Rodney McKay/Jennifer Keller Discussion/Ship/Appreciation

[Hawke1984]

*pops up* How is everyone?

I'm good, thanks

[Hawke1984]

we are just trying to figure out when Rodney realised he loved Jen and when Jen realised she loved Rodney

[JenniferJF]

Usually just lurk, but wanted to jump in:

Well, then we got The Shrine

Spoiler:

and we know he loved her at this point, but what about Jennifer? And when did Rodney's feelings progress that far? I think TPTB would like to say that this was when Jennifer realise her feelings for him, but future events don't back that up.

I agree with your thoughts, except for the last comment:

Spoiler:

I don't think Jennifer was ever unsure in her feelings for McKay vs. Ronan. I think she consistently treated Ronan like a woman does when she sorta realizes a guy has a crush on her and is flattered but doesn't reciprocate and wants to neither lead him on nor break his heart and really does value his friendship. At least, I think it's that way after Trio. So I do think the intent was always to have Keller and McKay end up together, they just threw the Ronan thing in there to stir up the water.

And this is coming from someone who doesn't really consider herself a McKeller shipper, having never really had a strong bias about wanting them to get together (my husband would actually have preferred her to end up with Ronan) but I do try to call the show like I see it and what I've seen for the last year or so is fairly consistent relationship and character development leading to McKay and Keller getting together. Which doesn't, btw, mean I don't love the fact that they're together - especially the effect the relationship has had on maturing McKay - or the bits with them together, it just means I never really desperately wanted it to happen until I realized it was going to.

EDIT: I should add, in Tracker:

Spoiler:

There's an excellent example of what I mean. Jennifer merely said the guy reminded her of Ronan, but she was thinking enough about McKay to save the device for him and give it to him as soon as she could because he was that much on her mind. A completely different level of concern, imho. 'The guys' may not have seen her obvious preference, but I think the audience was shown it.

[Pandora's_Box]

I agree with your thoughts, except for the last comment:[spoiler]I don't think Jennifer was ever unsure in her feelings for McKay vs. Ronan. I think she consistently treated Ronan like a woman does when she sorta realizes a guy has a crush on her and is flattered but doesn't reciprocate and wants to neither lead him on nor break his heart and really does value his friendship. At least, I think it's that way after Trio. So I do think the intent was always to have Keller and McKay end up together, they just threw the Ronan thing in there to stir up the water.

Oh, I never really thought TPTB meant to write anything overly serious between the two of them. I always saw her interactions with him post Quarantine as more friendly than anything else, but I also didn't see her behaving as a woman in love (or a woman realising she's in love) would.

For example, take Tracker.

Spoiler:

If we're to assume that she recognised her true feelings for McKay in The Shrine (and that TPTB meant us to make that assumption) then what was she doing bringing Ronon along on a trip with her and Rodney? Would that not have been the perfect occassion to spend some quality time with the man she knew loved her and that she loved in return? Instead, she's bringing Ronon along and looking at Rodney like he's the one with the problem.

I do try to call the show like I see it and what I've seen for the last year or so is fairly consistent relationship and character development leading to McKay and Keller getting together.

Eh, we're going to have agree to disagree on this one because much as I've been one of the biggest supporters for McKeller on the forum, I'd hardly call the writing of said relationship consistently good.

[RodneyIsGodney]

Hello RIG, I reached 300 posts earlier

I know, I edited my post accordingly.

See!
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Hello peeps!


300 posts!?! Way to go Hawke!


GW doesn't like me today.

[Hawke1984]

I know, I edited my post accordingly.

See!
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v

Thank you, when do you think Jen and Rodney each realised their feelings for each other?

[JenniferJF]

Oh, I never really thought TPTB meant to write anything overly serious between the two of them. I always saw her interactions with him post Quarantine as more friendly than anything else, but I also didn't see her behaving as a woman in love (or a woman realising she's in love) would.

For example, take Tracker.

Spoiler:

If we're to assume that she recognised her true feelings for McKay in The Shrine (and that TPTB meant us to make that assumption) then what was she doing bringing Ronon along on a trip with her and Rodney? Would that not have been the perfect occassion to spend some quality time with the man she knew loved her and that she loved in return? Instead, she's bringing Ronon along and looking at Rodney like he's the one with the problem.

Ah, I see. How I saw it:

Spoiler:

I think after Shrine she wasn't really sure how much of her emotions were for 'the real' McKay, and how much were for who he was when sick. So while I think she still felt the love, and still wanted to love him, I think she was uncertain about how true that emotion was. I also think she was really unsure about his reciprocating it. So going and spending time alone with him like that might actually have been an uncomfortable situation for her, and she might have welcomed the intoduction of a third, even a third who brought as much baggage as Ronan.

I think it took time for her to regain that comfort level and to be certain the depths of her feelings were for 'the real McKay' instead of for simply who he'd been when sick.

And agreeing to disagree is always cool, discussions would get pretty boring if everyone always agreed.

EDIT: And I will agree with you that some of that was stretching to keep up 'the game' of the two ships

[Ewokmonster]

Hmmm....

Well, I definitely don't think it happened in Trio. Nor do I think there was really anything between them at that point beyond a burgeoning friendship or at the very most a pleasant sort of mutual attraction.

Definitely not Trio. Didn't Keller just find out in that ep that Rodney wasn't seeing Katie anymore? She asked him out for a drink, but I think that was more friendship and McKay not dropping her than "hey, Rodney's finally free for meeeee now yay!"

As for The Seed,

Spoiler:

I don't think he necessarily loved her yet at this point. Cared for her? Sure. More than he would a woman who just happened to be a friend? More than likely. But I don't think that even Rodney himself fully realised the depth of his feelings. Note their interaction in the conference room. He's still...uncomfortable...around her. At least that was the vibe I got.

I don't remember this episode at. all. I know I watched when it originally aired, and I don't remember thinking anything unusual about how Rodney acted towards Keller to make me think he was falling for her.

Well, then we got The Shrine

Spoiler:

and we know he loved her at this point, but what about Jennifer? And when did Rodney's feelings progress that far? I think TPTB would like to say that this was when Jennifer realise her feelings for him, but future events don't back that up.

Just goes to show how poorly the whole thing was written, in my opinion.

As much as I like the pairing now, The Shrine was a real wtf? moment for me. I had no idea where Rodney's declaration came from, it was totally out of left field. If TPTB knew this was where they were going, they could have dropped hints in every episode at least. They did a better job setting up Sam and Jack, and that's not saying much, imho. At least we're getting some resolution.

eta:

it just means I never really desperately wanted it to happen until I realized it was going to.

I this about sums up my feelings too. I wasn't actively searching out the pairing, but once I realized they were going there, I gave it two thumbs up.

[RodneyIsGodney]

Didn't Keller just find out in that ep that Rodney wasn't seeing Katie anymore?

All the more reason to insist on that beer! She may have had feelings for him before he broke up with Katie. Just saying.

Thank you, when do you think Jen and Rodney each realised their feelings for each other?

Dunno. It seemed to me that Jennifer had some feelings for Rodney at the end of Trio. Not sure about when Rodney's feelings for Jennifer started tho. I'd have to watch certain eps again to refresh my memory.

Spoiler:

I wasn't really paying attention to their feelings for each other at the time. I was much more focused on a certain Canadian astrophysicist even tho my McKeller heart has been beating since The Last Man, although it did make itself known after Trio.

[Pandora's_Box]

Ah, I see. How I saw it:

Spoiler:

I think after Shrine she wasn't really sure how much of her emotions were for 'the real' McKay, and how much were for who he was when sick. So while I think she still felt the love, and still wanted to love him, I think she was uncertain about how true that emotion was. I also think she was really unsure about his reciprocating it. So going and spending time alone with him like that might actually have been an uncomfortable situation for her, and she might have welcomed the intoduction of a third, even a third who brought as much baggage as Ronan.

I think it took time for her to regain that comfort level and to be certain the depths of her feelings were for 'the real McKay' instead of for simply who he'd been when sick.

And agreeing to disagree is always cool, discussions would get pretty boring if everyone always agreed.

Definitely seems plausible. I guess I've always been of the mindset that if TPTB had decided to roll with the McKeller relationship, then they should have done it right from the outset. And, for me, that meant showing the progress in a logical manner.

[Ewokmonster]

Definitely seems plausible. I guess I've always been of the mindset that if TPTB had decided to roll with the McKeller relationship, then they should have done it right from the outset. And, for me, that meant showing the progress in a logical manner.

I think I've figured out the problem!

Trusting TPTB to have a relationship progress in a logical manner.

Heh.

[Ravenheart]

All the more reason to insist on that beer! She may have had feelings for him before he broke up with Katie. Just saying.



Dunno. It seemed to me that Jennifer had some feelings for Rodney at the end of Trio. Not sure about when Rodney's feelings for Jennifer started tho. I'd have to watch certain eps again to refresh my memory.

Spoiler:

I wasn't really paying attention to their feelings for each other at the time. I was much more focused on a certain Canadian astrophysicist even tho my McKeller heart has been beating since The Last Man, although it did make itself known after Trio.

I agree here. I think Jennifer began to have some feelings for Rodney about here. I'm thinking Rodney's feelings came about somewhere between The Seed and The Shrine.

Spoiler:

I've had an interest in McKeller since Doppelganger. The way she looked at him when he was in the isolation room, kind of had my thoughts going. Everyone else left, but she stayed and watched him.

[rosey_angel]

hi ya'll

just to add in my 2 cents:

part of me thinks rodney only said he loved keller in 'the shrine' because he thought he was dying. he was going to propose to katie brown because he thought it was the natural progression of their relationship (not to say he didn't have strong feelings for her), but he never told katie that he loved her. i think he told keller this now because he had strong feelings for her and thought it was the right thing to say and the right time to do it, death bed confessional and all.
i note how at the end of Brain Storm

Spoiler:

rodney didn't say he loved keller in return. of course, rodney isn't so good with the emotions until he's sort of forced to have them, but they were alone and she said she loved him, couldn't he have said it again?

i agree with JenniferJF re: keller's actions in Tracker. plus i thought it was so cute

Spoiler:

keller giving rodney that arm device, "my gf got kidnapped and all i got wias this lousy piece of broken technology"

[fuchsia]

hi ya'll

just to add in my 2 cents:

part of me thinks rodney only said he loved keller in 'the shrine' because he thought he was dying. he was going to propose to katie brown because he thought it was the natural progression of their relationship (not to say he didn't have strong feelings for her), but he never told katie that he loved her. i think he told keller this now because he had strong feelings for her and thought it was the right thing to say and the right time to do it, death bed confessional and all.
i note how at the end of Brain Storm

Spoiler:

rodney didn't say he loved keller in return. of course, rodney isn't so good with the emotions until he's sort of forced to have them, but they were alone and she said she loved him, couldn't he have said it again?

i agree with JenniferJF re: keller's actions in Tracker. plus i thought it was so cute

Spoiler:

keller giving rodney that arm device, "my gf got kidnapped and all i got wias this lousy piece of broken technology"

Spoiler:

Maybe because he was facing his own mortality it kind of crystallised his feelings into what he realised was love. He didn't know that's what it was until he thought he was about to lose everything.

That's just what I think..

[rosey_angel]

Spoiler:

Maybe because he was facing his own mortality it kind of crystallised his feelings into what he realised was love. He didn't know that's what it was until he thought he was about to lose everything.

That's just what I think..

hmm that could be it, too.

Spoiler:

when everything else is taken away from him, his memories, his intellect etc, all he has left is his feelings and his relationships. i like that he was still very close to shep and trusting him, coz after all how many times have they saved each others lives?! plus keller was the only one who thought rodney wouldn't like one day to remember everything he lost. shows their relationship was deeper then just on the surface. i could imagine them staying up hours just talking