Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Chrysalis]

Well... Yes, I suppose you're right. I rather suspect that had it been Elizabeth, John wouldn't have been quite so willing to send her packing.

I'm still very amused that John actually brought it up at the end. And that the writers threw in a scene which would normally only appear in fic.

I see it that way too. It's a scene that really didn't need to be there, unless it was to further the personal connection between the characters. Very interesting little gift to us from TPTB, and as far as I'm concerned, yet another indication that they're leaning very strongly to Shep/Weir as a ship!

[Major_Moomin]

Exactly. What's the most logical answer for that? John isn't complex in his maleness.

Spoiler:

Why turn the girl down? She's offering him something as a male, he'd most definitely want! She's offering him a chance for power as well. A chance to be something 'bigger' than he already is.

There's no reason he should have turned any of that down unless...

He's already very happy with what he has and what he sees the flickering possibility of.

John is going out of his way to make sure that Elizabeth knows [spoiler] nothing happened between he and the other woman. Why? What's the logical answer?
He sounds like a husband who has been 'seen' in a potentially compromising position with another woman and feels 'guilty' because of it but is hastily reassuring his wife not to worry because "nothing happened". She tried to tempt me babe but I didn't bite...( because you know that I ____ you. ) John didn't add last part of the sentence but he's letting Elizabeth begin to figure that part out herself.

Gah! I've so got to get busy! You guys are a bad influence on me!

I see where your coming from Bama.

Spoiler:

It'e like he's picked up on the fact that she may feel something more than friendship for him. And I believe John knows her well enough now to know that she would never comprimise her position as leader by admitting that to him.
So he's 'testing the waters' so to speak, guaging her reaction before he even begins to think about persuing a possible relationship, just to be sure he doesn't make a complete prat of himself if he's wrong!

[Erised]

I see where your coming from Bama.

Spoiler:

It'e like he's picked up on the fact that she may feel something more than friendship for him. And I believe John knows her well enough now to know that she would never comprimise her position as leader by admitting that to him.
So he's 'testing the waters' so to speak, guaging her reaction before he even begins to think about persuing a possible relationship, just to be sure he doesn't make a complete prat of himself if he's wrong!

very good point Major You're right, he's cheking the possibility very carefully.

[Southern Red]

Just watched the clip! Love you blue!!! And might I say, 'OH PLEASE~!'

Spoiler:

What the heck are some of these people watching to say John 'got some' and was 'lying to Elizabeth'!? He so was NOT. He told her the truth and he phrased it just how he wanted to that best probed her reactions and got her attention on him in the 'new' way he's wanting it. I hope we know John Sheppard well enough to know he would not freakin LIE to Elizabeth that way and I think I know him well enough that he would NEVER throw up something so personal in her face in such a way if it had actually happened! Please. Some of these people obviously think very little of these characters to make such a dumbass assumption. And yeah, that's what it is. It's beyond lame and just insulting to both characters and their trustful and established relationship! That scene is *very* important for a couple of reasons. One, you guys point out is that they very *intentionally* brought back the balcony scene. (YES! I think they DO listen to our wishes a little!) and two, John is FREAKING PROBING WITH THAT REMARK!! That's the kind of remark that a guy tosses out to gauge a girl's reaction to see if she shows signs of jealousy or if she'll be surprised or if she'll ask questions. John is TEASING Elizabeth there with a *personal* male/female innuendo.

Ever heard him tease Teyla or any other woman with such. DADGUM! This is important people! As southern said above, the mating dance has begun and the music has just started!!! True...oh so doggone true!

I was just speculating about people saying he was lying. As far as I know, that hasn't happened. Sorry to be unclear.

Spoiler:

But I've been to several forums and mostly guys are under the impression he slept with her. I guess they didn't pay attention to the balcony scene. That ticks me off though, because it would have been so easy to show him rejecting her. *stamps foot*

[Bama]

I see where your coming from Bama.

Spoiler:

It'e like he's picked up on the fact that she may feel something more than friendship for him. And I believe John knows her well enough now to know that she would never comprimise her position as leader by admitting that to him.
So he's 'testing the waters' so to speak, guaging her reaction before he even begins to think about persuing a possible relationship, just to be sure he doesn't make a complete prat of himself if he's wrong!

I know it's astounding but we're learning some things about John Sheppard! We're learning that sex in and of itself is not 'enough' for him. I so agree with many of you that John is feeling things he's not sure of because he's never felt them with a woman before. He's still a little confused. He was *supposed* to go after Teyla-she was the babe that caught his attention first but he found he couldn't pursue it seriously. He's a flyboy. He's *supposed* to be chasing skirts but he's having trouble continuing to pull the trigger. We know he's a smart guy but even the smartest of men have trouble being totally in touch many times with what they're feeling emotionwise. Especially if that emotion is totally *new* to anything they've experienced before. And like you all, I'm convinced these emotions that he's feeling for Elizabeth are totally new to him and have him out of his element and off his game.

We've also learned that Elizabeth is an open person. She is a person that wants to share her emotions to a degree with someone she trusts. She is an affectionate woman and can't totally contain herself when she feels deeply enough for another. Like many women, she takes things very personally. I think John has learned that about her. Again, he's a guy but he's a smart one. Like you said, he knows she won't, more as a concession to their jobs, openly admit that she's attracted to him or that she feels more than professional feelings for him. But she's giving him all the 'right' and 'normal' signals so far and as a guy, he's learned to interpret them over the years. I think he thinks he's interpreting them correctly but he's just almost blown away by the idea that Elizabeth-*Elizabeth* -of all people- could be the 'one' that's different for him. He senses the 'bigger' importance of this 'thing' growing between them and he doesn't want to do anything to 'blow it'.

I'm totally blaming you guys if my RV cake falls flat! 'Yeah Mom, you see, I was chatting on this site about this tv couple...' LOL!

[FoolishPleasure]

I was just speculating about people saying he was lying. As far as I know, that hasn't happened.

If Sheppard WAS lying to Weir, that would make him a total cad and scumbag in my book, and I think many of the fans would feel the same way, whether they were "shippers" or not. I don't think TPTB really want their lead hero thought of as a total jerk.

[Bama]

I was just speculating about people saying he was lying. As far as I know, that hasn't happened. Sorry to be unclear.

Spoiler:

But I've been to several forums and mostly guys are under the impression he slept with her. I guess they didn't pay attention to the balcony scene. That ticks me off though, because it would have been so easy to show him rejecting her. *stamps foot*

Well ask them...do they think John is a liar? Do they think he's all the sudden lying to Elizabeth when he never has in the past? And if so, why is he lying to her about this particular event?

I'm astounded by how many people simply don't pay attention to detail when they watch. Mel even said that her script read that he

Spoiler:

rejects the girl's advances

! Please. I don't want to call people dolts but if the shoe fits...

[Melyanna]

If Sheppard WAS lying to Weir, that would make him a total cad and scumbag in my book, and I think many of the fans would feel the same way, whether they were "shippers" or not. I don't think TPTB really want their lead hero thought of as a total jerk.

No, just a partial jerk. But in all seriousness? I think this scene was a great buildup to what we've heard is coming up in the next episode. We've seen lots from Elizabeth's side, and now we're hearing lots from John. We're in for quite a ride, folks.

[wizengamot]

I mean come on now ya'll, think about this scene. Think... Think about men... Are we all thinking? No... not that way... think of their totally absolutely mind-boggling complexities...

Spoiler:

IMO from dealing with horny teens all day and seeing that face, it is total smugness. smug smug smug smug smug smug!!! (yeah, I said it 6 times) the only time I think he actually looks at her is when she laughs at one of his jokes and then that is not smugness, that is absolute smug, hoodie hoodie hoo look at me! It's hilarious, I love it, I loved the babe naked and him not thinking with his head and like a typical male being all "Commitment? WHAT?! I thought this was a booty call!" Its good stuff! Between the gloating and what is to come in tlg i think its obvious that TPTB are toying with us and are like "Oh you want? Well you can't have it!" So I'd say things are looking up for our ship

Did that make sense? No. Most likely not. My brain is discombobulated. but i said it none the less. don't hate.

[Major_Moomin]

I'm totally blaming you guys if my RV cake falls flat! 'Yeah Mom, you see, I was chatting on this site about this tv couple...' LOL!

*Gets out mental scales*...Cake...Sparky...Cake...Sparky...

That's a toughy...is it good cake???

[Major_Moomin]

No, just a partial jerk. But in all seriousness? I think this scene was a great buildup to what we've heard is coming up in the next episode. We've seen lots from Elizabeth's side, and now we're hearing lots from John. We're in for quite a ride, folks.

It's so true!...Since the beginning, John as always been quite guarded with Liz, and she's always been the one to come forward. Even thoguh I havn't seen as many Eps as you guys, I can already see a massive difference in John this season. He's more open in their friendship. All these little pieces will eventually make one whole big piece that is called a 'Relationship'

[Chrysalis]

The Balcony Scene (for anyone who is interested).

You rock, Blue!
Great scene. Is it just me or

Spoiler:

does John look pretty smug and proud of himself for having turned down the girl? Very cute! And Joe and Torri look divine, as always!

[The Kaibosh]

Hi folks. Kaibosh here.

Regarding some of the back and forth here about whether or not Sheppard did indeed sleep with Mara and what he said to Weir at the end of "The Tower"; respectfully I have to say I am of the opinion that Sheppard did indeed sleep with Mara. I don't know how many people posting here have actually seen the episode but I did last night and posted the following details in the episode section. The scene with Mara went exactly like this:

Mara: Maybe there is something I could do to make you more comfortable.

Sheppard: No. I don't think so.

Mara: Are you certain? (Undoes her robe and drops it to the floor. She stands in front of Sheppard naked.)

Sheppard: (looking her over) Oh...wow. I never see this coming.

Mara: You don't find me pleasing.

Sheppard: Oh no its not that. Its just that......(Mara quickly moves in to kiss him)

Sheppard stands somewhat bewildered while Mara is kissing him. She pulls away briefly and kisses him again. He kisses back. They kiss briefly and she pulls back again smiling and excited.

Mara: What you said at dinner. Did you mean it?

Sheppard: (leaning in to kiss her) Absolutley. (Kisses Mara then moves to her neck)

Sheppard: What did I say again?

Mara: About the villiagers. My brother thinks its a sign of weakness but I know it means you will make a great ruler some day.

Sheppard: (not really listening in a half whisper) Right.

Sheppard and Mara continue to kiss then it hits him and he pulls away looking confused.

Sheppard: RULER?!...wha...what are you talking about?

Mara: (beaming) My father has promised that if we are married, succession will fall to me.

Sheppard is still looking a little perplexed while Mara pushes him backwards onto the bed and happily moves in to join him.....end scene.

Now all of this of course is subject to interpretation but it did look very much to me that Sheppard was into it. As for whether or not he was lying to Weir I can only speculate that it was possibly out of sense of respect not to get into any gorey details. The conversation on the balcony didn't seem more than just two peers talking casually about the days events. Sheppard was reporting a job well done and didn't hesitate to toot his horn a little bit.

For the record though, I DO believe that Sheppard and Weir are going to get together in some way eventually and that they do indeed care very much for each other but we still got lots of plot and character development to go.

Cheers.

[Athenaktt]

No, just a partial jerk. But in all seriousness? I think this scene was a great buildup to what we've heard is coming up in the next episode. We've seen lots from Elizabeth's side, and now we're hearing lots from John. We're in for quite a ride, folks.

Let's just hope the ride isn't too bumpy.

[FoolishPleasure]

Did Wizen just try to say men are "complex"? *cleaning wax out of ears*. *LMAO*

I want some of Bama's red velvet cake! *stomping foot*