'Doppelganger' (404) General Discussion

[WingedPegasus]

There are a lot of shep caps from this ep, (which I'm very grateful for!) but can somebody post caps of the others, too? Thanks!

[tsaxlady]

I'm another one of those folks that thought they were getting Adrift when I ended up with Doppelganger. I have to say over all I enjoyed the episode.

This is one of if not the best episode I have ever seen for Joe F. He does dark well

Heightmeyer, well she was a red shirt. Showed how serious the Crystal entity was without killing or seriously injuring a major character.

The episode had a nice team feel to it which is something SGA has often lacked to me.

Very superficial comment but they lavender color on the science uniforms needs to go and soon.

[WingedPegasus]

I'm another one of those folks that thought they were getting Adrift when I ended up with Doppelganger. I have to say over all I enjoyed the episode.

This is one of if not the best episode I have ever seen for Joe F. He does dark well

Heightmeyer, well she was a red shirt. Showed how serious the Crystal entity was without killing or seriously injuring a major character.

The episode had a nice team feel to it which is something SGA has often lacked to me.

Very superficial comment but they lavender color on the science uniforms needs to go and soon.

Lavender color? . . .

[Ruffles]

Mmm...I think I can handle the episode a little better now. Probably not but hey... I have reason to be pissed off, sad, disappointed and angry at the same time. Though I prefer my numbness at the moment. I like my happy place.

Thanks for the summary, Ruffles.

Especially that creepy Keller-dream thing is gonna freak me out...me thinks. I don't like things popping out of human people.

I should start collecting those tissues...

YW! I will say that Kate was written as knowledgable and helpful in this ep. The scenes between her and Teyla are nice and some of RL's best work is her reaction to what happens. Carter's tribute to Heightmeyer is also well done.

Yeah, thanks a bunch for the summary, Ruffles. How would you rate the overall episode?

I like it more every time I see it. My initial reaction of disappointment was not of the ep itself. It was in no real surprises in the dreams because I had spoiled myself rotten over it. (A lesson well learned and not to be repeated.)

The first couple of dreams are incredibly creepy and set a nice tone for the rest. The team moments are wonderful, and the cast does a superb job of portraying some very intense emotions. The similarity (crystaline entity) to the SG-1 ep is acknowledged as is Carter's years of expertise. A solid ep overall - well acted, nice effects, appropriate humor (Rodney's version of watching Alien and Ronon's reaction are hilarious).

One really nice part is everyone has something to do. There are no real background characters in this one - including Lorne and Zelenka. But this is a Sheppard showcase with a large dose of McKay. Don't make any mistake about it.

To those looking for caps - can't help you. I have no talent in that area, and the ones I have from the Shep whump thread are - you guessed it - Shep. For McKay lovers, you might check it out. There are a few caps of him there. Look for posts by IWantToBelieve on Sept 30.

[LoveConquers]

The most interesting thing to me was to see what our team was really afraid of.
Teyla - Ronon misinterpreting her relationship with Sheppard and bug Sheppard attacking her (again)

I'm sorry, I just had to touch on this one!

Remember, Teyla's dream starts out "normal," as does all their early dreams. The dreams escalate once we get to Kate's dream, but initially, Teyla and Keller's dreams and even Ronon's to a certain extent start out normal. Each dream escalates until the entity actually kills in Kate's dream. But it is still a dream so as with any dream, things are often mixed up and out of place.

Teyla finds herself back to the beginning, in Rising, where she is in her tent like she was when she first met the expedition members. But then current day John is suddenly there and they are sharing dinner. Then suddenly current day Ronon appears and teases her with a smug grin and flusters her. We are still in normal dream mode here. So analyze that moment however you want, but I would not call it one of her greatest fears!

AFTER this moment, is when her nightmare begins. NOW, John suddenly turns into Evil John, standing directly in front of her and staring at her very intensely. She knows immediately something has changed and her tone goes cautious. The nightmare and her fears unfold from there. Evil John spits out her fears, telling her no one trusts her but him, telling her she hasn't been the same since being in the mind of the wraith queen, then bringing up memories of how her father died, then bringing back memories of Bug John, only this time, Bug John tries to kill her.

These are her worst nightmares, shown after Evil John clearly appears. IMO, to say that one of Teyla's worst fears is Ronon misinterpreting her relationship with John is akin to saying one of Keller's worst fear is being woken up in the middle of the night with an emergency. Both events took place in the dream before the Entity made his presence known.


I absolutely loved this ep! The character moments, the team moments, the intensity, the mood and darkness vying with the scattered humor...everything just came together so well in this one. For an ep with surprisingly minimal CGI, it was very powerful.

Some of my favorite moments:

*Barefoot Lorne!

*The boat scene and the clown!

*The hug!

*Two John's fighting!

[Tith]

This could very probably be my favourite episode, overtaking Sateda.

Things I loved
- Evil Sheppard.
- Wet Sheppard
- Sleepwalking!Lorne with Shep!hair.
- Two Sheppards.
- Sheppard and Teyla hugging.
- Ronon freaking out 'cause he's all alone, made me want to hug him
- The Whalecoming up under the boat.
- Jewel Staite. I finally like her Keller (Has never sat with me in teh eps before. But then again I was a big Carson fan)

Things I hated
- The bug crawling out of Teyla's stomach. I, like Keller, have huge issues with the alien movies.
- They killed Kate. But as much as that saddens me, all I can say is THANK CHRIST IT WASN'T LORNE (and damn it- they still didn't call him by his first name! What's a fangirl gotta do?)

[OobeDoobBenubi]

The ending setted it up for Evil Sheppard to return

[Freekzilla]

Just out of curiosity, how are so many people seeing the wpisodes before they air? I thought that the US was getting the first half of SGA S4 first this time. Did I miss something?

[g.o.d]

I have a question. Why didn't Teyla die when that bug crawled out from her abdomen?

[Willow'sCat]

Well John/Rodney is about the best thing in this ep.

It was good, fast paced and had something for everyone, including the animal lovers, those who like boating and clowns.

To be honest it was more a lightweight ep then I thought, yes it brought up some questions about Sheppard... what is it with him and hugging! That hug was painful to watch, I thought the Weir one was bad.

Sheppard was less believable to me in the Evil guise, really he had nothing to say or do... a few looks does not cut it, Robert needed to flesh that baddy out some more imho... give Joe something to work with!

The premise has been seen before as Carter gladly told all of us *and that is not going to get old quickly*

Anyhow...

Good things:

Keller is just great! If I wasn't a fan of JS already I would so be there now!

Ronon was funny, although Jason still needs to learn to enunciate his words... honestly I had to turn up the volume to understand him.

Teyla was there! Well it is a start, and she looked so upset over Kate (they had a thing no doubt *sh!*) I didn't mind the bug exploding from her... I have never watched Alien... it is all new to me. But um, OK on Teyla and Keller... wouldn't it be known that

Spoiler:

Teyla is pregnant by now if Keller was doing her job??? Seriously? I am not sure I like the idea of drugs being given to a woman that is pregnant. *shrugs* Maybe no blood test/urine sample was called for or whatever... Keller is just taking Teyla's word for it that she is not pregnant. Yeah that works.

Carter... she was less annoying then Weir would have been when giving the death/buck up speech to the people of Atlantis. And she was fairly good with McKay (small mercies).

Sheppard... well, my love hate thing is still there... It is about time we (the audience) were let in on what is going on with him. I don't need it to be some huge revelation that all of Atlantis gets to know about but as a viewer I am getting sick of having to guess what is going on with him... from the awkward *seriously* hugging, notice he never even touches her with his hand? To why he fears himself? I mean if McKay is screwed up what the frak does that make Sheppard? And why was he allowed on Atlantis... why was McKay allowed on Atlantis! LOL Seriously though, I need answers or he will be lost to me.

McKay... he eats when he is nervous... *aw* he must get nervous a lot. *sorry David* I really, I mean seriously loved him in this, not saying I forgive Robert or anything... he still put the thing in the script about "Carter & Lemon Chicken" but at least McKay was in character and I would even say for McKay he was trying to be nice to everyone even Radek. I know, weird.

I loved the boat/Whale thing... but did RC watch Echoes? Seriously how can he write McKay now as fearing Whales when we know he loved the Whale!like animal in Echoes...? Yes there is GUP but again we have had Echoes since then, why would he still be having those nightmares *seemingly every night* well it could happen I suppose... *shrugs* habit.

I also like the little story of McKay and the girl in the cinema... mostly as it sounded like something that would happen to McKay, and McKay dated... I mean he actually dated but I could have done without the "geek" thing. Oh well I am hard to please when it comes to McKay, something about a pedestal Oh and back to the boat, well my little slashy heart was set alight... the encouragement from Sheppard *the good* was wonderful to hear about time and all but still wonderful. Also the part at the end of the big show down, where McKay says he thought there would have been hot women and Sheppard agreeing... they are so cute when they are in denial.

The TEAM: I feel slightly manipulated, I can see the 'moments' put in this ep to try and placate fans who have been asking for ages to have top & tail TEAM interaction... to not leave eps without having some kind of closer involving the TEAM. Was it over done here, probably but I am willing to let it go... after all I was one of the fans asking for this. But less is more, when the less is done appropriately *if that makes sense*

Over-all, another good ep... they are batting 3/3 as far as I am concerned.... Now I just hope Reunion isn't leaked or uploaded by iTunes! *shakes head*

[female Wraith]

Well....this was one very weird version of Cold Lazarus from SG-1.
Although I am NOT a fan of Weir I have to say that Weir was much better than Carter. Carter was just patethic with the remarks about the experince of O'Neil and the act 'Carter finding out what is going on and saving the day', she may have been a fine soldier and a scientist but as a leader of Atlantis she was just annoying. Or at least she pissed me off. When she was in SG-1 I was her fan, now I am not.
In Teyla's dream when Kate jumped dowm from the balcony, Kate died. But when the bug came from Teyla's belly, Teyla survived. What was that? A plot hole?
The episode was so predictable, even boring. Is this the way the producers of the show think they will bring a fresh air in the show??

[SGFerrit]

To be honest it was more a lightweight ep then I thought, yes it brought up some questions about Sheppard... what is it with him and hugging! That hug was painful to watch, I thought the Weir one was bad.

The reason the hug was 'painful' is because of the way it is edited. You get to see it twice, from two slghtly different angles. makes it look silly.

And to those who thought it was 'awkward': it's MEANT to be awkward guys, Kate had just died due to Sheppard's 'evil twin'.

The mention of Weir was nice! Seems Torri got her wish

[Tith]

In Teyla's dream when Kate jumped down from the balcony, Kate died. But when the bug came from Teyla's belly, Teyla survived.

Kate jumping happened in Kate's dream. It cut off when she hit the base of the tower (and died). The bug exploding from Teyla's belly happened in Keller's dream. Neither dream were actually Teyla's. But both Kate and Keller dreamed of her as well as Sheppard

[SGFerrit]

Well....this was one very weird version of Cold Lazarus from SG-1.
Although I am NOT a fan of Weir I have to say that Weir was much better than Carter. Carter was just patethic with the remarks about the experince of O'Neil and the act 'Carter finding out what is going on and saving the day', she may have been a fine soldier and a scientist but as a leader of Atlantis she was just annoying. Or at least she pissed me off. When she was in SG-1 I was her fan, now I am not.
In Teyla's dream when Kate jumped dowm from the balcony, Kate died. But when the bug came from Teyla's belly, Teyla survived. What was that? A plot hole?
The episode was so predictable, even boring. Is this the way the producers of the show think they will bring a fresh air in the show??

1. It was not a 'version' of Cold Lazarus. Thats like saying First Strike is a weird version of Unnatural Selection, just because they both have replicators.
2. How was Carter 'pathetic'? Mckay has referenced his knowledge of SG-1 missions a number of times to help the situation. What is Carter expected to do? "Oh, I know there is a Gould running around Atlantis, and I know I could be of huge help, but I best not say anything as I may upset a few fans, even though it is the obvious/logical thing to do!" Puhhh-lease!
3. Teyla didn't die, because it was in KELLER'S dream. Kate died, because she died in her own dream.
4. It seems many people loved this episode, but you of course are entitled to your opinion. The fact that so many people enjoyed Adrift, Lifeline and now Doppelganger in my eyes shows that the producers are doing something right this year. Three out of three episode vastly accepted as being great, I just hope the rest live up to them.

[SGFerrit]

Kate jumping happened in Kate's dream. It cut off when she hit the base of the tower (and died). The bug exploding from Teyla's belly happened in Keller's dream. Neither dream were actually Teyla's. But both Kate and Keller dreamed of her as well as Sheppard

Yep, exactly. I think the point was we were supposed to THINK it was Teyla's dream at first, but then we discovered it was actually Kate's.