Transporter accidents: Thomas Riker, and all that stuff

[Coco Pops]

I have a problem.

Thomas Riker is the product of a transporter accident yet no one ordered his destruction....

Yet I feel serious pains when I watch the Voyager episode Tuvix.

Sure Tuvix is the result of you guessed it a transporter accident, but he too was sentient and self aware, all the thingss the Federation hold dear.

Yet when he protests the decision to seperate Neelix and Tuvok and thus "kill" Tuvix even the Doctor protests and Janeway does it anyway.

I just feel so much pain watching this episode.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

[locutes]

this is a good episode, just because of that moral dilemma. For ate the needs of the many more important then the needs of Tuvix?


I really like the episode, just because of that

[maneth]

Yeah, me too. If it had been possible to resurrect Tuvok and Neelix while keeping Tuvix, no doubt it would've been done.

[Coco Pops]

Yeah, me too. If it had been possible to resurrect Tuvok and Neelix while keeping Tuvix, no doubt it would've been done.

Well everyone that has gone through the transporter has a record of their patterm on file as established in other treks such as TNG and they could have extracted the DNA print they wanted and used both the stored patterns to resurrect each of them... At least that's my theory to get out of the dilema....

[jimbeamjunior]

the difference between the riker incident and the tuvix incident is that the riker incident didnt result in him being killed, transformed etc

tuvok and neelix were basically changed into tuvix, and while its sad to lose tuvix the captain was only trying to save 2 of her crew

[the fifth man]

the difference between the riker incident and the tuvix incident is that the riker incident didnt result in him being killed, transformed etc

tuvok and neelix were basically changed into tuvix, and while its sad to lose tuvix the captain was only trying to save 2 of her crew

Agreed! They deserved the chance to live again as two separate people.

[Ice Wolf]

Agreed! They deserved the chance to live again as two separate people.

and a plant

[Coco Pops]

and a plant

Speaking of plants anyone remember the TV series Quark and Ficus who was part plant?

[Captain Obvious]

and a plant

but to quote ( I think shatner) " The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the 1."

thomas riker didnt cause will riker to be killed, but tuvix cause 2 members of the crew to essentially cease to exist, meaning it made sense to axe him.

[P-90_177]

but to quote ( I think shatner) " The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the 1."

thomas riker didnt cause will riker to be killed, but tuvix cause 2 members of the crew to essentially cease to exist, meaning it made sense to axe him.

Actually spock said that quote..........Kirk said: The needs of the 1 outweigh the needs of the many.

[The Mastage Kidd]

Agreed! They deserved the chance to live again as two separate people.

But they were happy the way they were! He wanted to be Tuvix, he didn't want to go back to how things were. Tuvix was more than capable of handling everything both of them did, they had found a place for him. There was no reason, from a perspective of crew safety, that they needed to be separated.

but to quote ( I think shatner) " The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the 1."

thomas riker didnt cause will riker to be killed, but tuvix cause 2 members of the crew to essentially cease to exist, meaning it made sense to axe him.

So it's ok to kill one person to save 2? What if killing 2 people saved 3 others? How about 1 billion to save 2 billion. Where does it stop being something that's sensible and start to be morally wrong? What gives her the right to decide who's life is of more value?

The worse thing is that in a show that liked to cop out with a 3rd option, one wasn't even discussed. I would have liked the episode less if they had a third option, of course, but something in the dialogue stating a 3rd option to never, ever, ever have any possibility would have made me swallow it better and not just think Janeway got some sort of pleasure out of it.

[Coco Pops]

But they were happy the way they were! He wanted to be Tuvix, he didn't want to go back to how things were. Tuvix was more than capable of handling everything both of them did, they had found a place for him. There was no reason, from a perspective of crew safety, that they needed to be separated.



So it's ok to kill one person to save 2? What if killing 2 people saved 3 others? How about 1 billion to save 2 billion. Where does it stop being something that's sensible and start to be morally wrong? What gives her the right to decide who's life is of more value?

The worse thing is that in a show that liked to cop out with a 3rd option, one wasn't even discussed. I would have liked the episode less if they had a third option, of course, but something in the dialogue stating a 3rd option to never, ever, ever have any possibility would have made me swallow it better and not just think Janeway got some sort of pleasure out of it.

In hindsight I think there is a valid 3rd option...They could have used the computer's stored pattern of both crewmembers to resurrect them after first storing a pattern of Tuvix... They've done similar things on TNG so it could not be that hard, and the Doc could synthesise any genetic material if it was needed as s basse substrate or such.