Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Discussion Thread

[Sparky She-Demon]

Excellent review hlndncr!

[iiradned]

Thanks all for real and virtual green! Glad you enjoyed the review. I miss having time to really delve into the episodes.

I'm hoping to get some time off later this summer. My plan is to catch up on the episode drabbles I started doing in season one. I have many ideas. I just need a little time to get them down on paper.

Waiting excitedly for the drabbles.

[neverendingimagination]

Great review hlndncr. *virtual green*

[neverendingimagination]

It's still the 3rd here - only just but I think I'll make it.

(Banner made by me)

Series 3 – Episode 3 ‘Legacy’
Shippers re-watch review

Synopsis:
After exploring PAV-123, SG1 encounters a sealed chamber containing 9 dead Goa’uld, the Linvers; Daniel exhibits symptoms of Schizophrenia. It is discovered that he had a Goa’uld device inside him, after it transfers to Teal’c, threatening his life.


Story:
Whilst exploring PAB-123 SG1 encounters a sealed room containing desiccated human bodies. Each is dressed in the lavish manner of a Goa’uld; Sam see’s a scar on the back of one’s neck confirming they were indeed, Goa’uld.

Teal’c identifies the symbol on the table as that of the ‘Linvers’ a less powerful group of ‘Goa’uld’ who rival the system lords, he states there are 9. Sam counts 9 bodies. Daniel finds a Goa’uld tablet and uses a stone to ‘turn the page’. Daniel feels a slight touch on his skin as though someone brushed past him, but there is nothing there.

After returning to Earth Daniel starts to hear voices. His research into the room leads him to believe the ‘Linvers’ were locked in the room from the inside. Janet is unable to determine a cause of death of the humans and because the host body absorbs a symbiote, on death, there are no Goa’uld remains for her to examine either. There are no wounds or infections, Janet tentatively suggests cause of death as starvation.

Daniel briefly hallucinates the returning SG7 are desiccated zombie like creatures. He sets about translating the tablet and hears voices again, he sees and hears a ‘gate dialing in his closet and opens the doors to find an event horizon. He tells himself it isn’t real before touching the event horizon and seeing a zombie creature pull him in.

He comes to in the infirmary, where Jack is playing with a saline bag. Daniel tells him that something brushed against him in the Linvers chamber and about his hallucinations. He says he translated a phrase on the tablet as ‘enter by infiltration’; he rambles about the Goa’uld not being dead and realizes how crazy he sounds. He suggests he’s having a nervous breakdown.

Psychiatrist, Dr MacKenzie, suggests Daniel has suffered the first psychotic episode of a schizophrenic disorder. His history of headaches provides more background evidence throwing Jack’s headaches briefly into doubt, the question is raised that ‘gate travel led to Daniel’s episode. Fraiser and MacKenzie tell SG1 and Hammond that if Daniel’s symptoms persist he will have to be transferred to mental health.

Jack plays chess with Daniel and insists the episode was caused by stress. Daniel hears a ‘gate dialing again and then sees a Goa’uld take Jack as a host. As Daniel lays on the floor recovering, we, the audience, see something crawl up the side of his cheek under his skin.
Everyone’s worst fears are confirmed and Daniel is committed to mental health. SG1 visit him in his padded cell, he is pale, and his eyes red and sunken. He tells them he is being treated okay and apologies for being such a head case.

Jack believes it is something to do with the Linvers and reminds him that something brushed past him. Daniel has another episode; he hears footsteps and tells his team members they are coming. He laughs and tells them one of the Linvers is stood beside Teal’c and Sam.

Teal’c is sincere and stoic, Sam is obviously distressed and Jack is trying to remain objective. Daniel runs to the Linver and Teal’c restrains him as Sam calls for the aides. Daniel sees something leave him and enter Teal’c’s hand. The aides enter and take him over to the floor and give him a sedative. He hears Ma’chello’s voice as it is administered.

Upon his return to the base Teal’c collapses. Daniel wakes and remembers Ma’chello made inventions to fight the Goa’uld, his eyes flick open and he bangs on the door demanding to see Dr MacKenzie.

Back at base Teal’c is very sick and nothing is making any difference, but he is not hallucinating.

Daniel tries to refuse medication, he says he is fine, and does not need it. He tells MacKenzie he is cured and that an alien organism caused his illness. He tells him that Ma’chello told him, he knows this still sounds crazy, he asks MacKenzie to find out if Teal’c is sick. If Teal’c is sick he insists MacKenzie promise he can talk to Jack.

He tells Jack about Ma’chello’s voice, he theorizes that he had a Goa’uld killing invention inside of him and that it left him because he doesn’t have Goa’uld inside him. Teal’c is sick and he does have a Goa’uld.

They return to base and Daniel is acting normally as he suggests that the device needs close proximity to sense a Goa’uld larvae or adult symbiote. Janet tells him the blood work and imaging show nothing foreign in Teal’c or his symbiote. Sam points out that Ma’chello died six months ago but the bodies had only been there one. Daniel suggests the devices were planted six months or even a year ago. Jack likens it to a landmine.

Sam checks the database catalogue of everything found in Ma’chello’s lab, they find a tablet and stone, matching the one from the Linvers’ chamber.

Sam and Janet use Hazmat protocols to investigate the tablet and stone. They release 10 blue slimy jelly, fish shaped creatures which breach containment. Four enter Sam and three each in Janet and Jack.

Jack and Janet start exhibiting symptoms but Sam is completely normal. She thinks she is immune and wants Dr Warner to take some blood samples, but Hammond won’t risk putting anyone else in danger. He tells her that he will get whoever might be able to help to the observation room but she will have to figure it out on her own.

Suddenly, Sam is in pain, the four slimy jelly creatures drop out of her ear, dead. She hears Ma’chello saying ‘her Goa’uld captor is dead.’ She and Daniel realize that the protein marker left behind when a symbiote is absorbed into the body is what tricked the device into thinking her Goa’uld is dead.

Sam wants to use her blood to create a cure, Dr Warner says it is impossible and could take months. Janet tells Sam to put blood in centrifuge; Dr Warner tells her she is wasting her time.

Janet hallucinates that Sam is a Goa’uld, after a few moments, she tells Sam to put the tube into centrifuge. Dr Warner reminds Sam it is a waste of time, Janet tells them they don’t have to separate the protein, just the red blood cells. Warner realizes they can separate the rejectable parts of blood that make up the various blood types. Warner instructs Sam on how to do this.

Later, Sam injects Janet with her solution, then Jack. As she reaches Jack he calls her Sarah. Janet hears Ma’chello and her creatures leave her, moments later Jack’s do to. Jack picks up one of the dead inventions then flicks it away.

Janet administers the ‘cure’ to Teal’c; it is enough to trick the creature into leaving him.

Fade to black

(1 of 2)

[neverendingimagination]

General Discussion:

The whole episode revolves around Jack’s refusal to believe Daniel is truly sick and Daniel’s refusal to believe his hallucinations. Both falter when harm may come to the other, they do what they feel is necessary to protect the other.

In a way the first three acts are about convincing the heart about what is going on, Jack and Daniel, and the last two are about convincing the mind, Sam and Janet. Both pairs of friends work together, Sam and Jack believing in Janet and Daniel even when they are hallucinating, to get answers and find a cure.

I think the concept of rival Goa’uld structures, designed to combat the power of the System Lords is something that could have been used to better potential. We regularly hear from the Tok’ra about minor Goa’uld’s and the benefits of keeping the system lords squabbling - surely war between the System Lords and other fractions could be just as beneficial. Depleting each others resources and keeping everyone occupied?

The System Lords have many minor Goa’uld working for them, I would assume the Linver’s had the same, but obviously to a lesser extent. Would these minor Goa’uld not reformed the Linver group? Or were they a wayward fraction that dissolved once the driving force was killed?

Even if the Linver’s (themselves and their ‘followers) were no more they may have had resources or plans in place that could have been utilized by the Tok’ra.

Continuity:

Jack flicking the fish away and wiping his fingers is akin to his slightly immature side, it’s also a trait that surfaces later on, when, as a General, he hurriedly puts down symbiote poison and wipes his fingers, apparently, to get rid of any contaminates.

As is mentioned in the Gateworld analysis, Daniel initially assumes that the tablet contains the details of the Linvers’ attack or battle plans but the phrase ‘enter by infiltration’ suggests it was actually Ma’chello’s tablet.

Janet states that there is no history of mental illness with Daniel’s family but by the end of the season we discover his grandfather is in a mental institution. This should have been discovered in this episode, although, obviously, episode 21 probably wouldn’t have been developed at the time this was written.

Character development:

Sam:

Sam finally finds a positive trait left by Jollinar’s blending. So far all the elements left behind by Jollinar have all had negative repercussions for her, the ability to use Goa’uld technology, specifically the hand device, the memories, emotions and thoughts which are not her own and the ability to detect a Goa’uld. Although the ability to detect a Goa’uld is useful in combat she ends up being used like a walking ‘metal’ detector, checking out everyone who crosses the Stargate – I don’t know about Sam but I would find it annoying.

Sam’s little stutter when she gets excited stands makes an appearance this episode. It seems to appear mostly at the beginning of a scientific sentence, and usually when she says ‘I’. I think the stutter is deliberate on because Sam seems to grow out of it in following seasons – it reappears again to an extent with Moebius Sam.

Jack:

Jack’s affections for his friend come to the fore in this episode. He won’t believe Daniel is suffering from a mental breakdown, right from the earliest discussion in the briefing room. Even when Daniel is confined to a padded cell he still treats him normally and looks for an explanation.

When Daniel has an episode in the cell Sam is obviously upset and Teal’c retains his composure, but, in the background Jack’s face is contorting with emotion, which he quickly covers as he takes command of the situation.

He barely hesitates to believe Daniel when he tells him he is cured and Ma’chello is behind his ‘episodes’.

Daniel:

Daniel knows that he is hallucinating and controls his urges for as long as possible, he finally reacts when he believes Jack is in imminent danger. Even when he knows it isn’t real he cannot stand by and see harm come to his friend.

He also fights tooth and nail to get Jack to believe him that there is something inside Teal’c.

It is Jack and Daniel’s faith in each other, which eventually leads to the discovery of the tablet, and blue fish like creatures. In comparison, as Scientists, Sam and Janet question Daniel’s theories more but they bring them to fruition.

Janet:

We see more of Janet’s determination and resolve in this episode, traits she has exhibited from her first episode, The Broca Divide.

Teal’c:

We see very little of Teal’c in this episode, he provides more knowledge about the hierarchical structure of the Goa’uld’s.

Favourite line(s):

Jack – I’d like to apologise in advance for anything that I might say or do that could be construed as offensive, as I slowly go nuts!

Jack – You look terrible.
Sam – Thank you sir.

Favourite Scene(s):

My favourite scene is actually a favourite sequence. From Sam’s insistence there is a way to use her blood to make a cure, through Janet’s fight to stay lucid. Whilst Warner is telling them it is hopeless they refuse to give up. This sequence encapsulates everything SG1 stands for, solidarity in the face of adversity and never leaving a man behind.

Jack and Sam Moment(s):

Perhaps Sam giving Jack his shot could be considered shippy.

Jack – You look terrible.
Sam – Thank you sir.

In a distant way, Jack’s reaction to Daniel’s episodes, in that he is determined to believe that some unknown alien technology is to blame, could be attributed to the time he has spent with Sam. Her insistence on everything having a scientific explanation could be rubbing off on him (Alongside his refusal to believe his best friend is suffering from a serious mental health illness.).

Apologies for the length. This is my first shipper review so please let me know if I've forgotten anything and what I can improve for my next one - other than the length, that I already know.

(2 of 2)

[Sparky She-Demon]

Good review!

[Samfan13]

Thank you both Hlndncr and neverendingimagination for the lovely reviews. I don't nearly get enough on here but both your reviews had me smiling

Great job!

[hlndncr]

Nice banner! Good review.

If there was never an episode crying out for a sequel it was Holiday and the Machello story. Legacy proves there just wasn't enough good story there to warrant another episode IMHO.

Even the EP Jonathan Glassner said that the scene in the science lab was the most boring thing he had ever seen. After asking the composer to help them out with it he claims it transformed the scene to "completely on-the-edge-of-your-seat riveting." I'll good music can help a bad scene but it just can't make up for a terrible plot. In this case the most interesting music in the scene is the music. The rest is still just boring.

I think the concept of rival Goa’uld structures, designed to combat the power of the System Lords is something that could have been used to better potential. We regularly hear from the Tok’ra about minor Goa’uld’s and the benefits of keeping the system lords squabbling - surely war between the System Lords and other fractions could be just as beneficial. Depleting each others resources and keeping everyone occupied?

The System Lords have many minor Goa’uld working for them, I would assume the Linver’s had the same, but obviously to a lesser extent. Would these minor Goa’uld not reformed the Linver group? Or were they a wayward fraction that dissolved once the driving force was killed?

Even if the Linver’s (themselves and their ‘followers) were no more they may have had resources or plans in place that could have been utilized by the Tok’ra.

ACK!!! If there is one thing calculated to tick me off it's when a show chooses the wrong story. The whole time I'm watching this episode I keep thinking the Linvers was the much more interesting storyline here! Why aren't we watching something about that? Instead, this wonderful, potentially rich vein of goa'uld mythology and story development it becomes merely a throw away after thought we never hear of again. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Janet states that there is no history of mental illness with Daniel’s family but by the end of the season we discover his grandfather is in a mental institution. This should have been discovered in this episode, although, obviously, episode 21 probably wouldn’t have been developed at the time this was written.

This is a good catch. I hadn't thought of that. Maybe Janet was not aware of Daniel's grandfather, but that is a bit of a stretch.

Sam:

Sam finally finds a positive trait left by Jollinar’s blending. So far all the elements left behind by Jollinar have all had negative repercussions for her, the ability to use Goa’uld technology, specifically the hand device, the memories, emotions and thoughts which are not her own and the ability to detect a Goa’uld. Although the ability to detect a Goa’uld is useful in combat she ends up being used like a walking ‘metal’ detector, checking out everyone who crosses the Stargate – I don’t know about Sam but I would find it annoying.

I don't know that I would agree that all the consequences from Jolinar were bad up to this point. They discovered the Tok'ra because of Jolinar's memories. Granted they are a pain in the butt, but still and important ally and it saved her dad's life. I would call that a positive consequence.

Sam's ability to use the goa'uld healing device to heal Cronus in the previous episode, Fair Game, saved earth and the stargate program by uncovering Nirtii's treachery providing necessary leverage to push the treaty through with the important concession of keeping the earth's gates. I'd call that positive.

Her use of the hand device killed Seth. I know Sam found it distasteful, but it did make earth safer. I think Sam would consider that on balance a positive.

Sam’s little stutter when she gets excited stands makes an appearance this episode. It seems to appear mostly at the beginning of a scientific sentence, and usually when she says ‘I’. I think the stutter is deliberate on because Sam seems to grow out of it in following seasons – it reappears again to an extent with Moebius Sam.

This is interesting. I don't remember this. Could you please point out a specific scene so that I can go back and listen for it?

As for shippy moments they basically don't exist, but I do like the scene where Jack is being flip about the potential health hazards of gate travel and Sam goes right along. Jack is clearly having an effect on our normally formal, reserved and by the book Sam.

My Ratings

Episode: 3: Boring
At this point, it’s getting irritating to watch. I will turn the TV off! There’s just no point to watching this. How can this even get past the script stage? Someone needs to be fired.

Shippiness: 4: Sub Par
This is a humdrum level of shippiness that doesn’t live up to its potential. It’s just tolerable. I mean, really, I have better things to do than watch this.

[neverendingimagination]

Thanks hlndncr (one of these days I'm going to remember how to spell your name without double checking it lol)

I'm sure its been said several times about Ma'chello's story being underused, such a plethora of material and possibilities... meh

You're quite right about the good sides to being blended with Jollinar. I still say that if I was Sam I'd be getting annoyed, walking naquadah detector, SG1's very own 'Data' recalling information about the Tok'ra to order and handy storage device for a vaccine against Ma'chello's devices. I think learning to use the hand/healing devices would present an interesting challenge for her.

Sam's stutter is so cute, I think its quite prominent, or perhaps that's me over analysing verbal ticks. I took these two lines from Legacy, I've definitely heard it in other too but the ones I randomly picked to find some were episodes where she didn't have anything to get excited about.

About 8 minutes from the end, just after the blue creatures have broken containment.

Sam: I, I know that but I feel fine.

Sam: Sir, I, I, I’d like Dr Warner t, t, to take some blood to try to figure out why.

I'm on the look out for more examples, I can picture her stuttering talking to Jack in the briefing room about something, I can hear her saying 'Sir I I I think...' but I can't remember what she thinks to work out what episode it is.

[Samfan13]

I agree on the stuttering. Even my boyfriend who only just started to watch SG with me (Yeehaaa ) picked it up.

It's so cute

[hlndncr]

OK, how did I totally miss this stuttering? Now I'm going to have to listen more closely.

[hlndncr]

Thanks hlndncr (one of these days I'm going to remember how to spell your name without double checking it lol)

I'm sure its been said several times about Ma'chello's story being underused, such a plethora of material and possibilities... meh

You're quite right about the good sides to being blended with Jollinar. I still say that if I was Sam I'd be getting annoyed, walking naquadah detector, SG1's very own 'Data' recalling information about the Tok'ra to order and handy storage device for a vaccine against Ma'chello's devices. I think learning to use the hand/healing devices would present an interesting challenge for her.

Sam's stutter is so cute, I think its quite prominent, or perhaps that's me over analysing verbal ticks. I took these two lines from Legacy, I've definitely heard it in other too but the ones I randomly picked to find some were episodes where she didn't have anything to get excited about.

About 8 minutes from the end, just after the blue creatures have broken containment.

Sam: I, I know that but I feel fine.

Sam: Sir, I, I, I’d like Dr Warner t, t, to take some blood to try to figure out why.

I'm on the look out for more examples, I can picture her stuttering talking to Jack in the briefing room about something, I can hear her saying 'Sir I I I think...' but I can't remember what she thinks to work out what episode it is.

If it helps, my name is highland dancer with all the extraneous vowels, consonants and spaces removed.

I agree with you that being a naquadah detector would get old, especially since Teal'c can do it sometimes too!

Thanks for the examples of Sam stuttering. I'm going to pay more attention to this.

[neverendingimagination]

If it helps, my name is highland dancer with all the extraneous vowels, consonants and spaces removed.

Ah so it is! I'll try to remember that

[Lucycat]

Great reviews!! SJ_green.gif

[fems]

Nice review.

One thing that really bothers me (besides the extremely boring episode of which I actually found the lab scene the best) is how Jack believes in Daniel and is trying to be supportive of him even though he sounds like a nutjob, and then in Ascension Jack does a complete 180 when it concerns Sam! He doesn't even bother giving her the benefit of the doubt there and basically says she's crazy and having a burnout.

Such inconsistency.