Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[poundpuppy29]

[Lt.Colonel John Sheppard]

I don't think this is the right way to our room.
nope boom closet.

[ShipperWriter]

Some of these were very difficult choices but lots of good Sparky moments to choose from. Love how the John/Elizabeth connection comes out.

Yes, there was a good emphasis on it this month. And I like that the team moments all include Elizabeth, and not just Team Shep.

DOOOOOO IIIITTTTTTTT!!!! Join the Dark Side. WE HAVE COOKIES!!!!

Ooh, cookies ... *droolz*

Drat, that sucks. But yes, there's always next year! Time to decorate that spare change jar! You can do it!

Yeah!

I don't think this is the right way to our room.
nope boom closet.

Perfect sentiment to go along with that picture. Heh!

[Nolamom]

a certain broom closet...

[gateraid]

If you are looking at it from the standpoint of why it was written, that's a good observation. Why him? Why her? Why the flirty humor? If you're just looking for a scene to fill time, why not show somebody else being interviewed? Or show the team talking about Woolsey?

I'm sure it was written with the realisation that it would come across as flirty (although perhaps only as harmless flirting) given the dialogue involved. I can't think of any actors on SG that wouldn't make it flirty, save for a Sheppard/O'Neill scene:

O'Neill: Are youuuu........defending my honour?

Sheppard: I wouldn't phrase it quite that way sir

O'Neill: Good. By the way, would you mind getting off my desk?

Since Teyla called Elizabeth by her first name, I guess they thought they had to do the same thing with Sam. That was okay, since Teyla is not military. But the military guys were all below her in rank. Can you see one of them calling Caldwell "Steven"? It was also part of the attempt to show her as being just one of the team along with having her eat with them. I'm still pissed off about that.

It took Teyla a long time to call Elizabeth by her first name. Heck, it was s2 before she even called Sheppard "John", which is why "call me Sam" seemed a bit out of place to me.

I don't really think that was the case. Rodney had known her longer and thought he was a close friend of hers. There may have been a tiny bit of jealousy over seeing how close she and John had become (just in a non-shippy way). Plus, Rodney was being emotional because he wanted to save her and didn't understand why John wanted to stop him. Or it may have been a diabolical writer wanting us shippers to think John was willing to kill her. Who knows? I know it just made a few Elizabeth haters very happy. How some writers must have giggled at the fan conflict.

I hadn't thought of it that way, but that's a good explanation, especially in light of how in FS he stood firmly behind her.

[QUOTE=Brie;13426791]

On the Misbegotten thing, I have a feeling that scene, like so many, was thrown in to inject a little humor and to show how the Lanteans 'stick together' against the Earth-peoples who want to mess with their fun. It was an 'exposition' scene, and there's really not two other people who could make that point so quickly or clearly. If Woolsey questions John's abilities, well, that's already been done before (See: Intruder). No one is going to question Rodney's position on the team. Minor characters and aliens don't count as people to take potshots at, they're minor characters and aliens. So the person attacked has to be Elizabeth, and the responder has to be either John or Rodney. Now, as a writer, you ask yourself who is better to come in and gripe about Elizabeth's honor *cue hypothetical dreamy music and hypothetical, made-up scenario*:

PM: I think it should be Sheppard. He's so lackadaisical it'll be funny to see him griping about Woolsey.
JM: It needs to be McKay. He's so arrogant he's the only one who can stand up to Woolsey.
PM: McKay? I don't think that'll work.
JM: Why? He's perfect. And it'll be funny to see him get all bashful when Elizabeth points out he's defending her honor.
PM: Why would McKay gripe about it? He's already so arrogant, he'd just tell Woolsey that. He wouldn't think it was even an issue.
JM: Yes, but concerning Elizabeth's...
PM: Concerning Elizabeth's what? Having Rodney come into her office and gripe is completely out of character for him.
JM: All McKay DOES is gripe.
PM: ABOUT HIMSELF. Sheppard's the best. He works, and he'll be funny.
JM: You realize what could come of a 'honor' scene from Sheppard and Weir.
We have no choice. And there's no ship in here anyway, you know that.
SHIPPERS: Thank you!

As usual, lol, keep up the good work

*snorts* Yeah, kinda like how Carter and Keller are all talking about grieving over Kate in Doppelganger, as if Carter even knew her all that well. WTF?

That scene was really jarring and ill-advised

K so I came up with this question during work. Don't know how it came it came up but it did. But I thought it would strike up a nice discussion amongst us since we have great conversations over here....

So say the TPTB kept Elizabeth exactly where she was on Atlantis, no Replicator beam sent her flying to her "death" and the monstrosity known as Lifeline didn't happen. First off would you like to make this change or still have Elizabeth left behind and have a dynamic plot for the whole season of John trying to find her? And would we see a less tormented John Sheppard had she been around? Whatcha think.

I think it was gateraid who mentioned the "Carter in command of the Apollo" idea.

I've elaborated on it, but the basic premise of "Carter gets the Apollo" is pretty much straight from TPTW. There were some good ideas in the writers room, only some of which got executed

Very Very OT:

Spoiler:

going to a free advanced screening of the dark knight rises tommrow night so i won't be on.

Seen it.

Shep: I'm sending a couple extra Marines with your team, Major.
Lorne: More Marines, Sir, we already have four.
Shep: And I told them not to leave Elizabeth's side.
Lorne: I don't think there's room in the jumper.
Shep: Make room, Major. That's an order.
Lorne: Yes Sir. I know how you worry about her, Sir.
Shep: Major. *looks threatening*
Lorne: About us, I know you worry about us all, Sir.
Shep: And don't you forget it, Major.

Lol

I think around the time of the news that Elizabeth was going to be written out but would appear in S4, there were a lot of different ideas as to how that could happen.

While it still burns me a little in losing Elizabeth, I always thought that the 'lose her, find her' scenario would have been great (because, similar to the Teyla arc that took the same twist, they'd be thinking about her even when the episode didn't focus on her). But I think it would have been absolutely fantastic to see Elizabeth 'go rogue'--as in, having her be influenced by her nanites and become a temporary villain. Torri would have relished that chance, I think (as she did in TLG) and it would have been such a seriously cool twist, to have this rational, stoic character who'd been the rock of support for the expedition for so long all of a sudden be it's (almost greatest) threat. We're talking the Kolya-style storylines, or Michael, on steroids. Could you imagine the John angst? How Ronon or Rodney would handle it?

Of course, I'd want it to be the type of story that resolved with her being well again, which wouldn't have happened the way the situation played out, but I think if they'd preplanned and considered this an arc for S4, it would have been a great way to shake up the Elizabeth character without losing her. And when they finally managed to save her (which would have been her probably electing to overcome her own nanites) the fallout from what happened would have been fantastic. Could you imagine Elizabeth displaced because SGC/IOA didn't trust her, and having to deal with Woolsey and not knowing what to do since power's been stripped from her? Trying to be the diplomat and being lost? It would have been all so delicious, and such a challenge for Torri. *sigh sigh*

IDK, I'm not confident of how a badside!Weir would have turned out, especially with the reintegration. I am in favour of her being gone a few eps, but put back in the job reasonably quickly. I would have preferred her to be a little colder in some of her decision making - such as actively pushing for wiping out the replicators, taking a harder line with the Genii...that sort of thing. Whilst it obviously depends on how it's written, I've always thought that having Weir 'position-less' makes her seem like a bit of a hanger-on.

I really like all of the theories and I think we can all agree on how much more the writers could have done on so many levels than what they did.


I have to add that I also think that it would have been great to see her do more of what she was originally hired by the SGC to do which was to handle tough negotiations but we didn’t see her do anywhere near enough of that. It was also obvious that Shep’s team were better at making enemies than friends and most of the friends they did make was when it all originally came back to Elizabeth being the one who handled the final negotiations, even if there were times when things didn’t go so well i.e ‘Condemned’ and ‘Progeny’ (though it’s obvious the at it was because she was supposed to get infected) she still handled what came to her in an amazing way like with the Magistrate and the replicators.

Daniel Jackson said this about her in ‘Lost City’:

“I've heard of her. She's an expert in international politics. She mediates some high level negotiations for the UN. I actually referenced some of her work when I drafted the first treaty for the Tokra.”

What you've alluded to is how I originally envisioned the character - sometimes going off-world to deal with people, but not getting into too much trouble, kinda like what happened in Inferno.

As opposed to their original plans for S4 which involved Rodney and Katie Brown having a baby and Teyla's people missing all season or something. I guess we should be thankful for small favors.

I liked Rodney and Katie, although I wonder how the ship would have worked out by the time of s5

Weir: Geez, I just caught my reflection in the window. My ass looks amazing in these pants

Sheppard: Why do you think I bought them for you?

Morning, everybody!

OT:

Spoiler:

I came home with a bad headache yesterday, then got into a fight with my mom, and it became a migraine. She won't let go of something that happened twenty years ago, and it's making her act stupid and childish. I woke up this morning and still had the headache and my eyes hurt from crying so much. I have never had a hangover, but I imagine this feels a little bit like one.

I wanna try and work on my fic, so I'll be lurking.

And I wish I could go to a con! But I think the only way I'd ever go is if Joe and Torri were there the same day. And I was married to a sugar daddy.

Ah, family issues, the bane of humanity Hope things improve for you

Awww, no if you had a hangover, you'd be puking also. Sorry your mom is being difficult.

Start saving for next year.

Not necessarily, you can have a hangover sans vomit. Trust me, I know more about this subject than I care to

[Southern Red]

a certain broom closet...

Ah yes, the ever present broom closet. That was a nice little fantasy unique to Sparky I think. I doubt anybody here actually believed it, but it was a fun little bit of fodder for fanfics.

I love the way our ship is mostly based on things we actually saw on screen, like the scene in Misbegotten we were talking about earlier or the desk sitting and the balcony scenes or the times he sought her out like at the end of TRW. And those are just the subtle moments. We don't need to go into the big moments like when he risked infection by nanites to save her or carrying her to the infirmary in his arms or his obvious grief when he lost her. We never needed to make stuff up or have to bend over backwards to shoehorn ship into a scene just because they were in the same room together, yet they never looked at each other. Sparky was alive and on screen for the world to see.

[Brie]

Hello everyone and happy end of the workweek.

Hopefully you had a better week than John did however if did have a tough week then I hope you had an Elizabeth to lean on.

[Brie]

I love the way our ship is mostly based on things we actually saw on screen, like the scene in Misbegotten we were talking about earlier or the desk sitting and the balcony scenes or the times he sought her out like at the end of TRW. And those are just the subtle moments. We don't need to go into the big moments like when he risked infection by nanites to save her or carrying her to the infirmary in his arms or his obvious grief when he lost her. We never needed to make stuff up or have to bend over backwards to shoehorn ship into a scene just because they were in the same room together, yet they never looked at each other. Sparky was alive and on screen for the world to see.

Absolutely and I think I said this when I first got here but I don’t remember. Anyway when I first saw the show when it first aired back in 2004 I loved Sparky and John and Elizabeth right away, it was just something about them that drew me in, however then season 4 happened and it wasn’t as much fun anymore even though I did keep on watching it until the bitter end. Then about two years passed and I must admit that SGA kinda sunk into the background but then one day at the end of last year I re-watched the show and I did think that since I knew how it was going to turn out (no Sparky and no Elizabeth at the end) I decided to try and watch it with an open mind but bam, first season and I was right back in the world of Sparky because it was just like you said always there and I do think that maybe one of the reasons why it worked was maybe because TPTB didn’t plan on it and so it was allowed to happened naturally and it was never forced and never in-your-face (you know, it wasn’t talked about as something that we should see but didn’t like other ships that we won’t mention) and I must say that I don’t totally mind since we all know that TPTB weren’t very good at writing them well.

[Scary Kitty]

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Pretty Friday!

a certain broom closet... http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j5...oom_Closet.gif

Ahahahah! The infamous broom closet of crackalicious fun!

I've elaborated on it, but the basic premise of "Carter gets the Apollo" is pretty much straight from TPTW. There were some good ideas in the writers room, only some of which got executed

And of those that did, only some of them were executed well.

IDK, I'm not confident of how a badside!Weir would have turned out, especially with the reintegration. I am in favour of her being gone a few eps, but put back in the job reasonably quickly. I would have preferred her to be a little colder in some of her decision making - such as actively pushing for wiping out the replicators, taking a harder line with the Genii...that sort of thing. Whilst it obviously depends on how it's written, I've always thought that having Weir 'position-less' makes her seem like a bit of a hanger-on.

I suppose that gets back to what I just mentioned about story ideas being executed well... TPTW didn't have a very good track record in that department.

What you've alluded to is how I originally envisioned the character - sometimes going off-world to deal with people, but not getting into too much trouble, kinda like what happened in Inferno.

Or Condemned.

Weir: Geez, I just caught my reflection in the window. My ass looks amazing in these pants

Sheppard: Why do you think I bought them for you?

*snickers*

Ah yes, the ever present broom closet. That was a nice little fantasy unique to Sparky I think. I doubt anybody here actually believed it, but it was a fun little bit of fodder for fanfics.

I love the way our ship is mostly based on things we actually saw on screen, like the scene in Misbegotten we were talking about earlier or the desk sitting and the balcony scenes or the times he sought her out like at the end of TRW. And those are just the subtle moments. We don't need to go into the big moments like when he risked infection by nanites to save her or carrying her to the infirmary in his arms or his obvious grief when he lost her. We never needed to make stuff up or have to bend over backwards to shoehorn ship into a scene just because they were in the same room together, yet they never looked at each other. Sparky was alive and on screen for the world to see.

Word to the wordy word! Sparky is canon. Get over it, nay-sayers!

[ShipperWriter]

Ah yes, the ever present broom closet. That was a nice little fantasy unique to Sparky I think. I doubt anybody here actually believed it, but it was a fun little bit of fodder for fanfics.

Oh yes.

I love the way our ship is mostly based on things we actually saw on screen, like the scene in Misbegotten we were talking about earlier or the desk sitting and the balcony scenes or the times he sought her out like at the end of TRW. And those are just the subtle moments. We don't need to go into the big moments like when he risked infection by nanites to save her or carrying her to the infirmary in his arms or his obvious grief when he lost her. We never needed to make stuff up or have to bend over backwards to shoehorn ship into a scene just because they were in the same room together, yet they never looked at each other. Sparky was alive and on screen for the world to see.

*points up*

What she said.

[Southern Red]

It's been a quiet day around here. Let's hope tomorrow brings better news for us all. I scored some discount tickets to see The Addams Family at the Kennedy Center, so Mr. SR and I will be putting on uncomfortable shoes and stepping out on the town. See you tomorrow.

[Scary Kitty]

It's been a quiet day around here. Let's hope tomorrow brings better news for us all. I scored some discount tickets to see The Addams Family at the Kennedy Center, so Mr. SR and I will be putting on uncomfortable shoes and stepping out on the town. See you tomorrow.

Sounds like a great time, you and Mr. SR have fun!

And yes, let's hope tomorrow is a far better day than today. *hugs everyone*

[ShipperWriter]

It's been a quiet day around here. Let's hope tomorrow brings better news for us all. I scored some discount tickets to see The Addams Family at the Kennedy Center, so Mr. SR and I will be putting on uncomfortable shoes and stepping out on the town. See you tomorrow.

Have fun!

Sounds like a great time, you and Mr. SR have fun!

And yes, let's hope tomorrow is a far better day than today. *hugs everyone*

*returns group hug*

It's just been a weird day for me. I have no motivation to do anything whatsoever. I've been watching movies for most of the day. Such a lazy bum.

[Nolamom]

we all need lazy bum days from time to time

[TheLadyMore]

we all need lazy bum days from time to time

I'm having one all weekend seeing I have no car.