What if the Wraith are the Ancients

[Antiquitas]

Lets look at simple war equations

Big guns and large amount of people v. big guns and large amount of people the side with the best tech wins.
Big guns v small amount of people with guns the small amount of people win because they are so hard to track and i seem to remember that Germany in ww2 were winning, they only lost due to the fact they were on rations of ammo and they were became vastly outnumbered, but that was big guns v big guns.

War isn't that simple. And... many things including the Liberty ships helped end WW2. Liberty ships were just one factor. I supplied it as an example as how a force that can just keep sending more supplies/troops can eventually overwhelm a foe.

Think about it like this... A small force is harder to detect in some situations, but cannot afford as many mistakes as the big guys. Every loss they take will hurt them a lot worse than if the big guys lost a few soldiers. It's the price of victory. If the big guys are willing to spend the time and effort to totally wipe out the smaller guys, they can. It may be a high toll, but if they have the numbers they can finish the war.

As it applies to the Wraith vs. The Ancients, it was big massive force of more primitive ships going against a smaller force of more advanced ones. Ships take damage as they fight, power gets drained, food gets used up, weapons run out of ammo. Imagine a lone bunker of GIs with machine guns. They could mow down hundreds of people with sharp pointy sticks out of an army of thousands. When that ammo runs out, they are pretty much dead.

In the case of the Ancients and the examples provided, what would one ship do? It might take out a few Hive ships, but eventually the numbers would overwhelm it. These are the Ancients, super intelligent, powerful, and great. If they could have won with their numbers, they would have. Obviously they aren't around any more. As I said, you don't dunk your city into the ocean if you're going out and kicking butt. ^_^

[SmallTimePerson]

but the daedulus, a real crappy ship compared to the ancient ones and even the wraith ones was able, on its own defeat quite a number of wraith. It's not what the resources are, its how you use them that counts.

[Eoin]

but the daedulus, a real crappy ship compared to the ancient ones and even the wraith ones was able, on its own defeat quite a number of wraith. It's not what the resources are, its how you use them that counts.

the deadulas had no effective weapons, they used advanced asgard tech to take out the hive ships

[Lightsabre]

but the daedulus, a real crappy ship compared to the ancient ones and even the wraith ones was able, on its own defeat quite a number of wraith. It's not what the resources are, its how you use them that counts.

The Daedulus used a trick to take out some hive ships, but that trick has been countered. As we saw in the 'siege', they have no effective way of attacking hive ships now.

[Lightsabre]

Umm ur forgetting Vietnam. Oh yes that war. America versus a peasant army, yet the peasants won. America with all its tech and weapons failed beacause of tatics, even little old Australia with its lack of weapon tech and numbers there did more damage. It's not neccassarily what ur resources are its how u use them.

No I'm not, it's just not relevant.
The statement made was ONE ancient ship could wipe out all the wraith ships in pegasus.
'Before I Sleep' effectively nullifies that argument. Basically, it seems that the Ancients sent their best and brightest of ships and men to a peace conference and they lost. End o story.

[Lightsabre]

I think that all the Wraith have the ancient gene and that when the 38 minutes bugs bit them and not totally feed on them, they turned into Wraiths.
In 38 minutes, the bug was stuck on Sheppard and feeding upon him. In the last episode, Shep was only bitten but the the 'wraith' was killed before shep died. In 38 minutes, Shep died for a while so he didn't transform. Also if the Wraith have the Ancient gene, in the coming episode, Michael should have it too.

Watch 'The Gift'. IF you don't have it, go here www.twiztv.com and there is a transcript.
Beckitt says that the wraith are more bug than human. Not ancient, human.
And he says they share more with the bugs than us.
So, how, for the love of god, could they be converted from ancients??
Added to that, '38 minutes' showed us that the bugs don't let go till your dead.
Oh and if they all have the Ancient gene, why did Greg not just fly the jumper away in 'The Defiant One'???
Also, if you theory was correct, why did Shep not start to turn into a wraith.
and please don't quote 'Conversion at me since

Spoiler:

A)His change in 'Conversion' is the work of the retrovirus
and B)He's becoming an iratus bug, not a wraith.

[Antiquitas]

but the daedulus, a real crappy ship compared to the ancient ones and even the wraith ones was able, on its own defeat quite a number of wraith. It's not what the resources are, its how you use them that counts.

We will just have to agree to disagree on that one. ^_^

[jons242]

Watch 'The Gift'. IF you don't have it, go here www.twiztv.com and there is a transcript.
Beckitt says that the wraith are more bug than human. Not ancient, human.
And he says they share more with the bugs than us.
So, how, for the love of god, could they be converted from ancients??
Added to that, '38 minutes' showed us that the bugs don't let go till your dead.
Oh and if they all have the Ancient gene, why did Greg not just fly the jumper away in 'The Defiant One'???
Also, if you theory was correct, why did Shep not start to turn into a wraith.
and please don't quote 'Conversion at me since

Spoiler:

A)His change in 'Conversion' is the work of the retrovirus
and B)He's becoming an iratus bug, not a wraith.

So are you saying it's not possible for a Ancient to turn into a Wraith? If you look at the pictures for Aurora it looks like one of them is in the process of becoming one.

[Lightsabre]

So are you saying it's not possible for a Ancient to turn into a Wraith? If you look at the pictures for Aurora it looks like one of them is in the process of becoming one.

What I'm saying is that all the info we have so far points to it being either impossible or it didn't happen.
We'll have to wait for Aurora to know for sure, anything done on promo pics is simply speculation. For instance, I could say that the woman in the Aurora pics was simply a wriath in disguise.
That said, it could be some ancients were changed, I don't know. But everything the show has told us tells me that the wraith evolved from the bugs, not from the ancients.

[jons242]

Watch 'The Gift'. IF you don't have it, go here www.twiztv.com and there is a transcript.
Beckitt says that the wraith are more bug than human. Not ancient, human.
And he says they share more with the bugs than us.
So, how, for the love of god, could they be converted from ancients??
Added to that, '38 minutes' showed us that the bugs don't let go till your dead.
Oh and if they all have the Ancient gene, why did Greg not just fly the jumper away in 'The Defiant One'???
Also, if you theory was correct, why did Shep not start to turn into a wraith.
and please don't quote 'Conversion at me since

Spoiler:

A)His change in 'Conversion' is the work of the retrovirus
and B)He's becoming an iratus bug, not a wraith.

Beckitt said in "Instinct" that they don't really know much about Wraith physiology and most of what they know is just theory. They definity don’t know the origins of the Wraith. I don’t think SGA writers have come up with a concrete explanation of the origins of the Wraith yet. We will have to see in the up and coming episodes for further explanation.

Originally Posted by Lightsabre
Oh and if they all have the Ancient gene, why did Greg not just fly the jumper away in 'The Defiant One'???
read):[/spoil]

Humans are supposed to be the descendents of the Ancients and not all humans can operate Ancient technology. There are exceptions like Sheppard but most humans need the gene therapy to be able to work Ancient devices. SO it is possible it’s the same with Wraith. The Wraith are suppose to be closer to the bug (38 minutes) it’s possible during the conversion the particular gene required to operate Ancient devices is removed.

The bottom line is neither of us know the orgins of the Wraith the SGA writers either haven't fully decieded the back story yet or they will come out with it in future epsoides.