Fanfic Pet Peeves

[Whytewytch]

Holy cow, am I behind on this thread! From something that was barely fogging the mirror when I first joined it, this has become quite the little spot of frenetic activity.

First, I am in total agreement with most of the last few pages. To whit:

Originally Posted by mathpiglet
I'm sorry.

I've read so many of these, encouraging the authors along and then they stop. I feel like I've been dumped! So, when I write, I complete the story, edit the story and then start posting.
Goose: Oh no, don't be! I'm well aware that this practice annoys a lot of people, but it's just the way I work; I can't change it, and if someone doesn't like it, then they're more than welcome to come back once I'm finished

This is how I work as well. I simply cannot write the whole thing and then post it. I do try to have a few chapters written before I begin but that does not always ensure that I remain ahead. It does help to fill in gaps due to my muse disappearing on me or life keeping me from writing.

SF_and_Coffee: My characters pretty much always just do their thing and then tell me about it. That's part of what my issue is with my current chapter... the character in question is dithering over something and I'm waiting for him to make up his mind how he wants to deal with it. Fortunately, he and the others have already told me how the rest of the story goes overall. I think he's just wondering how much to tell me about this current thing that's going on.

I have always said that I am not the author of my stories, just the transcriber; it is my characters who tell me how things are going to play out.

Goose--I totally agree with your statement about reviews. While the reviews of, "oh, I luv it, mor plz" (yup, purposefully misspelled--I am just that much of a female dog to notice such things), are nice, I prefer someone who takes the time to dissect the story. Tell me what worked, tell me what didn't. If my beta and I missed some spelling or grammar, let me know. Many authors will take advice to heart, whether or not they change anything because of the review. Not sure if I already told this story, but I once had a reviewer (who had been clamoring for more sax in my story), then tell me there was too much sax. I thought long and hard (no pun intended) & consulted my beta as well as other readers who were invested in the story. The consensus was that, considering the characters were young, healthy, newly married and had no cable (it was placed in the 12th century), the amount of sax they were engaging in was appropriate. Mind, as the characters grew and began to have children and more responsibilities, that aspect of their life naturally waned a bit.


SF_and_Coffee, I am approaching my 45th birthday. I also grew up having spelling and vocabulary quizzes every week, as well as diagramming sentences to learn about how to use the various parts of speech. I was laughing when I read how you don't use text speak that often, even in your texts as I am the same way. My kids make me crazy when the say the word, LOL, instead of just laughing. They do this with other text language as well.


Feast of the Muse:

Spoiler:

Congratulations on your decision to serve your country. I had considered joining one of the services when I was younger, but I have strabismus and in those days, they would not take someone with a lazy eye. My 15 year old son was in the Naval Sea Cadets program, but he found that they were not really doing anything and has decided to put his energies elsewhere. He still intends to join the Navy when he is older, however. He would like to be involved with Naval Intelligence.

HUGE fanfic/regular fic/website/general life pet peeve:

Bad spelling, poor grammar, misuse of words, misuse of abbreviations in ANY published venue. Grammar gods and goddesses, I will join you in being annoyed by this. If you are going to take the time to post something, please do it right, especially if you are presenting yourself as an expert. I was researching for another person's question on another thread (what star sign is Henry from Sanctuary?). I visited multiple sites and found that while the information may have been correct, I doubted it because the sites could not even correctly spell the zodiacal sign in question. My manager has this tendencey, as well. She will send out "congradulations" to people who have achieved various things. I know, I know, I am the afore-mentioned female dog, but my pleasure in winning is sllightly tainted by the misspelling. I do tend to go a little easier on thread postings, blogs, etc, unless the mistakes are many and obvious.

[Goose]

SF_and_Coffee, I am approaching my 45th birthday. I also grew up having spelling and vocabulary quizzes every week, as well as diagramming sentences to learn about how to use the various parts of speech. I was laughing when I read how you don't use text speak that often, even in your texts as I am the same way. My kids make me crazy when the say the word, LOL, instead of just laughing. They do this with other text language as well.

Countdown has done so much for me! (For those of you not from Britain and have no idea what I'm on about, Countdown is a game show where contestants have half a minute to find the longest word they can from nine different letters. It's something of a cultural institution here in the UK.)

[SF_and_Coffee]

Countdown has done so much for me! (For those of you not from Britain and have no idea what I'm on about, Countdown is a game show where contestants have half a minute to find the longest word they can from nine different letters. It's something of a cultural institution here in the UK.)

That sounds like a fun show!

[Whytewytch]

I'm new to this thread and only read back a few pages ... I just wanted to comment that I found the discussion on reviews - useful or otherwise - very interesting. I'm not sure about others but for me, posting a story is the part of writing fanfic I like the least. Reviewer behaviour is a big part of that ... because I write the entire story before I start posting (tried it the other way a couple of times, once very recently and it was a total disaster each time). I always feel this great excitement to begin posting which is usually crushed after the first chapter or two is posted. I'll have my loyal few readers (thank god for them!) comment plus one or two others and that's it ... not sure why I expect each new story to be different . I'm an analytical sort, so I look at numbers and compare with what I see across the fics (ff.net is where I post and read), plus through the stats page ...

So I guess my fanfic peeve is about reader behaviour. What makes a person review a story? And if you read something and don't review what message should that send to the author? I can't help but think it just means you didn't like the story very much and can't think of anything positive to say about it. I review everything I read - and I'll admit up front I don't read a lot of fics, and usually only completed fics aside from people I trust to finish their stories. It's not that hard to take a minute or two and find something you liked or that was interesting etc to encourage an author.

Obviously I haven't developed a thick enough skin to ignore the discouraging comments ... not sure how people get to that stage.

First of all, welcome to the thread!

Second--dang it! Forgot to address this comment. Here goes:

As a reader, I will post reviews on most stories that I read. When I do not review:

1. The story is so bad that I feel like I would be starting an "internet battle" by reviewing. Not that I'm afraid of expressing my opinions, just that I am cautious of repercussions against my own work. Last thing I have time for is someone sniping at my work because theirs is of such poor quality.

2. If the story is good, but the voice/characterization is ALL wrong. I recently read a fic where Allan A'Dale (from the RH BBC fandom) was the protagonist. The story was told by him, about him. The back story idea was very good. However, the voice was totally off. Allan is intelligent, but uneducated and speaks with a Cockney (?) accent, dropping his H's and such. His language is very colorful. He is a peasant and has a peasant's crudeness at times. The way the story was written, he sounded more like an educated lord. This was the person's first posting in this community and I would have felt bad telling them all of this in a review.

When I review, I like to be sure that there is something postive I can point out and that the problems are not major ones. (Great storyline! Have you thought of using a beta to catch your misspellings?) Mind, I usually go into greater depth (Love how you've pitted Robin & Guy in this psychological battle! You've really got their mannerisms down. BTW, it's "the king" or "King Richard", not "the King". Have you thought of using a beta to help you catch these type of things?)

[Whytewytch]

That sounds like a fun show!

I second that!

[Skydiver]

IMHO, we have a whole generation and a half that are selfish self centered, self absorbed jerks.

they sincerely and honestly expect the whole world to alter to cater to them and only them, and have zero empathy or respect for others.

There are certainly pairings out there that I simply cannot stand...i don't read them. Plain and simple. It's not my place, nor is it right for me to dictate what people can/can't write. So you just live and let live and let them be.

[Goose]

IMHO, we have a whole generation and a half that are selfish self centered, self absorbed jerks.

they sincerely and honestly expect the whole world to alter to cater to them and only them, and have zero empathy or respect for others.

There are certainly pairings out there that I simply cannot stand...i don't read them. Plain and simple. It's not my place, nor is it right for me to dictate what people can/can't write. So you just live and let live and let them be.

Exactly! It's always nice if people label their stories so that you know before hand what to expect, but just because I don't like something doesn't mean that I don't want anyone else to read/write it.

[SF_and_Coffee]

Exactly. I try very hard to approach these things the same way I approach real life: I don't have to be into whatever you're into, and you don't have to be into whatever I'm into... as long as nobody gets hurt, do what you like. I may not want to watch, and you may not want to watch me either, but we all have the right to look away.

[Feast of the Muse]

Idle speculation:

I wonder how much of people's varying levels of difficulty in knowing which homonym to use in each particular case can be traced in part to the method by which they learned to read. As in, whole-word, phonics, or hybrid method.

/idle speculation

I wish we could take a poll. I learned phonetically. I remember in high school that some of my classmates were particularly bad at spelling even though they were in a lot of our AP classes. I did ask them about their phonics. One boy looked at me like I had 3 heads. A few more question and I found out that he was only taught to recognize and pronounce words as a whole, basically one at a time. So getting down to the individual letters of a word was not part of his early education.

Some education systems should be terminated.

[Whytewytch]

Some education systems should be terminated.

Careful! Say that too loud these days (at least in America) & public schools will disappear altogether. BANG! Budget cut.

I also totally agree with Skydiver

Spoiler:

about how spoiled people are these days. I had a whole rant typed out, then realized how utterly off topic it was. Plus, it was getting my blood pressure up just thinking about it. Off for a hot toddy and my nap now. Dang kids. **shakes cane in the air** LOL

As for people flaming or giving bad reviews over pairings they don't like, I totally agree with what's been said--if you don't like, don't read. I used to not like slash, so I didn't read it. Then, I read a few good ones and got hooked. I still don't read certain pairings, exercising my prerogative just as I would when shopping at the book store. But just as in the book store, if I don't like a certain book, that doesn't mean someone else won't. It's all part of our individualism.

[SF_and_Coffee]

I wish we could take a poll. I learned phonetically. I remember in high school that some of my classmates were particularly bad at spelling even though they were in a lot of our AP classes. I did ask them about their phonics. One boy looked at me like I had 3 heads. A few more question and I found out that he was only taught to recognize and pronounce words as a whole, basically one at a time. So getting down to the individual letters of a word was not part of his early education.

Some education systems should be terminated.

Well, there are good and bad sides to it. I got the hybrid system, myself. We used the Dick and Jane books, which are whole word method. We also had phonics right alongside it, so we got a jumpstart by recognizing a large number of short words early on, which gave us the interest and impetus to continue -- because, hey look, I can read a book! All by myself! And then the phonics work built on that.

Ironically, earlier generations often used ONLY the Dick and Jane whole word approach... and yet it seems to me that those generations have a lower incidence of people who couldn't spell to save their lives. The problem with phonics, when used to teach reading and writing in a language like English, is that the language itself is non-phonetic. You can teach some languages very well using phonics, but English has such an inordinately high number of non-standard words, non-standard spellings, or just plain alternate spellings for the same phonetic sound, coupled with alternate pronunciations for the same letters or letter groupings, that it is well-nigh impossible to teach it using phonics alone.

Think of laugh, cough, through, trough, etc. And that's just one small example, wherein you not only have differing sounds for the "gh" but also for the "ou".

[Akamaimom]

I honestly can't remember what my mom used to teach me how to read (I read before I entered kindergarten at 4 years old). **shrugs**

My kids have been taught using various methods. My oldest and my third child also read before kindergarten, but we really didn't use a method with them. We read to them--a LOT. One day, I was reading a new book to my third child, and sneezed, and she finished the paragraph for me. I didn't know she could read on her own until then. My second finally got it in kindergarten, and my youngest learned in preschool, but her teacher used Spalding, which uses phonograms. Now, my 4 oldest kids all go to a charter school where they use the Spalding method. My first grader (#4) entered first grade reading at 85 words per minute, and now she's up over 150. My third grader has read all of the Harry Potter books and has graduated to even older reading, my fifth grader is at that same level (she's Asperger's, so things came a little slower to her) and my seventh grade son has been reading Tom Clancy's books for about two years now.

Having said that, none of them can do math to save their little souls. (Not really--but they're not advanced in it at all.)

I like the phonics method of Spalding. It seems to work for my kids, at least, but I know others that didn't do as well. And regardless of how much they read, which is a TON, two of my kids still can't spell when they're writing on their own.

I used to tutor kids in college, and the worst grammar always came out of California and New Zealand. My university was incredibly diverse, and the best grammar was from the Japanese second language students, and the kids who came in from Arizona. Bizarre. We never could figure it out.

My degree is in English Language and Lit, though, so I think I'm way more interested in grammar than other people. And I was raised by a woman who has 5--yes--FIVE degrees in English (two bachelor's, two master's, and a doctorate), so I think that I got a little more than the average person when I was little.

I still think, though, that if you're going to publish something, you should know how to either proofread it, or you should find someone who can. I think it shows some respect for the language itself. Whenever I write something in Spanish, for example (I speak that, too), I always have someone who writes it and speaks it better than I do proof it for me.

[Goose]

English isn't the easiest language in the world; it's very irregular, so I can't blame even native speakers for getting it wrong from time to time.

[Skydiver]

my niece is learning by sounding out words. before she was 4 she could sound out words...G.a.p....jap on my sweat shirt (we had to work a bit to get her to believe me that it was pronounced ga, not ja

[SF_and_Coffee]

I honestly can't remember what my mom used to teach me how to read (I read before I entered kindergarten at 4 years old). **shrugs**

My kids have been taught using various methods. My oldest and my third child also read before kindergarten, but we really didn't use a method with them. We read to them--a LOT. One day, I was reading a new book to my third child, and sneezed, and she finished the paragraph for me.

It was largely like that for me. I learned to read by being read to at home, from infancy. But I'm pretty sure it was largely whole-word, as at the time parents were being told NOT to teach their children to read prior to kindergarten, for fear of doing it "wrong" (As a reference point, I started kindergarten in 1969.) So I just figured it out by following along with my mom, and a fair bit of memorization on my own, which had me knowing some words by sight at age 2 or 3, and figuring out the gist of phonics on my own at 4. But once I began school, the school threw both whole-word and phonics at us.

Ironically, at the time kindergartners in my school were not even taught reading. That was for 1st grade. But a small percentage of us came in either reading or on the very cusp of it, so they finally got smart and skimmed off those of us who were there and sent us down the hall for reading group with one of the 1st-grade teachers several times a week. Saved my sanity, I can tell you that much, because until they did that I was bored off my ass -- at age 5. By 5th grade, I read at a high school level, because my house was full of books, none of which were off-limits to me if I could manage the words in them.

Having said that, none of them can do math to save their little souls. (Not really--but they're not advanced in it at all.)

I actually wasn't bad at math either, until they threw "new math" at us in 3rd grade. Messed with my head - and everyone else's - for a few years, though I got it squared away in high school. Mom was an artist, Dad an engineer, so I'm kind of both right- and left-brained. That's my excuse, anyway.

I like the phonics method of Spalding. It seems to work for my kids, at least, but I know others that didn't do as well. And regardless of how much they read, which is a TON, two of my kids still can't spell when they're writing on their own.

I'm not familiar with Spalding. Information, please?

My degree is in English Language and Lit, though, so I think I'm way more interested in grammar than other people. And I was raised by a woman who has 5--yes--FIVE degrees in English (two bachelor's, two master's, and a doctorate), so I think that I got a little more than the average person when I was little.

I was the first person in my family to get a college degree of any sort, though my father followed not long after, and with a higher degree. Still, kudos to your mom.

I still think, though, that if you're going to publish something, you should know how to either proofread it, or you should find someone who can. I think it shows some respect for the language itself. Whenever I write something in Spanish, for example (I speak that, too), I always have someone who writes it and speaks it better than I do proof it for me.

This. Absolutely, positively, this.