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    #46
    Originally posted by Yeade
    I just finished watching the episode, so I can't gather much of an overall impression through the haze of my general SGA squee.

    However, I do have a few thoughts on Sheppard and Mara:

    At first, I found Sheppard's behavior a little out of character.

    Sheppard strikes me as someone who keeps everybody at arm's length by being superficially charming and friendly. This is likely why he always seems to end up with women who wouldn't hold him to anything, but I imagine these women have a hard time getting close enough in the first place.

    Given his previous three liaisons, his interaction with Mara didn't make much sense to me. True, he fell hard for Chaya and Teer, but the former was an Ancient and the latter close to Ascension; in other words, I can write both off as being an effect of Sheppard's magic gene. And, more to the point, he proved quite resistant to Neera's advances, catching on to her attempts to fish for information pretty quickly. So why then, after what he'd seen of the machinations in the Lord Protector's court, would he so... passively accept sleeping with a woman who's in contention for the throne, so to speak, and whose goal---by her own admission---is to marry him and rule, ousting her older brother from power? It simply doesn't seem smart to me, and Sheppard isn't exactly the dullest tack in the box.

    Of course, one could always assume Sheppard turned Mara out---clutching her clothes to her chest in ladylike modesty---right after the scene cut, and he was just too surprised at her advances to do it before.

    If not, well... I must go with an aphrodisiac in his food or drink!

    No, wait! Hear me out!

    My understanding of the court intrigue is that Otho was plotting with both Tavius and Mara. Otho doesn't have the Ancient gene and so can't operate the chair himself, but I think he was setting himself up as the power behind the throne. As Mara's betrothed, Otho would also gain prestige were she to rule, and from his position as consort, he could manipulate the easily influenced Mara to do whatever he wanted. The question was how to bump Mara up the line of succession.

    First, he had to get rid of the Lord Protector. So he supplied Tavius with the poison that let the foolish boy go through with his plan to kill his father and inherit the throne.

    Or so Otho allowed Tavius to think, playing the simpering chamberlain.

    Maybe not immediately afterwards---two royal deaths, one after another, would be a little too suspicious---but certainly later, Otho would do away with Tavius as Tavius did away with his father, and Mara would rightfully take her place as regent, Otho at her right hand.

    This was the plan Otho had in motion before Sheppard arrived, and it was not without its risks. It would be so much better if the Lord Protector would abdicate the throne to Mara directly. Tavius wouldn't be able to overturn his father's decision, and if he made trouble, Otho could have him killed then. The question, though, was how to strengthen Mara's claim over that of Tavius.

    Enter Sheppard's magic gene.

    And, suddenly, there was the very real possibility that if Mara could bear children with a stronger ATA gene, she would win the favor of her father and be proclaimed heir over her brother. Then Otho could have Sheppard, a stranger, killed and claim the child as his own.

    The revised plan was for Mara to seduce Sheppard and steal his genes. Now, Otho had already provided Tavius with poison. What if, to assure Mara would be successful, he brewed her an aphrodisiac? To be slipped in Sheppard's food or drink.

    MUWAHAHAHAHAHA...!

    Where Otho's plan hit a snag is that Mara genuinely, if not loved, then liked and was attracted to Sheppard. Because, seriously, who (or what) wouldn't be?

    Yeah it did seem out of character for our Shep.
    I mean I didnt get a sense of ANY sexual tension at dinner, and when she turned up in his room when he was lokoing at something in his vest, (What was that? A plaster? a condom - he's certainly prepared- an anti kirk patch? what was it? anyway i digress)
    Shep didnt seem to think her intention was sex at first. It was only when she took off her clothes and showed him what was on offer did he comment he hadnt seen it coming.
    I think as it goes, well to put it crudely. Sheppard is a man and there is a naked woman stood in front of him offereing him sex.
    I think it was the classic, the other brain was doing the thinking for him, he got caught up in the moment and it was only when he got a reality check in the sense of her mentioning him being a good ruler did he look...like what? her pushing him on the bed was meant to be comical.

    Later in the ep when he talks to Weir he says he turned down the girl so i dont think he had sex with her and talking to the bald dude the next day he straight away mentions mara coming to his room. WOuld he do that if he had sex with her? You would think he would want to keep it queit.

    What did puzzle me was when he went to save her at the end and said she could come with him? I dont know, maybe he has a thing for strays.

    Sorry if thats all jumbled. Its late and my brain is going nooooooooooo!
    my thoughts anyway.,

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      #47
      Originally posted by PG15
      1. They want Atlantis because it's the only GATE that dials Earth, not because it can fly there.
      Umm, no, then why did they say that they had to have a self-distruct to destroy the engines? If they only cared about the gate then they would plant c4 around the crystal allowing travel to earth through the gate and would only care as long as the city was at the bottom of the ocean and the computers dead and empty.
      2. The ZPM on the sister city's run out, so it can't have engines anymore than it can make a cup of coffee.
      My opinion, but if we can power the dart, then coulden't a race dirived from ancients power a city? (especially since we can with a naquadah generator)?

      Comment


        #48
        Having watched the episode again and thinking about the comment earlier that it was written in two days, I'm wondering if the writing staff isn't a little over stretched and aren't getting enough time to work through plots and so things are suffering. With some of them pulling double duty on both SGA and SG1 its probably a factor in why some of the episodes in this quarter of the season have been not of the quality of past efforts. Hopefully the remaining episodes of the season can pull SGA out of the slump, otherwise I fear for the post season 3 future if we get another season of average episodes.

        On the subject of the Drones, Sheps comment was that they "got the drones and a few jumpers" which implies that they got the majority or all of the remaining the drones that Rodney saw. I suspect that the writers are keeping it vague so that they now no longer need to keep count of either.

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          #49
          Heh heh! This one was pretty funny...but I think you just have to let go and enjoy it for all it's camp splendor, because if you take it too seriously, you'll probably hate it...

          ~*Beanie*~ | No mountain too high, no gutter too low... | Ar scáth a chéile a mhairimid uilig...
          "It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt."

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            #50
            Originally posted by obsessed1
            I think as it goes, well to put it crudely. Sheppard is a man and there is a naked woman stood in front of him offereing him sex.
            <sigh> Yep, there is that. It's... not kind to the character though. In that he seems inconsistent, I mean. He had glowy not-sex with Chaya, it apparently took Teer months to wear him down, and Neera got nothing but a reluctant snuggle--I have to wonder what gives with Mara.
            Later in the ep when he talks to Weir he says he turned down the girl so i dont think he had sex with her...
            It could certainly be interpreted that way, yes. Or Mara offered him her hand in marriage. Because everything else in that conversation referred to what happened after Otho's death, I tend to assume the second option.
            ...and talking to the bald dude the next day he straight away mentions mara coming to his room. WOuld he do that if he had sex with her? You would think he would want to keep it queit.
            Given the aphrodisiac theory? It wore off, and Sheppard went to get some answers from the only guy who might know and seemed more or less trustworthy.
            What did puzzle me was when he went to save her at the end and said she could come with him? I dont know, maybe he has a thing for strays.
            Obligation perhaps?

            Well, Otho implied that Tavius would have Mara killed or something once he had the throne, right? What self-respecting hero would leave a damsel in distress?


            edit: tags
            Last edited by Yeade; 01 September 2007, 11:44 AM.
            The fact is I think I am a verb instead of a personal pronoun. A verb is anything that signifies to be, to do, or to suffer. I signify all three.

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              #51
              I think that this was meant to be a low budge/filler episode. It doesn't hold a candle to Critical Mass, but at least we now know they got more PJs and drones.

              Comment


                #52
                Originally posted by starfox
                Hamlet, hmm? Actually it does, now that I think about it. I was getting more of a Dune vibe, though (the last scene in the throne room/hall, which I would quote if I had a copy remotely near me right now). Maybe I was just thinking Dune because of the odd orange-y lighting for the outside bits (did anyone else see that, or is my ep just a weird copy?).
                Well, almost everybody rips off The Bard anyway... Even Frank Herbert...
                sigpic
                "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"

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                  #53
                  Originally posted by Ancient_Rilus
                  Isn't having left the buried sister city without defenses a bad thing for Earth, as it is a space ship like atlantis, meaning intergalactic capable. Doesn't leaving it defenseless mean if the Wraith get hold of the buried city's engines they could get to Earth, the whole point SGA put a self destruct in place on Atlantis was to stop such a situation. Shouldn't they have done something to disable the engines or put a self destruct on the sister city?
                  Good point there, never really thought about that.

                  Makes me wonder why the Wraith didn't try harder to destroy the planet if the people had some means of defending themselves. I thought they didn't like humans to progress beyond a certain technological point.

                  Comment


                    #54
                    all in all I liked this episode, I hope we come back to this second version of atlantis, I see possable story lines in this, also when the villager helps rodeney get into the city he says the caves are prone to earthquakes, allright come on this galaxy has nevert heard of earth, whats the deal with this? he could have just said quakes or something like ground tremors, also we got to see some new sets for atlantis like the drone room and the auxilary control room,
                    Last edited by CYBEREAGLE19; 20 December 2005, 06:40 PM.

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                      #55
                      (spoiler)







                      ok in the tower we find an exact duplicate of atlantis filled with tons of drones and puddle jumpers, since theres quakes on the planet the tower is on, lets take the dedy there and just beam all the drones and puddle jumpers out, the planet wouldent seem to mine sinced all of the drones are to no use since the zmp was depleted, I was also thinking could this planet been another address from weirs list from Before I Sleep?also now atlantis is almost wraith ready, a shield and some drones, or I wonder if you could fire drones while cloaked? plus now maybe we can see what else the atlantis chair is capable of
                      Last edited by CYBEREAGLE19; 20 December 2005, 06:57 PM.

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                        #56
                        Originally posted by Yeade
                        Given his previous three liaisons, his interaction with Mara didn't make much sense to me. True, he fell hard for Chaya and Teer, but the former was an Ancient and the latter close to Ascension; in other words, I can write both off as being an effect of Sheppard's magic gene. And, more to the point, he proved quite resistant to Neera's advances, catching on to her attempts to fish for information pretty quickly. So why then, after what he'd seen of the machinations in the Lord Protector's court, would he so... passively accept sleeping with a woman who's in contention for the throne, so to speak, and whose goal---by her own admission---is to marry him and rule, ousting her older brother from power? It simply doesn't seem smart to me, and Sheppard isn't exactly the dullest tack in the box.

                        Of course, one could always assume Sheppard turned Mara out---clutching her clothes to her chest in ladylike modesty---right after the scene cut, and he was just too surprised at her advances to do it before.

                        If not, well... I must go with an aphrodisiac in his food or drink!
                        I go for Option B myself... as all signs point to that direction... Not because I'm beyond believing that some men are inclined to accept "free tokens" where offered but because, as you yourself rightly say, it is very out of character for Sheppard to do so. Especially, when he knows he is being used as a race horse. It is one thing to succumb to instant gratification because you think a woman finds you attractive but it's another to do so when you find out that you're being used for a breeding programme. From what we know of Sheppard, I doubt he'd do that. I'd say that he'd be pretty angry at being manipulated.

                        Aside from that, he tells Weir that he "gave up the girl"... when he didn't have to...
                        Whether it means before or after the event, I admit is ambiguous but it would be far more consistent of what we know about Sheppard to believe that he rejected Mara's advances.
                        sigpic
                        "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"

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                          #57
                          So a couple villagers didn't die, and Shepard got lucky. That's what I call a successful mission.

                          Originally posted by Yeade
                          <sigh> Yep, there is that. It's... not kind to the character though. In that he seems inconsistent, I mean. He had glowy not-sex with Chaya, it apparently took Teer months to wear him down, and Neera got nothing but a reluctant snuggle---I have to wonder what gives with Mara.
                          1) She's totally hot.

                          2) They were'nt in a wraith hive ship.

                          3) She came to him. She wanted it.

                          That's about it. He says he "did'nt get the girl", but he simply means he did'nt keep her, or stay.

                          This ep was pretty sweet. I did'nt see the "obvious twist after 2 mins", had a hot chick, pretty funny lines, glowy jellyfish of doom blowing holes in stuff, ronon getting medieval on some constables (finally a fight where you don't have 5 mins of knife fighting where every attack is blocked), totally wasting the leader, they saved the day, spread the gene (presumably) to the people, overthrew the decadent leadership, and shep made it with a hot alien babe.

                          And in the end, is that not what man has dreamt of since first he looked up at the stars?

                          4.5 out of 5 for a standalone episode (well, not really, but they got some drones and jumpers, that's about it).

                          Advice For The New Millenium: A watched torrent never downloads.

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                            #58
                            Just watched it. I give it a **. The visual effects in the episode were awesome. However the episodes was one of the worst of the season (I'm being honest), even though this was a Mallozzi/Mullie written episode.
                            sigpic

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                              #59
                              Shouldn't they have destroyed the city? I mean, like totally obliterated it. If the wraith ever came there, They'd be able to pull the database, or maybe even dig up some of the Star Drive's components.....

                              You couldn't use Zelenka's virus. There have got to be massive sections of the city that are totally disconnected from any central power/command controls, and the Ancient Database backs itself up to a LOT of places. You'd need a really big explosion. The database is probably even more dangerous than the drive itself.



                              Oh, and how did Rodney get out? I'm suprised that these cities don't have more transporters lying around that they could have used.
                              Last edited by Mio; 20 December 2005, 07:39 PM.
                              sigpic

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                                #60
                                Usually the episode comments make me either look forward to seeing an ep or make me think "hmmm maybe theres something better on...". But we hav a fairly equal amount of people saying its pretty good to the people saying it was crap. I'm gonna hav to make up my own mind i guess...

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