope and The Man Who Opened the Stargate
Comment
-
I'm one of those who miss the Jack and Daniel interaction. I think TPTB could have done better. Because the have lost focus on that relationship (and Jack and Teal'c, Daniel and Sam, Teal'c and Sam, Daniel and Teal'c) they have missed out on many an opportunity to make the storylines go that one step further.
I hope that this is remedied in Season 8.No snurching any Pictures I post!! (without my permission)
sigpic
Comment
-
Originally posted by LiebestraumeOkay, I'll bite and ask the stupid (and, perhaps, anathema) question: is this relationship still the most important on the show? And if so, why? (Knowing that we each have our own preference, I haste to add that I am merely asking the question, not to suggest what the answer should or shouldn't be.)
I don't think it's the most important one, although it is my favourite one. IMO all of the relationships between the team are equally as important. It was more prominent in the earlier seasons, and I think maybe it was more important then, but since the relationships with Sam & Teal'c & Jonas developed, they became just as important. Unfortunately, that has left a lot less time for Jack & Daniel's relationship.
Comment
-
Originally posted by ecm101I think that the Jack anbd Daniel reletionship was the basis for the show, and the whole team feel had to be built on Jack the military and Daniel the morality. And how these two people could work togather and be friends(and save the world...)
Early season(s) of the series continued to build upon this theme. I have a hard time believing Jack and Daniel were already "best friends" at the onset of the series: they both had been (somewhat) loners from vastly different background when they first met (in the movie), and the original Abydos mission was too brief for a friendship to develop. That shared experience, however, had provided the genesis for a profound friendship, and their working together again in SGC gave that friendship the time and opportunity to grow.
However, the story has come a long way since its inception and neither Jack nor Daniel is the man he used to be. Instead of merely being the seasoned soldier he was once perceived, Jack showed his inate nobility, his willingness to bear the burden of his conscience for the greater good (Unnatrual Selection comes to mind). And Daniel seems to be more spiritual than intellectual these days. So I am not sure if the original premise holds as much as it once did.
Just my 2c.Last edited by Liebestraume; 15 May 2004, 04:02 PM.In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde
Comment
-
Originally posted by epiphanyLiebestraum it might be easier to buy that point of view IF they'd actually made it an arc on the show. Instead it was there one season(or three actually), gone the next, never to return.
This isn't evolution. ......
By design, TV series are much more open-ended than movies. As the story evolves, so must the characters and, hence, their relationships. The early seasons were a time for Jack and Daniel to get to know one another, a time for their mutual respect as well as affection to take shape. IMHO the apparent lack of overt affection in later seasons does not diminish (what I perceive to be) the deepening bond between them. It came through the subtext of the show: two men from worlds apart became friends, and that friendship subsequently transformed them. As Jack and Daniel become increasingly complex individuals, their simple affection grows into a connection more spiritual, and the original premise of the show (i.e., the "realism vs. idealism" debate) encompasses even loftier concerns than before.
Whether or not the change was "for the better" is, of course, a matter of perspective. Nevertheless, TPTB perhaps could have handled the evolution with more care than they had. Maybe there should have been story arcs depicting a gradual transition. However, I cannot judge the wisdom in TPTB's creative decision, or if it was at all intentional. Now matter how the current state compares to what-the-show-was, it is at least engaging enough to not only "hook" me but also make me care about the characters; otherwise, I wouldn't have spent the time catching up on the previous seasons or lurking on this board.In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde
Comment
-
Originally posted by shelsfcIMO all of the relationships between the team are equally as important. It was more prominent in the earlier seasons, and I think maybe it was more important then, but since the relationships with Sam & Teal'c & Jonas developed, they became just as important. Unfortunately, that has left a lot less time for Jack & Daniel's relationship.
Much has been said about Jack's growing relationship with Teal'c or with Sam, and I think Daniel's relationships with others have also developed. I very much appreciate the natural affinity between Daniel and Sam as well as their emotional closeness. There is often humor in the "odd couple" pairing Daniel and Teal'c, yet what I like most is how their bond was forged. It wasn't a coincidence that Daniel had to be the one to destroy Thor's Hammer (which could have freed Sha're) or that Teal'c had to kill Amonet/Sha're. The difficult choices these men faced in order to save each other, and the subsequent mutual understanding, gave meaning to their friendship.
Given that the show now has a more ensemble feel than it did at the onset, it is difficult for each storyline to receive the amount of "air time" it merits. As some people mentioned up-thread, hopefully TPTB will give each storyline the amount of attention it deserves to make up in quality where quantity falls short.In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde
Comment
-
and the original premise of the show (i.e., the "realism vs. idealism" debate) encompasses even loftier concerns than before.
Only in my opinion the show doesn't encompass loftier concerns than before. It had become more and more pedestrian. And I never saw the debate as realism vs. idealism. Just as different ways of going about trying to reach the same point. I don't think Daniel was unrealistic, I think he had a different focus. And I don't think Jack was necessarily any more realistic than Daniel was, he too had a different focus. You can't do Jack's job with Daniel's focus and you can't do Daniel's job with Jack's focus.
It used to feel epic but personal, which led it depth. Now it just feels....showy. It doesn't feel epic. The bad guys have become jokes for the most part. Anubis was such a cliched joke. This is largely because the personal connection of any of the characters both to each other and to what they are fighting has just diminished in favor of bigger explosions.
It's like they've become shallow puddles where they used to be deep wells. Their relationships are all surface level, they used to seem like family. Now they seem like a bunch of co-workers who don't dislike each other.
TPTB haven't given quantity or quality and I don't see why they would start in Season 8 when they can just coast as they have done the past couple seasons.
How this relates to the Jack and Daniel question is that the downplaying of that relationship is a big symptom of it.
Comment
-
Originally posted by epiphanyAnd I never saw the debate as realism vs. idealism. Just as different ways of going about trying to reach the same point. I don't think Daniel was unrealistic, I think he had a different focus. And I don't think Jack was necessarily any more realistic than Daniel was, he too had a different focus.
(As for the rest, the villains have been somewhat cliche-ish ever since Day One and the "good guys" never take themselves too seriously. Sure, there is ample room for improvement but that's a whole other topic I won't get into here.)Last edited by Liebestraume; 16 May 2004, 08:29 AM.In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde
Comment
-
Originally posted by Liebestraume[COLOR=Purple]There is no denying the decreased screen time for Jack and/or Daniel or the near absence of overt affection; so, I take the point that a new viewer may not be able to appreciate the bond between these two characters. However, I think part of the reward of being a veteran viewer, or a new viewer who makes the effort to catch up, is to know the characters and what made them who they are.
As Jack and Daniel become increasingly complex individuals, their simple affection grows into a connection more spiritualI'm a girl! A girly girly girl!
Okay, you got me. I can't accept change. This message may look like it was typed on a computer and posted on the internet, but it is actually cave drawings delivered by smoke signals.
Naquada Enhanced Chastity Belts -SG1 edition. On sale now! Heck, I'll give them away
Daniel Jackson Appreciation and Discussion -because he's more than pretty
http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=89
Daniel Jackson: The Beacon of Hope and The Man Who Opened the Stargate
Comment
-
Originally posted by Dani347But, I don't think veteran viewers should have to go with (imo) the total abscence of affection just because they know it used to be there. It seems like a pretty shoddy reward, to me.Originally posted by Liebestraume... part of the reward of being a veteran viewer, or a new viewer who makes the effort to catch up, is to know the characters and what made them who they are.
Originally posted by Dani347And, I never saw their affection as simple. It was a strong, deep affection.
It is strong and deep, but it started out as simple nonetheless. The closest analogy that I can come up with is this: there are friends who accept me because they love me, and there are the friends who understand me without me ever having to utter a word.
Originally posted by Dani347I don't think anyone watching the show now should go back to old episodes and be suddenly surprised that Jack and Daniel were pretty good friends. That isn't developing the friendship to a different plane. To me, that's just dropping an important aspect of the show. I want to see that Jack and Daniel are still friends. That, at the very least, Jack cares about Daniel as much as he cares about Sam and Teal'c.Last edited by Liebestraume; 16 May 2004, 10:26 AM.In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde
Comment
-
discern their established bond, despite of its subtlety (or its apparent absence, depending on one's perspective). And, because of that, he/she would appreciate the nuance that other people could miss.
In fact, I do think Jack cares about Daniel as much as he does Sam and Teal'c; their relationships just have different natures.I'm a girl! A girly girly girl!
Okay, you got me. I can't accept change. This message may look like it was typed on a computer and posted on the internet, but it is actually cave drawings delivered by smoke signals.
Naquada Enhanced Chastity Belts -SG1 edition. On sale now! Heck, I'll give them away
Daniel Jackson Appreciation and Discussion -because he's more than pretty
http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=89
Daniel Jackson: The Beacon of Hope and The Man Who Opened the Stargate
Comment
Comment