Michael (218)

[vaberella]

Now it would be interesting to see what happens if they CAN cure the wraith. Would most of the WANT to be cured? If they can live forever as waith (which, it seems they can) it's possible we have real live ancents that were "transformed" into wraith way back in the day. Could make things interesting.

That's a good question. but then it comes out how many of them will think they need to be 'CURED'....that would imply that their in some way faulty. When their just an evolved species. And then it questions how our own conciet makes us assume that if you are not like us then you are 'wrong' and we have to 'fix' something--when there's thousands of them.

That would be cool to see real life ancients transformed...I'd like to see that!

VB

[PG15]

No, 3rd's right (and very creepy):

The Scourge - Robert Picardo (The Doctor on Voyager)
Coup d'Etat - Colm Meaney (sp?) (Miles O'Brien on DS9)
Michael - Connor Trinneer (Trip from Enterprise)

On a side note, I wonder if any of the writers watch Royal Canadian Airfarce, which had a character who refered to himself as "I'm Mike, from Kenmore"

Funny stuff.

[Bobthespirit]

Hmm...good episode.

Except...I think they messed up. They introduced this theme of the drug that can change wraithe into human several episodes ago. At that time, the theme was cool. But, there were so many lame, derivative standalone episodes in between that I didn't care as much.

The season premiere and what happened to Ford, and the introduction of Ronon had me really excited. But since then, the general lack of inspiration has waned my interest.

[GatetheWay]

This was a very creepy episode. I havn't felt this conflicted about a Stargate episode in a long time. Not only did it succeed in making me feel sorry for a Wraith, which I never have even in Instinct, but it made the Atlantis team look like one of those evil conspiracies in the X-Files.

I had seen the episodic photos for the ep and had thought the expedition had held him at the Alpha site from the very beginning so I was very surprised to see him wake up in Atlantis. Despite the logical and plot errors I thought this was a well done ep. mainly because of how well Michael pulled it off. He made me very sympathetic toward him and I felt the Atlantis team had gone too far this time. Seeing him in that cell with his knees to his chest looking to helpless and lost just broke my heart. I know he was a wraith but that was something he couldn't help and I thought that no matter how human they could ever make him they would always treat him different and with caution.

I didn't realize what a stupid idea it was for them to have brought him to the city until Sheppard practically listed out everything that Michael probably had learned and would tell the other Wraith. I've stopped being surprised in Atlantis' stupidity. As far as I'm concerned, season one was just a completely different city, one with BRAINS. From what I've heard about Allies it sounds like they will keep on making these incredibly dumb and destructive mistakes I just hope they pay for them thoroughly.

Over all, good ep. I really liked Conner’s acting and I liked how dark the episode was. I found it pretty easy to ignore the inconsistencies aka Michael reading, knowing how to use a computer etc. but Atlantis’ stupidity annoyed me yet did not surprise me in the least. The episode was done well if flawed.

[Captain-Peregrine]

This was a very creepy episode. I havn't felt this conflicted about a Stargate episode in a long time. Not only did it succeed in making me feel sorry for a Wraith, which I never have even in Instinct, but it made the Atlantis team look like one of those evil conspiracies in the X-Files.

That's what I liked and disliked, too. It was creepy, which I liked, and it was creepy--which I don't like. What can I say? I'm a hypocrite.

[Hyperspace]

I would like to rant about this episode, because I think that of all the ways to give up Atlantis' existence, doing it due 'internal science experiment gone awry' was IMO a lousy way to go, especially if it was bungled the way this happened through sheer incompetence.

It seemed contrived, from 'Doctor happens to fall asleep at table and no one watches' to 'no guards around,' this just seemed too lax.

And what sign of an episode is it when Ronan is the only sane voice in the room?

It was, quite frankly, extremely ludicrous that they did not take sufficient precautions to avoid revealing the existence of Atlantis. Just bringing a Wraith to Atlantis itself was extremely worrisome. Although the Wraith "Jedi Mind Trick" was interesting and conveniently timed, did no one remember Teyla's susceptability to these things? And given that with 2 guards he killed someone, they leave him alone at the Alpha Site?

I find these issues hard to believe, and frankly I found this episode the weakest of the lot. I was astounded at the lack of self-critical evaluation displayed by Atlantis members in this episode, and extremely disappointed in the way this plot unfolded. The morality of the Atlantis team members seemed far off the mark, and given all the reservations expressed by multiple team members, the fact that Dr. Weir did little to nothing in addressing those concerns was uncharacteristically showing a lack of leadership on her part. Not to mention that many of the other characters acted not in character, to my view. For one, they were remarkably absent...Sheppard's security lacking, McKay not there...

It was a travesty of military strategy the way this was handled, and truly bungled. You'd think if 'Michael' were coming in for regular injections, any info on his true identity would have been well hidden. And he already has an accent before being told he's a Texan? Giving him a computer to access secrets so soon...and not having guards around at the Alpha Site????!!!! And not destroying the hiveship/base where 'Michael' was captured???!!!!

I love Atlantis too much, it deserves better than this. Many may be interested in the Wraith-human story, which I find interesting if not entirely original--Atlantis itself has focused on similar variations a number of times before. But I would have liked this story better if the Atlantis team had not been so completely mistaken in their approach not only to the experiment itself but the whole security around it.

This episode gets a serious thumbs down from me...one of the first if ever I've given for an Atlantis ep.

[vaberella]

I would like to rant about this episode, because I think that of all the ways to give up Atlantis' existence, doing it due 'internal science experiment gone awry' was IMO a lousy way to go, especially if it was bungled the way this happened through sheer incompetence.

It seemed contrived, from 'Doctor happens to fall asleep at table and no one watches' to 'no guards around,' this just seemed too lax.

And what sign of an episode is it when Ronan is the only sane voice in the room?

It was, quite frankly, extremely ludicrous that they did not take sufficient precautions to avoid revealing the existence of Atlantis. Just bringing a Wraith to Atlantis itself was extremely worrisome. Although the Wraith "Jedi Mind Trick" was interesting and conveniently timed, did no one remember Teyla's susceptability to these things? And given that with 2 guards he killed someone, they leave him alone at the Alpha Site?

I find these issues hard to believe, and frankly I found this episode the weakest of the lot. I was astounded at the lack of self-critical evaluation displayed by Atlantis members in this episode, and extremely disappointed in the way this plot unfolded. The morality of the Atlantis team members seemed far off the mark, and given all the reservations expressed by multiple team members, the fact that Dr. Weir did little to nothing in addressing those concerns was uncharacteristically showing a lack of leadership on her part. Not to mention that many of the other characters acted not in character, to my view. For one, they were remarkably absent...Sheppard's security lacking, McKay not there...

I love Atlantis too much, it deserves better than this. Many may be interested in the Wraith-human story, which I find interesting if not entirely original--Atlantis itself has focused on similar variations a number of times before. But I would have liked this story better if the Atlantis team had not been so completely mistaken in their approach not only to the experiment itself but the whole security around it.

I completely understand your ire with the direction of the story. There was definitely plenty of buggled wholes that were left open. I reasoned that Beckett fell asleep was because he was doing so many tests...what I couldnt' understand was where were the guards who were supposed to be watching Michael.

But then just bringing Michael to Atlantist was the biggest mistake of them all...there was no bigger. And I blame both Weir and John for that. More so Weir, because John takes orders from her..not the other way round. And we saw this happen only in 'Hot Zone' since then I've been feeling that John has been sort of leashed, especially during 'Coup D'etat'----as a military official we can expect John to know better. But he's not the leader of Atlantis and can't commandeer Weir....but IF Caldwell was there I'm sure we would have seen different results..and probably unlikely that she would have brought Michael to Atlantis...but probably to the Alpha Site as Caldwell would have still been interested in running the tests.

I definitely see what you mean about the WRaith and Teyla thing. I think, and this is the vibe I was getting from the beginning. All those scenes we see of Teyla AND Michael were set up so that Teyla could test out that Wraith connection thing she has---and see if there were any Wraith capabilities while Michael was human. It just doesn' work otherwise..i just saw her as a decoy and a dobule agent..to report back her findings and make friends...but nothing else. And I think since she felt nothing before from him...she wasn't expecting, nor were they, of his WRaith mental abilities and he took control. But what's interestnig is that if they develop this we might be able to see that Teyla can control a few Wraith of her own if she works on her ability. Remember in 'The Gift', it was said the people with her abilities were able to defeat a Wraith attack sucessfullly!

And your complaint about the planning and security..yeah it was one of my issues as well. They should NEVER have brought him back to Atlantis. I dont' like the testing personally. But, if it must be done...no one who knows anything about SELF-PRESERVATION, would have allowed the tests run on Altantis..regardless of facilities and capabilities..they should have been done off site..because he is always a threat..no matter what..especially if he's not in a cell.

It was a travesty of military strategy the way this was handled, and truly bungled. You'd think if 'Michael' were coming in for regular injections, any info on his true identity would have been well hidden. And he already has an accent before being told he's a Texan? Giving him a computer to access secrets so soon...and not having guards around at the Alpha Site????!!!! And not destroying the hiveship/base where 'Michael' was captured???!!!!

I so agree with you...a lot of problems..and a lot of stupidity. Incompetence galore.

[GatetheWay]

I'm curious about his accent. How did a Wraith have a distincive accent like that anyway? And did he loose it soon after he found out? I can't remember...

[Hyperspace]

I definitely see what you mean about the WRaith and Teyla thing. I think, and this is the vibe I was getting from the beginning. All those scenes we see of Teyla AND Michael were set up so that Teyla could test out that Wraith connection thing she has---and see if there were any Wraith capabilities while Michael was human. It just doesn' work otherwise..i just saw her as a decoy and a dobule agent..to report back her findings and make friends...but nothing else. And I think since she felt nothing before from him...she wasn't expecting, nor were they, of his WRaith mental abilities and he took control. But what's interestnig is that if they develop this we might be able to see that Teyla can control a few Wraith of her own if she works on her ability. Remember in 'The Gift', it was said the people with her abilities were able to defeat a Wraith attack sucessfullly!

Nice analysis, I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who found some of the plot elements rather blind to normal self-preservation sensibilities. I think that the only reasonable way to see Teyla in such a prominent role is as you specified.

And yet, it's unfortunate that they made virtually no mention of this justification for having Teyla in such close proximity, AND that there was no attendant security. You'd think that if Ronan was on watch when Teyla was sparring with 'Michael,' that he could've been on watch at the Alpha Site. If they didn't trust Ronan, then someone else could've been on watch. At least outside the door...having 'Michael' and Teyla escape with only Sheppard and Ronan to chase...and only 2 guards (apparently uninformed, or warned...) guarding the Stargate AND exposure of Atlantis....this seemed entirely lax.

[Bama]

Ah, and there's the rub. THat is what makes these episodes so great--they bring up situations like this where people are faced with the facts of what they are doing. I agree that in war sometimes people are pushed way outside their comfort level and act in ways that may go against their moral code. I just think it odd--Weir hated the fact that they almost

Spoiler:

resorted to torture in Critical Mass against a human, but when it comes to experimenting on a Wraith, it's okay.

...dark, dark episode.

War is Hell. It's a lesson Elizabeth is learning well and hard and it's one that's obviously been hard on her. In her shoes, I'd have experimented the heck out of the wraith. Teyla was right-he was better off as a human if being something else makes you suck lifeblood from someone. If this ep was supposed to 'thought provoke' me into feeling that the wraith have some kind of right to their lifestyle and the 'humans' are just as bad a boys for being such meanies and wanting everyone to be like them, then it didn't accomplish it.

Overall, I enjoyed the episode a lot. Sure it has holes but every ep does-tis the nature of sci-fi. I just kicked off the shoes and enjoyed the entertainment of this one. Michael was a good character.

[vaberella]

Nice analysis, I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who found some of the plot elements rather blind to normal self-preservation sensibilities. I think that the only reasonable way to see Teyla in such a prominent role is as you specified.

And yet, it's unfortunate that they made virtually no mention of this justification for having Teyla in such close proximity, AND that there was no attendant security. You'd think that if Ronan was on watch when Teyla was sparring with 'Michael,' that he could've been on watch at the Alpha Site. If they didn't trust Ronan, then someone else could've been on watch. At least outside the door...having 'Michael' and Teyla escape with only Sheppard and Ronan to chase...and only 2 guards (apparently uninformed, or warned...) guarding the Stargate AND exposure of Atlantis....this seemed entirely lax.

Thanks.

And I have to agree with you on that, comfort level seemed high the security teams or the direction by Sheppard or other military officials in charge. This conceit...is really gonna be a downfall.

I was thinking Ronon was sent on watch Teyla and Michael just incase, things go out of hand..It just didn't flow again how he walked into the room when Michael had Teyla inthe room, slam in the wall and then..leave. It seemed a bit orchestrated and came out of nowhere, especially since there were two guards at the door and the door was open.

In some instances I felt that John was trying to be a bit more assertive (or maybe I'm trying to save him a bit...although he holds a lot of blame...and I think he should have put his foot down like he did in Hot Zone; even if it did show dissention).

I think they just underestimated Michael's Wraith abilites and overestimated Carson as an amazing scientist and his serum. And by doing so they ended up putting themselves into this really bad hole.

I think the two officers were informed..but again really just really stupid. I mean their bodies seemed to be found far off from where the Stargate was..so I'm thinking that they were going to see if they could intercede Michael before he showed up...but underestimated his resourcefulness or were put off guard by Teyla being his hostage......I have no clue really.

[FerCryinOutLoud!]

What I really hate about all this is that we're actually at the same place with the same situation than after last season's 18th episode.. The Wraith know that Atlantis exists and where it is and they're gonna launch an attack. Now the the team needs to work out how to safe the city. Good for last season, but is getting pretty lame now.

That is exactly what i was thinking caty. I'm getting deja' vue over here because i was thinking... "Oh, no the Wraith are going to attack Atlantis! Whatever are we going to do?" We haven't seen this before! *cough cough* It's also annoying how more fire power in both SG-1 and Atlantis is their answer for everything. Whatever happened to attacking your enemies psyche? Like when Sheppard turned the two wraith queens against each other. I think one of the coolest ways to defeat the wraith or at least throw their ranks into chaos would be to turn them against each other. Divide and conquer. But, now we're back to where we were at the end of last season... the wraith are coming! Only now it's not as interesting because we have the option of calling up the SGC or the Daedelus for help. I hope they're going to throw a twist in this that we'll never see coming.

I almost expect Ronan to start walking around speaking in grunts and dragging his knuckles on the ground. I know he hates the wraith and thinks they are the wraith no matter how you slice 'em (which they are) but does he have to so blatantly give Michael even more suspicion that things aren't right by refusing to shake his hand and punching him? And, when he was escorting Michael and the guards to the infirmery he practically provoked Michael into confrotation. (which is what he really wanted) I almost blame Ronan for the guard's death over Michael. I like violence like the next Joe but violence isn't the answer to every problem. Though Ronan as a character sure thinks otherwise. I wish they didn't write Ronan so dumb. I like intensity, but they over do it with Ronan. Well, at least there's one thing with Ronan you can't complain about. He's consistent i'll give you that.

This episode was cool because it delved into morality and different people's concepts of morality. It was dark, which i'll face it, i like dark stories. But this episode left a lot of things up in the air. To me that's a good thing because it makes me eager to see conclusion. I'm sure that TPTB will follow up on this in stride.

I didn't really have a favorite character in Atlantis because i like them all pretty much evenly... The closest i got to having a favorite was Rodney, but now after this episode and the episdoe two weeks ago i think my favorite character is Teyla. She's ever the voice of reason and she never forgets who she is, what she believes, and where she came from. It's just too bad they haven't developed her more this season, rather than put her in the background to babysit Ronan and keep him in line when he throws a temper tantrum.

[Auralis]

A total desaster form the logic point of view, entertaining yes, but again utter braindead character actions are used to generate a plot.

Atlantis and stargate becoming like a contest on how stupid we can make the characters. Its getting painfull.

[maxbo]

Despite the crater sized plot holes and inexplicable character motivations (for example, there was no reason, not even a plot-driven one, to have Michael in Atlantis, ever); the fact that this episode evokes such strong, thoughtful responses makes it a success in my book. Focusing on Michael’s point of view, rather than showing the SGA team argue the pros and cons of Wraith experimentation, was a stroke of genius because it allowed the audience to identify with Michael’s pain, confusion and fear and forced us to think about what the SGA team may have to give up to win the fight against the Wraith-a bit of their humanity.

Although some believe that Ronon was too harsh, I loved that his character wasn’t sacrificed for the plot. He behaved exactly as I expected him to behave. As a runner for several years, he undoubtedly had more up close and personal encounters with the Wraith than most and got to see them in ways that the average human didn’t. As the object of their sport, he got to see them at play and probably realized that, long before the introduction of the retrovirus, they share many similarities to humans. Because of this, Michael probably concerned him more than the average Wraith because perhaps Ronon was afraid that the SGA team would relax their guard in the mistaken belief that Michael was too human to pose as much of a threat. And, he was right to be concerned.

[CalmStorm]

But then just bringing Michael to Atlantist was the biggest mistake of them all...there was no bigger. And I blame both Weir and John for that. More so Weir, because John takes orders from her..not the other way round. And we saw this happen only in 'Hot Zone' since then I've been feeling that John has been sort of leashed, especially during 'Coup D'etat'----as a military official we can expect John to know better.

I cannot blame any of the characters this time around because they were so far out of character I had to step back and just look at this episode and go...'what the h*** was that'

As for John, I have never seen him fail to state his opinion on an issue and he does not seem anymore subdued because of the incident in 'Hot Zone'. He disobeyed a direct order from Cln Everett after he removed Weir and stood up for her before following his orders. The way he stood up to him was really enough grounds for dismissal, but he did what he felt was right. I don't see him leashed in the slightest.

He will not always agree with Weir, but I don't see him holding back any advice or opinions from her. I also feel, that given everything he knows now, if he had to live the whole virus incident over again, he would have done exactly the same thing.

Also in 'Coup D'etat, he was hesitant becaude he did not trust Laden. Good for him and score! Now, he looses that point he just scored by visiting Cowen and seemingly trusting him over Laden. As you put it.....as a military official, I would expect him to know better.