'Travelers' (405) General Discussion

[morjana]

Also, why does every Ancient ship have to be damaged?

Maybe because the Ancient ships are 10,000 years old?

Also, why didn't they just dock on the warship? Duh. No brainer.

There could have been several reasons, including (but not limited to):

1) Maybe the Puddle Jumper couldn't tell the status of the Ancient ship's shields. If they're on, the Jumper can't dock.

2) Perhaps Lorne didn't want to commit a jumper to docking with the ship. For the very reason as to what happened -- the ship jumped into hyperspace. If the jumper had docked, it would have went with the ship.

Morjana

[bluealien]

Kirking

How do you come to this conclusion. So a man and woman in the same room now means kirking. Shep acted the way he always does. He snarks and charms his way out of a situation.. with women and men, that is who is he. That does not consitute Kirking to me at all. So all his escape attempts and locking up Larrrin and sending a signal to his people is somehow called kirking.!! So he trusted her.. well after saving her life twice I could see how he thougt he could trust her... she came onto him so again I can't really say how that was kirking on his part. He let his guard down because he trusted her..nothing to do with kirking.

Her people would have arrived in minutes anyway so he didnt really ever stand a chance of keeping the Atlantean ship anyway...

[OobeDoobBenubi]

Some good funny bits but the episode was bleh. One funny bit is when the guy said in the beginning that John said his name was Reed Richards I wish they filmed that bit & it was also funny when the leader said "Does he look like a man who is going to die" & John is just sitting there being bored.

[Shan Bruce Lee]

Wow. That was not at all interesting or engaging. Usually I start with the + but today I'll start with the - .

- In terms of basic plot, this was derivative, predictable, and dull. We have seen characters stranded in space on derelict ships billions of times before and Travelers handled the concept more poorly than almost any example you can name from any series. There was nothing compelling about it at all - from the general scenario, to the technical problems, the character interaction, the (non-existent) character development, the action scenes, the infantile humor... the list goes on. It failed to provide points of interest all across the board.

- So there's a new group of people. Okay, so they live in space and are having trouble. The other thing we learned about them was... oh, oops! There was nothing else, had to make room for intense sexual tension!, goofy quips!, and action shots! Seriously, why are we supposed to care about these people, or even be interested in them? This was their introductory episode and we only "got to know" one of them. If the viewer doesn't care about the shiny new aliens the episode is centered around, how do you expect the episode to succeed as a work? Besides Larrin, who was a cheesy overdone rogue female archetype, the other Travelers we met were mere henchmen.

- Larrin is the leader of her people? Really? Why? How did she become the leader? Why is someone so young in such a position? What's the immediate history of her people? Their long term history? (Aside from vague, skimmed-over references.) Were they originally a planet of people that took to space at the last moment? Were they a rag-tag fleet assembled from various planets whose names are not even remembered now? How has the presence of such a group effected the Pegasus Galaxy? Did they salvage technology from Sateda once it was destroyed? Do they have any other potentially interesting connections to things we know? This sort of information would have made the episode much more compelling. The showrunners would probably say, "Hey there! We can't go giving it all away at the start!" I know they usually consider this sort of basic information material for an elaborate 5-season arc, but it's stuff that should be covered in the first 20 minutes. No, that doesn't mean endless boring exposition. There are more ways to structure a story than putting characters in a room telling each other what they are about to do, and subsequently having them go do it, cue short closing scene. What if - and I know this will be shocking to some- you cut out the parts that make the show indistinguishable from a cartoon targeted at preteens and focused on developing the "race" you so heavily promoted as a major new element for the season?

-All the silly leather. Are they superheroes? Is that Larrin's casual wear? Battle wear? Why the cleavage then? This is supposed to be the central figure to the race you are trying to introduce and she saunters on screen, kind of coming off as a total ass. Are we supposed to take her and her race seriously, or roll our eyes and accept that Sheppard will easily outsmart them, if not for...

-Sheppard thinking with the wrong head. Again. Yeah, man. Rock on, Shep. It's totally rad to make out with chicks that just - as you put it - kidnapped you, tortured you, and threatened to throw you out an airlock. Just drop your guard like a good little trained military officer trapped in a hostile environment with untrustworthy foes around and slobber all over her. I sure am glad it's you looking out for the safety of the Pegasus Galaxy! Hey, and no pressure - if you need a lay, you need a lay. Don't worry too much about things like your personal safety or the mission, just get yourself some sweet ass.

- Just had to mention the juvenile humor in its own point.

+ Carter wasn't in the episode.

+ Decent visual effects.

tptb are just trying to expand their audience and not just pander to their base. A little more action and less techno-babble is a good thing. They're getting rid of the exposition and actually showing the sh*t instead.

You can't expect to find out everything about a new race in their first appearance. We learned they're a nomad tribe, they use weapons like Ronan's,they can't be trusted, and they've been actively engaging the Wraith. That's plenty of "side-story" information picked up during the more important "story-story".

[Kribby]

Other than.... WTF was up with the wraith hair??? That one dude looked like he had freaking PIGTAILS!!

HA!

That's what I said!

[Redhooks]

tptb are just trying to expand their audience and not just pander to their base. A little more action and less techno-babble is a good thing. They're getting rid of the exposition and actually showing the sh*t instead.

Really? That is just your opinion, I sort of like the "techno-babble" if it is written properly. Stories don't have to all be action shoot'em ups to be good.

You can't expect to find out everything about a new race in their first appearance. We learned they're a nomad tribe, they use weapons like Ronan's,they can't be trusted, and they've been actively engaging the Wraith. That's plenty of "side-story" information picked up during the more important "story-story".

I must have missed that point about them "engaging" the Wraith especially since they are always trying to avoid them. I disagree with you about "plenty of side-story information" just some vague references IMO.

[Kribby]

Okay episode but far from the best so far...considering we have only seen 5 eps.

Way too much like PU episode on over all arc. Not enough bad guys or Wraith...I was wondering if the girl was supposed to be this "New Enemy" that was advertised or Sheps version of Taming of the Shrew.

Really missed Dr. Weir and Carson Beckett.

Teyla is still wall paper. Ronin still a totem pole and Rodney was actually missed this ep.

Shep does need more developing--how many times is he gonna fall for the same trick? Yes, shep--she's gonna screw you over.

I would give it a 7 ot of 10 scale IMO

You know, I missed Rodney as well... UNTIL Shep started being all mostly technical! He was fixing stuff! I considered him out of character (for a moment) and then I decided...'Duh, it has been 3.25 years. He has to learned more than a little something, something.'

[morjana]

Spoiler:

Aren't the Travelers supposed to appear in next week's episode Tabula Rasa? Or some other episode this season?

Spoiler:

Larrin returns in 'Be All My Sins Remember'd,' which is scheduled to air January 4, 2008.

Morjana

[AutumnDream]

tptb are just trying to expand their audience and not just pander to their base. A little more action and less techno-babble is a good thing.

Stargate has always been primarily action-adventures. One of the first episodes of SG-1 had O'Neill kirking some ditzy chick. But even Brief Candle was miles above Travelers, because it was A) Ten years ago - times have changed, and B) Was not attempting to do something as big as this episode. The success of Brief Candle hinged solely upon developing O'Neill and the others by exposing their desperation and connections to one other, and it did fairly well for what it was. The success of Travelers as a concept was dependent on the viewer's interest in the - you guessed it - Travelers. Which was zero. I loathe technobabble and don't see how you extrapolated from my post that I was asking for more. I was asking for some semblance of meaningful information or dialogue in the script.

They're getting rid of the exposition and actually showing the sh*t instead.

What did they show? Sheppard getting threatened. Sheppard getting hit. A wraith ship getting fried. Sheppard getting threatened again. Larrin getting hit. Wraith getting hit. There's a pattern here. What do you mean by "getting rid of the exposition"? Are you saying this stuff could have been conveyed through speech? That's not what I was getting at. I explicitly said that more story content does not mean pages upon pages of exposition.

You can't expect to find out everything about a new race in their first appearance. We learned they're a nomad tribe, they use weapons like Ronan's,they can't be trusted, and they've been actively engaging the Wraith. That's plenty of "side-story" information picked up during the more important "story-story".

Oh. Wow. That's some meaty information. I think it'll take me the month or so until they show up again to process the philosophical ramifications of "they can't be trusted".

That is deep, man. How do the writers do it?!!?

You can't expect to find out everything about a new race in their first appearance.

I expect to learn something.

PS: This is one of those Atlantis episodes where the best part is seeing what ShadowMaat, ToasterOnFire, and Ouroborous said about it afterwards.

[JSPuddlejumper]

Predictable.

As for the Ancient warship, you all knew that

1) Either it was going to be destroyed
2) The Atlantis team will not have it


And whatever happened to the Tria from The Return????? The Atlantis team must have that Ancient warship. Or is it another f up from the writers?

[jds1982]

I think we can probably assume the Tria is destroyed. Either they got it back to Atlantis and the Asurans fried it, or the Atlantis expedition got it and we know what they do with ships they acquire.

[Alipeeps]

Wow. I loved this episode. So much so I barely know where to start so I shall just ramble randomly about bits I particularly liked..

Okay so...

I liked the Travelers. Liked the concept of them and how they lived etc. I actually very much liked Larrin and thought her combative relationship with Sheppard was very good. I had been a bit concerned that this would be a little cheesy or overdone but it actually played out very well - she was a strong, feisty character and she was trying to do right by her people.. and Sheppard was using his brains and doing his best to outwit her.

I really liked Sheppard in this episode - it was nice to see him being resourceful and sneaky and having to deal with things on his own. I was getting flashes of the Sheppard we saw in The Storm and The Eye - the way he was thinking fast and outwitting a suprerior enemy force etc. Coolness. It was nice to see Sheppard being competent, whilst still maintaing the Sheppard humour and laid-back character that we know. Loved that he was so competent in working with the Lantean technology... and knew where to look and what to do when things broke! TPTB do tend to play Sheppard for laughs at times and it's nice to see that referenced Mensa-level intelligence actually being out into practice... he does actually understand technology and can work with it.. he just never usually has to cos he had Rodney there to do that for him!

I liked the team moments in this episode too with them searching for him... in some ways this was Sheppard's Sateda with the team showing the same fear at losing him and determination to find him as they did with Ronon. Nice stuff. Although, I have to say, it did feel kinda odd not to have Carter in this episode. Now, I'm fairly ambivalent about Carter being in SGA - Yeah, I'd rather she hadn't been brought over but I've accepted that she's here and I don't dislike the character and from what I've seen so far she has fit in pretty well. So it's merely from a logical point of view - and not a fannish pro or anti Carter standpoint - that I say that it seemed kind of odd, in the situation where one of the most important members of the expedition is missing, presumed captured, to not have had the leader of the expedition at all involved in the discussions about getting him back. I guess we can assume those discussion took place off-screen... but it just seemed kinda odd.. as through Rodney and co were taking the decisions and doing whatever they wanted without reference to any higher authority (imagine in Sateda if we hadn't seen Weir involved in discussing/planning how to get Ronon back).

Anyhooo... I also loved the focus on Sheppard in this episode. In previous episodes that have been considered "Sheppard-heavy", such as Common Ground, there has still been a lot of plot happening away from Sheppard (all the stuff with Ladon etc on Atlantis), whereas in this episode it was all about Sheppard and the b-plot for the team was simply them trying to find him. In this sense, this episode felt very much to me like Sheppard's version of Grace Under Pressure or The Real World. Now, I'm not saying that I'd want to see that every week because I adore the team interactions and some my favourite episodes are the ones where everyone has something to do, but as a Sheppard fan it was certainly nice to get such a focus on him for this one episode. It's been a long time coming.

I enjoyed the plot and how the balance of power kept shifting back and forth between Sheppard and Larrin. Even though we'd seen a lot of clips from this episode, there was still a lot that surprised me - Larrin being drained by the Wraith and Sheppard forcing it to give her her life back was certainly one thing. And I haven't read through this thread yet but I'm sure the anti-kirkers will be up in arms and accusing Sheppard of all kinds of horrendous, unprofessional behaviour etc etc etc and I really don't care. I liked Larrin, I liked the flirty, one-up-manship of their relationship and I liked the kiss - and the subsequent stunning. Oh yes, that reminds me of something else I liked in this episode... the whump! Woohooo!

Okay, what else..? Umm.. ooh the gun. Ronon's style gun. Interesting stuff - though we still don't know its origins.. are they made by the Travelers and Ronon got his hands on one? Or did they scavange them from the same place he got his? Interesting to see it run out of charge/ammunition. We';ve seen Ronon reloading it once, before intending to use it, but he always seems to happily shoot it about all over the place and never worry about having to reload it. Though I guess it had been used quite a bit before it ran out.. what with shooting through the wall etc. I also loved the little hommage moment where Sheppard did a little Ronon-style twirl of the gun.

Speaking of Ronon - I loved his line in the jumper "Does it matter? Even if it was a fleet of hive ships, would that stop us from trying to get him back?" Lovely line - so nice to see an actual expression from the team of how much Sheppard means to them - we';ve seen it often enough in reverse.

Right. I think I've run out of waffle for now. I may return as further points occur to me...

[ashman2]

I was under the iimpression that JM said we would see the Tria in season 4. Overall I thought this episode was quite entertaining. You can't have every episode following the same format so I thought it was a nice break from the usual McKay fixing it and Ronon going Dolph Lundgren, not that I mind that, on the contrary I enjoy it, but sometimes it's nice to have a break. Not the best so far this season but still awesome.

I do have one question. Why has Ronon's gun never run out of power?

[Quinn Mallory]

To me this was the weakest episode of the year thus far (just mainly due to the lack of team interaction) but still quite enjoyable. This is essentially just a more action version of Promethius Unbound. I'm not going to complain too much about an episode that has a hot sexy alien chick.

I was just a bit ticked off by the lack of urgency from the SGA team to try to rescue Sheppard. Of course, had the Daedalus and/or Apollo be available then the episode would have been quite short.

I also wasn't too pleased with the Wraith taking and then giving back life to Larrin part since that might start to become a trite plot device (we also see this in Reunion earlier this season).

Anyhow, I still thought this was a fun episode and I probably would've enjoyed it more had I not been feeling a bit under the weather myself while viewing it.

[ToasterOnFire]

Um...Lucian Alliance? And while I also thought this was another SG1 ripoff, I felt it was derived as much from the SG1 ep(Company of Thieves) about the Lucian Alliance hijacking the Odyssey and forcing Sam to make repairs.

Good call, and didn't CoT have one of the thugs lusting over Carter? What is with TPTB and capture and torture scenarios that have sexual elements? The psychological undercurrents are creepy.

I like Shep as much as the next person, but this episode was mediocre and predictable. The "chemistry" between him and Larrin seemed forced, his escape from the Travelers was unexplained and terribly convenient.

Yep, as soon as Larrin showed up in her leather I was wondering when she was going to get the hots for Sheppers and make a move. And lo and behold, it didn't even take a day. Oh well, at least she didn't peel off her top and jump on him like that other M&M classic. It would have been more worthwhile to better establish Larrin and the Travelers to make them more interesting as an ally/enemy hybrid like the Genii, or maybe telling the audience something new about Shep and his character. Instead Larrin and the Travelers were superficial and Shep ran around doing typical Shep things.

Next week's at least looks like it might have a more original storyline

Unless you've seen the movie Memento.