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Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

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    Originally posted by FoolishPleasure
    I have found that the younger gals identify more with Teyla (though not all) and the more mature ladies (not necessarily "older", but maybe more intelligent ) identify more with Weir.

    Of course, they ALL want Sheppard.

    If that's true, maybe we become more fussy as we get older as to how female characters are portrayed and that effects how we 'ship'.

    I know as a female viewer I judge female characters far more harshly than male ones. Partly that is purely hormonal and partly it is because the potential for identifying with them is stronger and therefore I am more selective. Most TV writers are still male and some are better than others at writing female characters but I still think even with the good ones that you are more likely to get stereotypical and 'mary sue ish' female characters than you are male ones.

    Mely is right that how you choose a ship is partly dependent on your subjective opinion of the attractiveness of the characters involved. You pick the two who you think look good together and also whose personality you identify with. I am certain that has effected my ship preferences in the past. However it doesn't apply to SGA for me. To be brutally honest when I saw the promo pics before SGA aired the only one I thought was remotely attractive ( totally subjective opinion) was JF as Sheppard. Looks wise if you are talking about who looks good with Sheppard, Weir or Teyla, I don't have a preference.

    Personality wise, in the beginning I found both Weir and Teyla bland and unengaging. I quickly became attached right from the start to Shep,McKay,Beckett and even Zelenka and Ford a little bit. I could happily watch episodes with them interacting for hours. This is know doubt due to what I said earlier about how differently I perceive male and female characters as a female viewer. Over time Weir's character has developed and has grown on me and although I still don't really identify with her, I do respect her and find her and her interaction with Sheppard interesting. This is why I ship ShWeir but it took a while. I still don't find Teyla emotionally engaging. Even though her character development in 'The Gift' was interesting and from a story perspective I enjoyed that element of the episode, I didn't care about her. That's the crucial difference between how I perceive the character of Teyla and pretty much every other character in the show. For example I cared about how Sheppard's insubordination would effect Weir's perception of her position as leader in 'Hot Zone' and I was totally emotionally engaged with Weir in 'Before I Sleep' and in 'Poisoning the Well' I really felt for what Beckett was going through and I know that in 'The Seige'
    big spoiler so don't look...
    Spoiler:
    I am going to feel really bad when one of my favourite secondary character's meets his fate and I would trade Teyla for 'him' any day.


    I feel more of an attachment to some of the bad guys, like Kolya and poor old long dead 'Steve' than I do Teyla. I even love being able to hate Kavanaugh more. I think 'The Gift' was too late on the season for them to suddenly find a purpose and some indication of personal development for Teyla, who is after all a main character, because most viewers have already formed reactions to the characters. They can build on it with her in season two and I hope they do but it is going to take a lot for her to catch up with how I view all the other characters.

    The only attraction I can see for strongly liking the Sheyla 'ship' as opposed to any other including ShWeir is that because Teyla has been so undeveloped so far, she is kind of like a blank slate where a shipper, who is also a Shep thunker can 'mary sue' her by incorporating their own preferred characteristics ( and therefore in someways themselves) into how they perceive her character and therefore metaphorically speaking 'write' themselves into the story. This maybe more attractive to younger viewers. Teyla does have appealing characteristics, like she is a strong leader and a kick ass fighter and takes moral stands on certain issues but beyond that everything else is open to interpretation and personal choice.
    ~ Esther~ My Live Journal
    FBI - Body Preservation Division

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      I'm so tired of "mary sue" stories - maybe I've just seen too much TV over the years - and I find Teyla/Shep just another "mary sue". Teyla can fight (and that makes her interesting?) but she is still the "girl from the trailer park who meets man of importance who can give her a better life" - ending up in a "needy" relationship - I "need" you to help/complete me. Yawn.

      Putting a strong female (not necessarily strong physically) with a strong male makes for a much more interesting scenario. Weir and Sheppard can play off each other with romance, angst, respect, struggle for authority, etc. There are a lot of different ways TPTB can take them.



      When all else fails, change channels.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Blue Banrigh
        Don't think we really need a slogan.

        Yay, next chapter of Strange Bedfellows is up! I love this fic.
        Is it? Yay!

        *runs off*

        No, no slogan. Just four numbers:

        39:30

        Comment


          Originally posted by smallgirl

          The only attraction I can see for strongly liking the Sheyla 'ship' as opposed to any other including ShWeir is that because Teyla has been so undeveloped so far, she is kind of like a blank slate where a shipper, who is also a Shep thunker can 'mary sue' her by incorporating their own preferred characteristics ( and therefore in someways themselves) into how they perceive her character and therefore metaphorically speaking 'write' themselves into the story. This maybe more attractive to younger viewers. Teyla does have appealing characteristics, like she is a strong leader and a kick ass fighter and takes moral stands on certain issues but beyond that everything else is open to interpretation and personal choice.
          Esther, that was a great post! And I am really intrigued by the last paragraph. That's very true and it could be precisely why folk do ship Shep/Teyla, but I do wonder if we all don't do that to a certain extent. I could easily project myself onto Weir, she's about the same age, so she's easy enough to write...

          Comment


            Originally posted by astronomicalchick
            Is it? Yay!

            *runs off*

            No, no slogan. Just four numbers:

            39:30

            Darn right.
            Mirror, Mirror: Melyanna's multi-fandom fic site
            Last update: 14 April 2006
            Melyanna's Multimedia
            Last update: 15 February 2006

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              Originally posted by Angel of Fire SG1
              *gets so excited when it's updated*

              That and Eshu...which is apparently on its way!! *looks in Mel's direction grinning*
              Amending my remarks from earlier... It's updated, are you happy now?
              Mirror, Mirror: Melyanna's multi-fandom fic site
              Last update: 14 April 2006
              Melyanna's Multimedia
              Last update: 15 February 2006

              Comment


                Originally posted by Melyanna
                Amending my remarks from earlier... It's updated, are you happy now?
                Well I was... everyone go and read!! It's fab!

                http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2097284/16/

                Comment




                  "Elizabeth, I was thinking... if we survive the Wraith... we could er.. erm...
                  organize a production of Romeo and Juliet... this balcony would be perfect for Act 2 Scene2... You could be Juliet and I... er... could play Romeo..."
                  Last edited by Easter Lily; 01 March 2005, 01:56 PM.
                  sigpic
                  "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Melyanna
                    Honestly, I think sometimes people ship because the characters look good together, or because they don't like other ship possibilities. What I really don't get is how Shep/Teyla and McKay/Weir appear together so often in fics and such. It's like the author doesn't want Sheppard and Weir together, so he'll pair them both off with someone else to prevent it. But that's a phenomenon I've seen in several other fandoms (with that reason sometimes stated), so I guess it's not really surprising.
                    That was my theory, I asked them that over at the Sheppard/Teyla thread and the majority of them do ship for McKay/Weir as well. Though I haven't asked the McKay/Weir shippers though.

                    Ohh, new fan-fic. Nice *giggles evilly* Haven't read that one yet.

                    Forgive me for sounding dense (or not paying attention) but I don't get the four numbers. Pages? Ages?

                    Originally posted by Easter Lily


                    "Elizabeth, I was thinking... if we survive the Wraith... we could er.. erm...
                    organize a production of Romeo and Juliet... this balcony would be perfect for Act 2 Scene2... You could be Juliet and I... er... could play Romeo..."
                    I just keep thinking, he'd have one hell of a climb from the ground floor.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Easter Lily
                      [IMG]
                      "Elizabeth, I was thinking... if we survive the Wraith... we could er.. erm...
                      organize a production of Romeo and Juliet... this balcony would be perfect for Act 2 Scene2... You could be Juliet and I... er... could play Romeo..."
                      *LOL* We all know what happened to R & J.

                      I also would like to know about this 39:30 thing. I've missed something somewhere.



                      When all else fails, change channels.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by FoolishPleasure
                        *LOL* We all know what happened to R & J.

                        I also would like to know about this 39:30 thing. I've missed something somewhere.
                        It ain't the number of posts, or the actors ages, or the number of pages in the thread. Okay, that's enough thinking on my part.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Blue Banrigh

                          I just keep thinking, he'd have one hell of a climb from the ground floor.
                          Think puddlejumper... think pilot...
                          Good for interplanetary travel and theatrical productions involving high balconies
                          sigpic
                          "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Easter Lily
                            Liz: Hey John. . I was thinking. . this might be a good place for the bungee jumping club to meet on Thursday afternoons.



                            When all else fails, change channels.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by astronomicalchick
                              Esther, that was a great post! And I am really intrigued by the last paragraph. That's very true and it could be precisely why folk do ship Shep/Teyla, but I do wonder if we all don't do that to a certain extent. I could easily project myself onto Weir, she's about the same age, so she's easy enough to write...

                              Oh I agree that we all definitely do that to a certain extent as shippers. If we find a male character appealing we usually want him to be paired off with which ever female character we can identify with the closest. It just makes sense. I have definitely done that in terms of ships I have supported in other fandoms in the past. However I have also found in other fandoms that with certain female characters who seem to be rather bland and unengaging that younger viewers tend to ship them because they are easier to graft your own personality traits onto. With SGA I don't really identify with Weir or Teyla very much so I just like ShWeir because I respect Weir as a strong female character and find that her interaction with Shep interesting.
                              ~ Esther~ My Live Journal
                              FBI - Body Preservation Division

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by FoolishPleasure
                                *LOL* We all know what happened to R & J.

                                I also would like to know about this 39:30 thing. I've missed something somewhere.
                                I'm pretty sure it is from the Siege Part 2
                                Spoiler:
                                When John and Liz share THAT look when he was going on the suicide mission

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