Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Southern Red]

Haha, your mom is awesome! Good to see ya, Probie!

I'm at OT for my pinky and my hand is currently in this therapy machine that throws hot sand around, so while it's busy giving me a mani I've got time to chat.

I had a slight rant to share. I went into Barnes & Noble after work and got caught up skimming a Star Trek: Enterprise novel that takes place after the finale. I love the books because they had the wisdom to bring back a character that got killed off on screen in what was quite possibly one of the worst episodes in all of TV history. The fans were outraged and TPTB listened. And not only that but the character is still written correctly, not just one fan's particular feeling on the subject. And -- get this -- they actually cited the novels and episodes that they took specific information or characters from! The continuity stayed!

Why can other shows not take a hint?

Wow, imagine that. Why indeed.

[ShipperWriter]

Well, time for some shameless self-reccing.

[ShipperWriter]

And an older one that even a non-Sparky fan liked a lot. *squees*

[ShipperWriter]

And, of course, this little jewel. I'm posting the link because there's one little snippet that may not be exactly PG.

Sparks Ignite: Theatrical Trailer

If you're newer to the thread and have never seen it? Go. Watch. Now.

[mandogater]

Hello everyone.

I watched episodes of Atlantis with my mom yesterday and she scolded me because I don't post more regularly on this thread.
She said that I had to make apologizes .... so here I am.
I watched "The Real World" and "Echoes".
I had forgotten how these two characters were so cute together.

*Hugs* How have you been Probie?

And welcome back to the land of Sparky.

Haha, your mom is awesome! Good to see ya, Probie!

I'm at OT for my pinky and my hand is currently in this therapy machine that throws hot sand around, so while it's busy giving me a mani I've got time to chat.

I had a slight rant to share. I went into Barnes & Noble after work and got caught up skimming a Star Trek: Enterprise novel that takes place after the finale. I love the books because they had the wisdom to bring back a character that got killed off on screen in what was quite possibly one of the worst episodes in all of TV history. The fans were outraged and TPTB listened. And not only that but the character is still written correctly, not just one fan's particular feeling on the subject. And -- get this -- they actually cited the novels and episodes that they took specific information or characters from! The continuity stayed!

Why can other shows not take a hint?

The bolded part is a question we'd all like an answer too.

[Nolamom]

I have the impression, particularly after following Joe's blog for years, that writers forget the last thing in the quest for the next thing very quickly. They are very focused on *their* vision, and pay very little attention to something that they wrote months ago, has since been produced, and the fan reaction to it. Somehow, it never seems to translate to the *next* bit...Because they're so far ahead of the fans, they seem to have a disdain for them. Otherwise, they'd acknowledge the rumblings in fandom ( Irresistible or Irresponsible anyone?)

[Southern Red]

I have the impression, particularly after following Joe's blog for years, that writers forget the last thing in the quest for the next thing very quickly. They are very focused on *their* vision, and pay very little attention to something that they wrote months ago, has since been produced, and the fan reaction to it. Somehow, it never seems to translate to the *next* bit...Because they're so far ahead of the fans, they seem to have a disdain for them. Otherwise, they'd acknowledge the rumblings in fandom ( Irresistible or Irresponsible anyone?)

That's a very good point. It was obvious throughout the run of the show that they never looked back. And looking back would have meant they paid attention to the shows that were airing, not just the ones they were filming or writing. I was also amazed that the majority of the actors said they never watched the show. I recently read an interview with an actor on another show who said he never watches himself and that once it's on film he's done with it. Okay, for an actor, he can't necessarily go back and make changes, but on a TV show, the writers can. Don't they do focus groups anymore? Even those can be misleading depending on the makeup of the group. Do they just put an ad in the paper asking for volunteers? Do they go down on the street and hand out flyers? How do they find the participants? Are they fans or have they never seen a show? You'll get completely different results in different scenarios. But, I think the overall question is, do they care? It's done and on screen. They dust their hands and move on to the next money making project, leaving a herd of disgruntled viewers behind.

[Scary Kitty]

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Sparky!Family Saturday!

I'm at OT for my pinky and my hand is currently in this therapy machine that throws hot sand around, so while it's busy giving me a mani I've got time to chat.

Hmm, that's a new one I haven't heard of. My PT consists of ultrasound and H-wave (a kind of electrotherapy that replicates natural nerve signals) to help with the pain management, muscle stimulation, and promote blood circulation to reduce swelling and bruising. Once I get the sutures out, we'll be adding whirlpool treatments to the regimen.

I had a slight rant to share. I went into Barnes & Noble after work and got caught up skimming a Star Trek: Enterprise novel that takes place after the finale. I love the books because they had the wisdom to bring back a character that got killed off on screen in what was quite possibly one of the worst episodes in all of TV history. The fans were outraged and TPTB listened. And not only that but the character is still written correctly, not just one fan's particular feeling on the subject. And -- get this -- they actually cited the novels and episodes that they took specific information or characters from! The continuity stayed!

Why can other shows not take a hint?

Why indeed?

That's a very good point. It was obvious throughout the run of the show that they never looked back. And looking back would have meant they paid attention to the shows that were airing, not just the ones they were filming or writing. I was also amazed that the majority of the actors said they never watched the show. I recently read an interview with an actor on another show who said he never watches himself and that once it's on film he's done with it. Okay, for an actor, he can't necessarily go back and make changes, but on a TV show, the writers can. Don't they do focus groups anymore? Even those can be misleading depending on the makeup of the group. Do they just put an ad in the paper asking for volunteers? Do they go down on the street and hand out flyers? How do they find the participants? Are they fans or have they never seen a show? You'll get completely different results in different scenarios. But, I think the overall question is, do they care? It's done and on screen. They dust their hands and move on to the next money making project, leaving a herd of disgruntled viewers behind.

And producers/writers wonder why audiences don't trust them. It's because they pull stupid crap just like what you've described, and it just proves that they are (for the most part) completely out of touch with the audiences they say they're trying to reach.

[Falcon Horus]

I can understand an actor not watching what he/she filmed. You hear it a lot on commentaries them seeing it for the first time as a finished product, and they'll recall funny bits from filming certain scenes. But PTB should know better so as to keep track of their timelines and continuity.

[gateraid]

And, of course, this little jewel. I'm posting the link because there's one little snippet that may not be exactly PG.

Sparks Ignite: Theatrical Trailer

If you're newer to the thread and have never seen it? Go. Watch. Now.

Having just watched this again, I realised there is one little snippet that makes it seem like Carson is in love with Shep. Jarson? Sheppett? Beckard?

I have the impression, particularly after following Joe's blog for years, that writers forget the last thing in the quest for the next thing very quickly. They are very focused on *their* vision, and pay very little attention to something that they wrote months ago, has since been produced, and the fan reaction to it. Somehow, it never seems to translate to the *next* bit...Because they're so far ahead of the fans, they seem to have a disdain for them. Otherwise, they'd acknowledge the rumblings in fandom ( Irresistible or Irresponsible anyone?)

Whilst I do agree with you, I would have to point out the reality of churning out a 60 page script is that they are bound to overlook some details of other episodes. I can forgive them for the odd lapse within the same season (episodes get changed right up until the last minute) but when they forget what happens in previous seasons it's a big lapse.

Also, I don't recall which commentary it was (I want to say Irresistable but I can't be certain) but Paul Mullie said that he wasn't particularly proud of Irresponsible. Even in the s4 commentaries, Amanda Tapping asked Martin Wood what fans thought about the changes and he said they loved everything.

I can understand an actor not watching what he/she filmed. You hear it a lot on commentaries them seeing it for the first time as a finished product, and they'll recall funny bits from filming certain scenes. But PTB should know better so as to keep track of their timelines and continuity.

Yes they should. There are times when continuity needs to be overridden tho (S1's Hathor vs S6's Cure), so I will make the exception for stupidity, just not laziness

[Falcon Horus]

Even in the s4 commentaries, Amanda Tapping asked Martin Wood what fans thought about the changes and he said they loved everything.

S4 of Atlantis?!?

[Scary Kitty]

Even in the s4 commentaries, Amanda Tapping asked Martin Wood what fans thought about the changes and he said they loved everything.

S4 of Atlantis?!?

^This. Someone sure must've been drinking the Kool-Aid that day.

Yes they should. There are times when continuity needs to be overridden tho (S1's Hathor vs S6's Cure), so I will make the exception for stupidity, just not laziness

Agreed. Retconning to correct previous mistakes in writing that shouldn't have happened is one thing, and indeed should be seen as a mark of a good writer/producer to admit "we goofed, we're gonna make this right for the viewers," but revisionist history due to mere laziness is just bad writing, irresponsible, and unprofessional.

[Scary Kitty]

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Lazy Sunday!

[ShipperWriter]

Buenas dias! Hoy es lunes!

No idea why I just started speaking Spanish, but there ya go.

OT para una minuto:

Spoiler:

So my deaf student's schedule finally stopped getting changed due to various reasons such as class too advanced, not match prerequisite, etc... First period wound up being online class in the library, which means I get to chill for the first 45 minutes of the school day and use the time to prepare for more intensive classes later on. Which is so stinkin' awesome, you have no idea.

Normally, interpreters do not get a planning period because you have to be in every class with them, interpreting everything, which means that although I'm a good interpreter, I feel like half the stuff I'm signing could've been done better. It's kind of hard to explain to someone who's not familiar with sign, but I'll try: suppose we're in world history class and the teacher's talking about "ratifying the Constitution". We know what that means in English: to approve or confirm the Constitution of the USA. However, in ASL, if you're unfamiliar with a sign, you have to finger spell it. I couldn't remember the sign for "Constitution" so rather than make up something temporarily, I was fingerspelling it. Which hurts. A lot. Over and over.

I looked at an online ASL dictionary and found the correct signs, so now when I'm signing the sentence "to ratify the Constitution", it is using the correct signs and conveying the accurate meaning.

So now that I actually have some time to familiarize myself with the material, I don't give my student the confused look whenever I'm signing something and hope that they are getting the point regardless. LOL

Okay, so a little longer than a minute. But now you have some insight on what my job is like.

And since I brought my laptop to work, I can keep myself occupied during down times by writing fic. LOL

[Southern Red]

Buenas dias! Hoy es lunes!

No idea why I just started speaking Spanish, but there ya go.

OT para una minuto:

Spoiler:

So my deaf student's schedule finally stopped getting changed due to various reasons such as class too advanced, not match prerequisite, etc... First period wound up being online class in the library, which means I get to chill for the first 45 minutes of the school day and use the time to prepare for more intensive classes later on. Which is so stinkin' awesome, you have no idea.

Normally, interpreters do not get a planning period because you have to be in every class with them, interpreting everything, which means that although I'm a good interpreter, I feel like half the stuff I'm signing could've been done better. It's kind of hard to explain to someone who's not familiar with sign, but I'll try: suppose we're in world history class and the teacher's talking about "ratifying the Constitution". We know what that means in English: to approve or confirm the Constitution of the USA. However, in ASL, if you're unfamiliar with a sign, you have to finger spell it. I couldn't remember the sign for "Constitution" so rather than make up something temporarily, I was fingerspelling it. Which hurts. A lot. Over and over.

I looked at an online ASL dictionary and found the correct signs, so now when I'm signing the sentence "to ratify the Constitution", it is using the correct signs and conveying the accurate meaning.

So now that I actually have some time to familiarize myself with the material, I don't give my student the confused look whenever I'm signing something and hope that they are getting the point regardless. LOL

Okay, so a little longer than a minute. But now you have some insight on what my job is like.

And since I brought my laptop to work, I can keep myself occupied during down times by writing fic. LOL

I'm glad you explained that. I was going to ask you about how you do unfamiliar material. I guess you have to be a really good speller, and the student has to have at least an above average vocabulary. I'm betting in advanced classes there is a good chance of things getting lost in the translation. Do you do math? That boggles my simple mind. I used to volunteer for an organization that did recordings for the blind. One of my duties was to operate the recording equipment while a guy "read" Math textbooks. He totally blew my mind every week. I was a reader for all kinds of non-technical books, and even that was not easy. You have a really special skill my dear.