Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

[bradly08]

That fits the Anubis/Yu story excellently. I'd never thought of that.

of course, some of it is undoubtedly propaganda. Ancient kingdoms made an art of it.

Modern countries have refined that art (Pointing to no nation in particular )

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

Nah, modern nations are too leaky. The ancient cultures did it so well that it's hard for historians to know what's true and what's not. Exhibit A is Egypt. You read Egyptian chronicles and then compare them to Hittite/Assyrian/Jewish records, and it's like a whole other world.

[bradly08]

Nah, modern nations are too leaky. The ancient cultures did it so well that it's hard for historians to know what's true and what's not. Exhibit A is Egypt. You read Egyptian chronicles and then compare them to Hittite/Assyrian/Jewish records, and it's like a whole other world.

Which is why I pay not attention to Ancient history. It's too confusing

[lord groovy]

That fits the Anubis/Yu story excellently. I'd never thought of that.

of course, some of it is undoubtedly propaganda. Ancient kingdoms made an art of it.

Well the way I understood Awinita's story is that her Ancient avatar is nice to the 3 families and only to them. And that would work for a Goa'uld avatar too. As long as she is defending their best interests and not enslaving them, why would they bother about the various genocides perpetrated around the galaxy.

Someone even said earlier that our personal vendetta against the Goa'uld was not about protecting the other humans of MW but just in reaction to Ra's and Apophis's threats and attacks. Had they left Earth alone we may even be considering as a necessary evil (like the Tok'ra used to think)

[Exthalion]

By the way: Alfar. I'm very hesitant about their supposed creation. I'd much rather they already existed, and the Asgard simply didn't know those energy storms were beings (much like the Atlantis team in Home).

They did already exist. However, when they reached a certain age/level of development they died. In doing so, they released exotic particles and a great deal of energy. These served as 'nutrients' of a sort. When this happened, lessor energy patterns would develop and existing ones would use it to increase themselves.

It was a natural part of their lifecycle. The Asgard just accidentally created a medium able to sustain them after that part of their lifecycle. I suppose a metaphor would be, that previously they all died at the end of adolescence. Now they can survive into adulthood.

The biggest contribution the Asgard made to their development was giving them time enough to develop.

Edit: What I meant by the Asgard realizing what they had done, was this: The N.I.G. cascade dissipated a large number of the pre-Alfar storms. So in effect they had committed near genocide. The smaller storms would barely qualify as being of animal level of intelligence. The larger ones, which were much more adversely affected by the N.I.G. explosions were as intelligent as oh... nine year olds.

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

Ah, okay. That makes much more sense.

[Princess Awinita]

I also wouldn't mind the Chinese having an Ancient influence the begining of their society, but there should be no advanced stuff (that is, advanced for Stargate) and the Ancient should be long gone.

True, but I said WHAT IF, just like the Admiral did

Isn't it already a tenant of Chinese culture that three semi-divine individuals were the first sovereigns who taught the Chinese people fire, construction, farming, and silk making? Sounds like Ancients to me.

Which fits in nicely to history. Is it not also said that the first emporer of china rode a dragon? (spaceship?)

This is true. The jade Emporer was I assume in Stargate, the basis for Lord u as he did keeep peace with earth as much as possible from what I recall, and he was also the only one against allowing Anubis back intot heir ranks.

I thought Stargate canon already establishes the Goa'uld System Lord Yu as instrumental in Chinese history and culture. If you wanted to introduce an Ancient in the mix you'd have to take Yu into account.

I had thought about this, but the Ancient was before Lord Yu even was born as the game itself took place several billion years before the Goa'ul.d came to power.

You know I have to agree Lord Yu is given the credit for helping set up China so I think we should just stick with that

Again I refer to my first line in this post, I said WHAT IF

And I had forgotten Yu. He does seem to be a problem for the Ancient stuff.

True,, but I hate repeating myself, and said what I did thinknig it a what if, and only that colony would be directly from the Ancients.

And it seems that he was the nicest Goa'uld when he was younger.

Awinita, if you need a female counterpart (Xiao Sha or someone else) just have one of his infant goa'uld left on Earth to guide the Chinese. And she would probably inspire as much respect towards herself as her father did when he was alive.

You could even explained the sudden rise of your Chinese families by the decision of Xiao Sha to retrieve her father legacy.

Note : BTW what happened to Yu's First Prime? Is he still alive? He was probably as smart as Teal'c but more aligned with the System Alliance POV.

This sounds like a good idea, what does others think? As to his first prime? I've always thought him fleeing like mad to save his own skin

I agree about Yu being much better than the other Goa'uld, but it was more apathy than niceness, I think. He just didn't care about us. However, I can't think of a single time he fought Earth (except when the Jaffa attacked him under Imhotep), and he almost always helped us. At the very least, he was a decent Goa'uld.

I assume his First Prime was slaughtered mercilessly by Replicator Carter.

you speak true, I too can't recall a fight he had with us, I do rememer him coming to earth lookikng for sancutary

It even looks like he was not that far from ascension if you consider the demon to be Anubis. So he may not be as rotten as the other Goa'ulds. But I'll agree that as an Emperor he probably didn't like people openly disapproving him. That would have made him fairly...disappointed.

I've once wrote part of a story (then alter scrapped it) that Lord Yu was originally an Ancient. But that's beside the point, I just posted what I did because it was on my mind and I truly actually wondered what everyone thought of my colony being found by accident by one of the fleets many ships

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

Saying "what if" is asking for criticism.

But I believe the idea has merit, at least.

[Davidtourniquet]

Just to let you know guys I've written about 800 words for the opening battle with the Lucian Alliance (although I've only covered the Earth attack at the moment).

[Exthalion]

Might I solicit some advice?

One of the slight issues I am having with the Alfar is how they interact with the rest of the world. Obviously using their crystal medium as a sort of body is impractical.

Any ideas? Or will I have to use telepathy and they are slightly ascendant?

[puddlejumperOZ]

that makes no secne why would you let her go not to mention why would she let you go also why would the ausses be anywhere near the fight point where anubis ships where

As I said the outline is not set in stone and keeping her would indeed be a better option long term. And if you look at this map you'll see why both Australia and New Zealand would be the nearest nations that have a permanent presence in Antarcita nearest to McMurdo, which is the closest referrence point in the show to where the battle took place. The French also have territory nearby, but they are only there briefly in the summer.

I don't understand the purpose of giving Australia of all places not only an Al'kesh but a goa'uld prisoner as well. It seems to muddy the water and puts a slant on international relations that are already canon since SGA.

.

Why not? If any nation finds wreckage on the their territorial claim, it is their right to salvage it. And as for International relations, that only applies to the Atlantis mission, the SGC is still a closed club, USA, Britain, China, France and Russia. As far as I know, no one else has been invited into the IOA circle thus far. The US, via the SGC took upon themself to hide the Stargate programme, why would it not be feasible for any other nation who stumbled across alien tech, to benefit from it and use it to their own advantage

[Crazy Tom]

Might I solicit some advice?

One of the slight issues I am having with the Alfar is how they interact with the rest of the world. Obviously using their crystal medium as a sort of body is impractical.

Any ideas? Or will I have to use telepathy and they are slightly ascendant?

How about having them remote control biological bodies through crystal up-links in their nervous systems, and then later, robotics.

lol, no one is putting anything on anything, take it easy guy. It was just a recommendation.

The issue it was intended to address is the potential for using a Naq powered ship as a weapon, since it would probably do a hell of a lot more damage than a Boeing flown into a building. One potential solution is military personnel (possibly disguised) on every ship coming into UNEC space (kind of like the Israeli approach to airline security). Another solution is registering every constructed Naq generator and placing kill-switches on ship deployed models. Another solution is a modified N-jammer approach Gundam-verse uses. In the Gundam case the N-jammer stops all nuclear reactions within a specific radius. Power plants, bombs, everything. One could propose something similar for Stargate, but I can't think of anything from canon that suggests that anyone has the know how to do something like that.

No one would be stupid enough to suggest that tech control eliminates the problem but it can at least mitigate it.

Well the plainclothes agents would be best I think, and having ships land in spaceports that have force fields to redirect detonation upward away form population. Aside form that, better sensors to detect cloaks.

[blackluster]

Why not? If any nation finds wreckage on the their territorial claim, it is their right to salvage it. And as for International relations, that only applies to the Atlantis mission, the SGC is still a closed club, USA, Britain, China, France and Russia. As far as I know, no one else has been invited into the IOA circle thus far. The US, via the SGC took upon themself to hide the Stargate programme, why would it not be feasible for any other nation who stumbled across alien tech, to benefit from it and use it to their own advantage

I'm not disputing salvage practice, I simply don't understand your purpose in doing it.

Are you trying to give Australia secret technology that you can bring in on a whim from outside the agreed tech stream? Are you trying to give Australia a leg up in terms of Australian technicians gaining favour over those from other countries? Is your intention to create an independent storyline for Australia to conduct extraterrestrial affairs by itself? Like I said, I don't understand the purpose. What does giving Australia an Al'kesh and a goa'uld prisoner allow you to do in terms of the story you want to write that you cannot do with the overview background Mcoy has developed? I have no problem if there is particular reason for story crafting sake, I just can't see what that is and without that understanding, your original suggestion seems unfair to other nations in terms of how you might choose to use it.

Well the plainclothes agents would be best I think, and having ships land in spaceports that have force fields to redirect detonation upward away form population. Aside form that, better sensors to detect cloaks.

Well, those are some more ideas added to the pool. Just a note that a hijacked ship would most likely not head to a port and a ship acting as an IED wouldn't need to be cloaked as it would follow some innocuous course until its target was within striking distance giving very little time to respond. Both are valid countermeasures nonetheless.

[Crazy Tom]

I think he's using it more as general back-story. It doesn't make sense for the big players in the IOA to continue a monopoly on off-world tech when so much of it is lying around.

[lord groovy]

Might I solicit some advice?

One of the slight issues I am having with the Alfar is how they interact with the rest of the world. Obviously using their crystal medium as a sort of body is impractical.

Any ideas? Or will I have to use telepathy and they are slightly ascendant?

Well from what I gathered, initially the Asgard left some lifeforms on their planet so they could have use them as some kind of puppets. That's akin to the electronic entity that possessed Carter once.

Later when they got access to more Asgard technology they could start manufacturing bodies more suitable than whatever they used before. And as you said, they could have multiple bodies everywhere in their galaxy and just upload their consciousness in one of them when they need to perform a particular action (building ships, artificial body factories or simply diplomacy with organic races).

You could also have them just copy their consciousness into an artificial body and leave the original mind on their home world. It would be like the cybrids of the Hyperion novels by Dan Simmons. They have a backup and can be resurrected as long as the original AI/mind has not been destroyed. But each new cybrid is somewhat different from the last version though sharing the same memories.

The major drawback of these 2 last solutions is that is a race that doesn't really need to develop hyperspace technology and would prefer using relay satellites to travel around. So to trap them you just have to go around and destroy every last relays.