Rodney McKay - The Weakest Link

[Naonak]

carter: does she have family? anyway. sg1 member were friends. and she was in love with jack.

Erm, Jacob...?

[Killdeer]

Erm, Jacob...?

And there was Mark, her brother, who was married with two kids.

[MechaThor]

Sheppard/Teyla - Friends
Sheppard/Ronon - Friends
Ronon/Teyla - Frends
Rodney/Sheppard - Maybe Friends

Rodney and Sheppard are Friends! Infact I would say they are closer as friends than Sheppard and Ronan and Sheppard and Teyla.
Have you not seen the "Returner" that episode clearly shows they are Friends in a socal sense!
Rodney has also showed he is friends with Teyla in recent epsiodes, and has a akward relationship with Ronan, because Mckay don't know what to say to him.

Also I think the Atlantis team get alone equal if not more than SG-1, Yes SG-1 glued as a team, but so have Sheppards team. Not only that the Atlantis team have more involvement with the supporting cast, you have relationships being built between,
Mckay/Caldwell
Sheppard/Caldwell
Mckay/Zelenka
Sam/Zelenka
Lorne/Teyla
Lorne/Sheppard
Lorne/Mckay
Kellar/Mckay
Kellar/Ronan
Zelenka/Lorne
Sheppard/Tod

SG1 tended to only lend as a team, and left alot of the supporting characters out. There was not much between Frasier and the main team apart from Hammond and Sam. Also Bill Lee, had a far amoung of interaction with Sam, Daneil and Landry, buts thats it.

[garhkal]

I have to agree with you, but i think Rodney has come a long way since early SGA and even though he doesn't express it it the same way i get the feeling that he sees his team as very important to him, and his family so to speak.

Part of McKay's charm as a character is his social awkwardness , take that away and you loose some of the essence of his character. As one poster said it would be nice to have some more team moments in season 5 but not just for Rodney, for eveyone involved.

Agreed. Mccay is how he is, at his best under pressure CAUSE he is awkward in social situations. It is how he has developed his mind into the sharp weapon it is. But i do see him changing, with how he handled things in season 2, all the way through the end of 4. I mean, who else wanted to set things right. NO one else but him. Heck, he even stayed back and made himself into the cities hologram just to help his friend shep out..

If Ronon was so close with Rodney, he wouldn't have left Atlantis in "The Last Man" after John and Teyla were gone.

I could be best of friends with you, but if i lost 2 other great friends, but saw a way to make things better i would not hesitate to leave to do so. That is how i saw things with Ronon leaving..

[maxbo]

One of the great things about Stargate SG1 was the interaction between the members of SG1 and how they were all very good friends and would each give their life to save their teammate.

The only thing wrong with Stargate Atlantis is the interaction between the 4 team members is not as good and i think McKay is the weak link.

Spoiler:

Sheppard/Teyla - Friends
Sheppard/Ronon - Friends
Ronon/Teyla - Frends
Rodney/Sheppard - Maybe Friends

McKay on the other hand really isnt friends with any of them (Sheppard is debatable) as shown in the episodes "McKay and Mrs. Miller" where they are all opening laughing AT Mckay (not with) and the episode "Tao of Rodney" where they all discuss his weight in a very negative way.

The interaction with mcKay and the rest of the team is the only thing which is stopping those great team moments which were common in Stargate SG1 and it would be great to see the writers improve the relationship of McKay and the other characaters (especially Ronon and Teyla).

What i would love to see is a episode with McKay, Ronon and Teyla and get some serious growth with Teyla and Ronon getting to understand and appreciate McKay better. A episode with all 3 of them (no Sheppard) would be fantastic where all 3 of them have to rely on each other to survive.

To sum it up i hope that in season 5 the writers include some positive McKay and Ronon and McKay and Teyla moments as i think it will improve them overall team chemistry which at present is the only thing holding Atlantis back.

What do you all think?

Although I love the SG-1 friendships, they occurred so quickly and seamlessly that they added to the fantasy element of the series. The friendships on SGA have a more realistic feel, IMO. And, Rodney, with his socially awkward snarky personality is a prime reason for this more realistic feel.

I believe that the friendships on SGA are just as strong as the friendships on SG1, but that they are just different. Unfortunately, the writing for SGA isn't as strong as it was for early SG-1 so it's understandable that this difference may not be appreciated.

For instance, I agree that the writers haven't done as good a job in showing Rodney's friendship with Teyla and Ronon as they have in showing his friendship with Sheppard. Because I know the writers feel more comfortable writing for Rodney and Sheppard than they do for Teyla and Ronon - it's hard to me to attribute the lack of Teyla/Rodney/Ronon scenes to the characters. So, no, I don't see Rodney as the weakest link, I see the writers as the weakest links.

McKay is friends with all of them, but it'll just never be portrayed the way you want it to unless he loses the snark, which would be bad, imo.

Yes, Rodney losing his snark would be bad.

I can't agree at all with the part of your post about Sheppard and McKay's friendship being debatable. IMO their relationship was far and away the most strongly portrayed relationship in S4 - I believe every single episode had at least a little something portraying just how strong the friendship is between the two of them and how much they rely on each other. And episodes like Doppelganger, Miller's Crossing, Quarantine, Midway, The Seer, The Last Man, Outcast - all of those showed to me just how strong that friendship is. I would argue that Sheppard and McKay are closer to each other than to any one else on Atlantis now that they've lost Elizabeth and Carson. And no, I don't mean that in a slashy sense. Yes, John cares for and watches out for Ronon and Teyla, and Rodney cares for them too. But only with each other did I see them relax a little bit and tease and joke. I think Elizabeth's loss forced them to drop maybe some of the competitiveness that they had previously displayed around her and just work together and start looking out for each other.

I agree that the writers have shown more of Rodney and Sheppard's friendship than any other, so it's not unreasonable to see them as each other's best friend. Although Rodney did call Carson his best friend in Sunday, which I put down as another example of careless writing because by that time, the Rodney/Carson friendship had been severely backburnered since Season 1.

I do agree mostly with this part of your post. While there's been a little progress made with Ronon and Rodney's relationship, mostly toward the end of S3, Teyla and Rodney have had almost no time together, and I have very much been wishing for an episode with just Teyla and Rodney - something that would force them to work together and maybe understand each other more. I'm afraid if it were all three of them however it would end up being Ronon and Teyla against Rodney. I many times feel as though Teyla, and Ronon too sometimes, simply tolerate Rodney because he's a genius and can save their lives, and because he's John's friend. In Quarantine for example,

Spoiler:

John saw Rodney's earpiece lying on the table and realized that Rodney was locked in the biology lab. Teyla started to say "If he is in there..." and John cut her off "he's going to be freaking." She glanced at him and didn't finish, but I got the impression that's not what she had started to say - she was more likely going to say something like "then there is nothing he can do to help us." John's worried about how Rodney's handling this, Teyla (admittedly in my perception) is worried about who's going to get them out of this.

A lot of times it feels like Rodney thinks he's best friends with all of them, but only John really cares about him in return - Teyla and Ronon both just tolerate him for the team's sake. Not always - there have been some good moments, especially with Ronon in the later part of S3, and the tea ceremony with Teyla in Tao, but too often I do get the feeling of a guy that thinks everyone likes him and really behind his back they're just wishing he would shut up and go away.

I agree with you about the lack of Teyla and Rodney scenes and wish for more. However, I disagree that Ronon and Teyla merely tolerate Rodney and if that scene in Quarantine is typical of why you believe Teyla and Ronon don't like Rodney, then it's not a good example because your perception of that scene is off.

Here's what really happened:

Spoiler:

After Sheppard saw Rodney's earpiece, he told Teyla where Rodney was and immediately told her that there were no computers or radios in the botany lab. That's when Teyla realized that Rodney was also trapped with no way out and said, "If he's in there..." and then Sheppard finished her thoughts in his own words... "He must be freaking."

So yeah, I do agree that there is a weakness in how they have portrayed the relationship between Rodney and Ronon and Teyla. While I would never call him the weak link (I personally would not watch this show without him), I would agree that his strongest connection to the team is through John, and that is a team weakness that needs to be worked on by the writers. I don't think it was as obvious until this season because, well, Ronon and Teyla didn't get that much screentime. Elizabeth and Carson both took up more attention, and Rodney was close with both of them, so the lack of a close relationship with his team wasn't as apparent. It wasn't so much something that suddenly happened this year as something that had always been there but didn't become glaringly apparent until those two were removed.

Rodney's lack of significant sceentime with Teyla, Ronon and anyone who isn't Sheppard has always been apparent to me. And, considering that complaints about the McKay/Sheppard hour have been around since the end of Season 1, others have also noticed. I've given up hoping for more balance and now just hope for decent scenes between the characters no matter how infrequently they occur.

[maxbo]

I did say it was my own perception. And neither of us knows what

Spoiler:

Teyla was actually going to say before John cut her off,

so I don't know that anyone can say that one perception is wrong or right, just that we see the scene differently. How is one interpretation less valid than another? I accept that you didn't read it the same way - that's fine. That's just how I took it.

Good point, especially since I incorrectly interpreted your post in my quick read of it - talk about perception. After reading it more carefully, I realize that we saw that scene accurately, but reached different conclusions.

EDIT: Killdeer, why did you delete your post? Now, it looks like I'm talking to myself and I'm already nutty enough.

[Killdeer]

EDIT: Killdeer, why did you delete your post? Now, it looks like I'm talking to myself and I'm already nutty enough.

Sorry. I shouldn't have, but I didn't realize you were responding, and I decided I didn't want to argue about it. So I'm the nutty one, not you. I appreciate your response anyway.

[maxbo]

Sorry. I shouldn't have, but I didn't realize you were responding, and I decided I didn't want to argue about it. So I'm the nutty one, not you. I appreciate your response anyway.

No, I'm sorry and you're not nutty, you're sensible - enjoy it while it lasts.

[Constanza]

No way! McKay is not the weakest link!
To be honest… I hated him at the beginnings of the show (he was annoying), but I started to change my mind very soon as he added lots of humor to every episode.

Come on! Let’s face it: we need him around; saying “we’re so dead” and then snapping his fingers when he gets a brilliant idea…

I believe most of fans have learned to appreciate Rodney as the shows moves forward; and is it easy to imagine that the rest of the main characters have followed that same path as well: you hate him at first, you tolerate him later… and then you kind of appreciate him; besides we have seen him trying to bond with the other members of the crew.

True, Ronon does not seem to appreciate him, but he’ll get there… by season 15 maybe.

[Naonak]

True, Ronon does not seem to appreciate him, but he’ll get there… by season 15 maybe.

I thought the "I need to learn some science" scene from First Strike showed that Ronon does have a respect for what Rodney can do.

[Killdeer]

I thought the "I need to learn some science" scene from First Strike showed that Ronon does have a respect for what Rodney can do.

There's a difference between having respect for what someone can do and caring about them on a personal level. I have no doubt whatsoever that Ronon and Teyla have a great deal of respect for what Rodney can do. They're quite well aware of his value to the expedition and the team. But valuing him as a friend is something completely different, and that's the part I have a hard time seeing sometimes.

[KindlyKeller]

There's a difference between having respect for what someone can do and caring about them on a personal level. I have no doubt whatsoever that Ronon and Teyla have a great deal of respect for what Rodney can do. They're quite well aware of his value to the expedition and the team. But valuing him as a friend is something completely different, and that's the part I have a hard time seeing sometimes.

Agree with this completely.

As a side note, boy am I tired of how whenever the importance of friendships are brought up on this shown (even by John), he's thrown in as "even Rodney," as if he's somehow lesser than everyone else.

[Reiko]

As a side note, boy am I tired of how whenever the importance of friendships are brought up on this shown (even by John), he's thrown in as "even Rodney," as if he's somehow lesser than everyone else.

.: I disagree.

.: I do not think that the team thinks as Rodney as lesser. I think when Shep says "even Rodney", it's in friendly terms. Especially with Rodney's personality, quirks and such.

[KindlyKeller]

.: I disagree.

.: I do not think that the team thinks as Rodney as lesser. I think when Shep says "even Rodney", it's in friendly terms. Especially with Rodney's personality, quirks and such.

I can see how you'd get that impression. That may well be how it's meant. But to me, it's just him being thrown in as an afterthought. Like, that emotional scene with Teyla in "Sateda." He tosses Rodney in begrudgingly at the end, and then Teyla doesn't even mention Rodney, saying that (paraphrasing) "Shep and Dr. Weir have been very welcoming and helpful," as if McKay hasn't been.

This is coming from someone with an enormous Rodney bias, obviously, so one might take this all with a grain of salt.

[Rac80]

Don't like Rodney, never have and never will. I vote him for Wraith-bait! He wihines, he is arrogant, he is simply a jerk! (I'm surprised Zelenka hasn't found an untraceable poison and used it!) He needs to mature a bit (at his age he should be over the childishness...but that could be why he is still single!) and stop the DARN WHINING!!!!!! (ok whining is my pet peeve I admit! ) So stake him out for Todd to feed on! (atleast Todd has a sense of humor )