Deep Space 9 Superior

[the Fifth Race]

It was a lot of fun. (big sigh.... they grow so fast!) Oh my Sarah has her "list" ready for "The guy"... must be a teddy-bear type nerd! (gee like her Daddy ) She even has him scoped out... we shall see!
We too have a lot of DVD boxed sets. My better-half is a huge Planet of the Apes fan (the movies) so we have all of those. We have even been doing the Star Trek fan collectives. They have been very interesting. We have the original BSG as well. we are still looking for "V". We loved that show!
I recently began thinking of "Alien Nation", you never see that in reruns do you? someone needs to call the scifi channel!

The Star Trek fan collectives are sweet, except that they have duplicated episodes on some of the Box Sets.

I have an embarrassing amount of DVD and DVD Box Set's in my collection. Some I have never gotten around to watching yet due to the fact that I own and operate a family business and train clients at Gold's gym, especially during the spring and summer time. And like brother Starbase, I will most likely replace a good portion when they become available on Blue-Ray or HD-DVD.

I have V in my collection which I haven't ever watched. I also have the original BSG on DVD, which I watched during its original airing. Gotta love those shiny sliver and gold cylons, my favorite was the shiny red colored cylon named Beelzebub.

^5 on the Alien Nation reference. I actually started an Alien Nation appreciation thread (which gets some action occasionally) in the general scifi fantasy section over a year ago when they released the one season it ran on DVD. The short run television series was ground breaking and done quite well, it was much better than theatrical movie. I dug up a bunch of information about the series and discovered that the ratings for the one season it ran were very good (top 10), but the production costs to film the series were more than studio executives wanted to foot, so they pulled the plug.

[Kliggins]

It was a lot of fun. (big sigh.... they grow so fast!) Oh my Sarah has her "list" ready for "The guy"... must be a teddy-bear type nerd! (gee like her Daddy ) She even has him scoped out... we shall see!
We too have a lot of DVD boxed sets. My better-half is a huge Planet of the Apes fan (the movies) so we have all of those. We have even been doing the Star Trek fan collectives. They have been very interesting. We have the original BSG as well. we are still looking for "V". We loved that show!
I recently began thinking of "Alien Nation", you never see that in reruns do you? someone needs to call the scifi channel!

You're right, you never see Alien in reruns.

[USS Defiant]

I recently began thinking of "Alien Nation", you never see that in reruns do you? someone needs to call the scifi channel!

You're right, you never see Alien in reruns.

<<<< Huge Alien Nation fan, and Fifth Race was right - the television series was much better than the movie. If I remember right after that first season was cancelled in 1989, they produced a handful of 2 hour made for TV Alien Nation movies that followed the same characters from the original television series. Alien Nation touched on subjects that no other show or network did back then. Plus the whole concept of a dying Alien race finding shelter on Earth to literally save themselves from extinction is pretty darn cool besides being a great idea.

As a kid I got my scifi fix by watching one of my very favorites - Lost in Space, I had a huge crush on daughter Judy. Plus it always fun seeing Dr, Zachary Smith wiggle his way out of the Robinsons dog house every episode. Other great puesdo scifi/fanatsy shows I watched as a kid or teenager were The Six Million Dollar Man, Kolchak: The Night Stalker, Buck Rogers, Night Gallery, Incredible Hulk, The Flintstones (when it aired in primtime), The Munsters and The Adams Family were all big around my house. I was also into those Saturday morning television shows like Land of the Lost, Korg 70,000 B.C.. Then there was the Banana Splits Adventure Hour with shows such as The Three Musketeers, Arabian Knights, Micro Ventures, Adventures Of Gulliver, The New Adventures of Huckleberry Finn and Danger Island (famous for the cry of "Oh oh Chongo", and because Richard Donner - director of Lethal Weapon - got his start on it!). Ah yes the days of youth, I got my kids to watch some of those old school shows I enjoyed as a kid, some stuck, some they ignored.

[Rac80]

The Star Trek fan collectives are sweet, except that they have duplicated episodes on some of the Box Sets.

yep that is the one problem with those collectives. and I also feel that instead of duplicating episodes there were others they could have used.

I have V in my collection which I haven't ever watched. I also have the original BSG on DVD, which I watched during its original airing. Gotta love those shiny sliver and gold cylons, my favorite was the shiny red colored cylon named Beelzebub.

I miss hearing the metallic voice saying "yes imperious leader" and "by your command".....

^5 on the Alien Nation reference. I actually started an Alien Nation appreciation thread (which gets some action occasionally) in the general scifi fantasy section over a year ago when they released the one season it ran on DVD. The short run television series was ground breaking and done quite well, it was much better than theatrical movie. I dug up a bunch of information about the series and discovered that the ratings for the one season it ran were very good (top 10), but the production costs to film the series were more than studio executives wanted to foot, so they pulled the plug.

<<<< Huge Alien Nation fan, and Fifth Race was right - the television series was much better than the movie. If I remember right after that first season was cancelled in 1989, they produced a handful of 2 hour made for TV Alien Nation movies that followed the same characters from the original television series. Alien Nation touched on subjects that no other show or network did back then. Plus the whole concept of a dying Alien race finding shelter on Earth to literally save themselves from extinction is pretty darn cool besides being a great idea.

I found the thread earlier today I didn't like the alien nation movie (like the stargate movie didn't thrill me), but I really enjoyed that show and was peeved when it was cancelled. when I think of how much they paid the cast of friends but they cancelled alien nation... GRRRRRRRRRRRRR But it seems the higher quality the show the quicker it gets cancelled (I loved Commander in chief from two years ago, an excellent show)

As a kid I got my scifi fix by watching one of my very favorites - Lost in Space, I had a huge crush on daughter Judy. Plus it always fun seeing Dr, Zachary Smith wiggle his way out of the Robinsons dog house every episode. Other great puesdo scifi/fanatsy shows I watched as a kid or teenager were The Six Million Dollar Man, Kolchak: The Night Stalker, Buck Rogers, Night Gallery, Incredible Hulk, The Flintstones (when it aired in primtime), The Munsters and The Adams Family were all big around my house. I was also into those Saturday morning television shows like Land of the Lost, Korg 70,000 B.C.. Then there was the Banana Splits Adventure Hour with shows such as The Three Musketeers, Arabian Knights, Micro Ventures, Adventures Of Gulliver, The New Adventures of Huckleberry Finn and Danger Island (famous for the cry of "Oh oh Chongo", and because Richard Donner - director of Lethal Weapon - got his start on it!). Ah yes the days of youth, I got my kids to watch some of those old school shows I enjoyed as a kid, some stuck, some they ignored.

Ok that list takes me back. I am assuming , defiant, that you are in the 40's range... I too had my daughter watch as many of the old shows I loved as I could. She was into some, not into others. She recently ran accross a buck rogers episode on tv and was teasing her dad because he used to love it. I remember the original night stalker. I do NOT like the remake, too much a horror show. the original night stalker had those moments when you thought there was a reasonable explanation and then! the nice creepy feeling . Not outright scary! (NOT a horror fan at all... life can be a horror show so I like escapism).
Nice to see that so many like-minded individuals ended up on this thread!

[Trek_Girl42]

Ok that list takes me back. I am assuming , defiant, that you are in the 40's range... I too had my daughter watch as many of the old shows I loved as I could. She was into some, not into others. She recently ran accross a buck rogers episode on tv and was teasing her dad because he used to love it. I remember the original night stalker. I do NOT like the remake, too much a horror show. the original night stalker had those moments when you thought there was a reasonable explanation and then! the nice creepy feeling . Not outright scary! (NOT a horror fan at all... life can be a horror show so I like escapism).
Nice to see that so many like-minded individuals ended up on this thread!

Heh, I didn't think the new Nightstalker was too bad, my Mum and I both liked it (she wanted to watch it because she saw the original), and neither of us like horror. Though I have to admit there was nothing particularly original in that show.


The thing about that TOS BSG set that I find laughable, is how difficult it must be to store- there's a giant cylon head sticking out off the front, and isn't it a lot taller than a normal DVD set? I think it might even be too tall for my DVD shelf.

[Starbase]

Heh, I didn't think the new Nightstalker was too bad, my Mum and I both liked it (she wanted to watch it because she saw the original), and neither of us like horror. Though I have to admit there was nothing particularly original in that show.

Ok that list takes me back. I am assuming , defiant, that you are in the 40's range... I too had my daughter watch as many of the old shows I loved as I could. She was into some, not into others. She recently ran accross a buck rogers episode on tv and was teasing her dad because he used to love it. I remember the original night stalker. I do NOT like the remake, too much a horror show. the original night stalker had those moments when you thought there was a reasonable explanation and then! the nice creepy feeling . Not outright scary! (NOT a horror fan at all... life can be a horror show so I like escapism).
Nice to see that so many like-minded individuals ended up on this thread!

I tried to watch the new NightStalker but I couldn't get into it at all. I was a fan of the original, I don't remember much about it but I do remember being scared and loving all the mysteries that Kolchak tried to solve each week. I do remember one episode in particular where Kolchak went into an underground city that was hidden to find these zombie like people that live down there.

I do enjoy a good horror movie (although I am somewhat of a scaredy cat), as long as they aren't gory just to be gory. I can remember my uncle sneaking my little brother and I into a drive-in theater to see The Exorcist, I think I had nightmares for about 6 months after viewing it. Other freaky films I saw as a youngster that left a lasting memory were The Omen, Carrie, Night of the Living Dead, The Omega Man and Soylent Green. As far as more modern horror/fantasy type movies that left an impression, I would have to list the original Nightmare on Elm St., the orginal Alien and Silence of the Lambs. I would have to put more thought into expanding that list.

[USS Defiant]

DS9 season 2 episode discussion
Epsiode #4: Invasive Procedures

A severe plasma storm leads DS9 to be temporarily but completely evacuated, save the senior officers (of course) who remain on board. After the evacuation, an unjoined Trill named Verad and his small band of mercenaries gain access to the abandoned station and hold the officers hostage. Verad has come to steal the Dax symbiont from Jadzia, which he believes is rightly his, and damn the consequences that Jadzia will die within hours of the operation.

"Invasive Procedures" is an engaging character story with some surprising depth, though it also has some flaws. The premise that sets the episode in motion, the convenient abandoning of DS9, is rather contrived. And the idea that Quark bypasses station security and unwittingly allows these mercenaries to board the station purports to have dire consequences, but ultimately comes off awfully transparent. But the core of this episode is very strong, featuring some excellent characterizations. John Glover's portrayal of an inept, confidence-lacking Verad is brilliant. Equally brilliant is his change of personality once he steals the symbiont and joins with it, becoming an interesting blend of Verad and Dax. Sisko's response to the joining is utterly fascinating to watch, as he attempts to reason with the friend he knows resides inside the new Verad. Sisko also slowly wears down Verad's girlfriend Mareel (Megan Gallagher), who watches in dismay as the man she knows transforms into a personality who subtly reveals he doesn't "need" her anymore. The subplotting involving Bashir, Quark, and the Klingon mercenaries (Steve Rankin and Voyager's Tim Russ) proves amusing. But the psychological twists and turns involving Sisko, Mareel, and the tragic Verad keeps this show in top form.

[kmiller1610]

Just wanted to check in and say Hi. I recently purchased seasons 2 and 3 (which I'm fairly sure I have never seen) and am halfway through season 2.

I was quite surprised that even this early in the series, the show is building many of the elements that make 6 and 7 so great. The dominion is starting to get referred to. Odo's struggle with his "father" and his longing for family, the Bashir / O'Brien relationship, the foundation of Kai Winn's treachery are all in the formation stages. Season 2 also starts with a 3 episode arc.

I know this is common knowledge to most of you, but I had not realised the show was so early in pursuing arcs.

Does anyone know of how the DS9 writing staff decided to conceptualize the show and how broad the planning was for the arcs or how they got started thinking in that direction?

[kmiller1610]

DS9 season 2 episode discussion
Epsiode #4: Invasive Procedures

John Glover's portrayal of an inept, confidence-lacking Verad is brilliant. Equally brilliant is his change of personality once he steals the symbiont and joins with it, becoming an interesting blend of Verad and Dax.

I first saw John Glover as a special actor on "Search for Tomorrow" an old soap opera my wife and I used to watch when we were just getting started. He played this sensitive, crazy, nutjob who kidnaps the main soap opera matriarch and holds her in captivity for like a week and a half. The guy was so good for the setting that it really became a must see. Usually, I would nod off or pretend I was interested...The guy has quite a resume.


http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001278/

"Search for Tomorrow" TV Series ...Billy Vargas (unknown episodes, 1983-1984)

[the Fifth Race]

Just wanted to check in and say Hi. I recently purchased seasons 2 and 3 (which I'm fairly sure I have never seen) and am halfway through season 2.

I was quite surprised that even this early in the series, the show is building many of the elements that make 6 and 7 so great. The dominion is starting to get referred to. Odo's struggle with his "father" and his longing for family, the Bashir / O'Brien relationship, the foundation of Kai Winn's treachery are all in the formation stages. Season 2 also starts with a 3 episode arc.

I know this is common knowledge to most of you, but I had not realised the show was so early in pursuing arcs.

Does anyone know of how the DS9 writing staff decided to conceptualize the show and how broad the planning was for the arcs or how they got started thinking in that direction?

First of all, it's always great to see you on the superior thread brother kmiller, I was thinking about where the heck you went, anyway welcome back my friend. As always you come with great insight and questions. I will try and answer this from what I have read coupled with my own personal feeling .....

It is widely known by fans that DS9 was full of stand alone episodes and storylines that weren't leading anywhere in the first 2 seasons. In a sense it was using the same formula that TOS and TNG used - Star Trek The Next Generation had an extremely successful formula for almost every single episode of the 7 year run of the show. The Enterprise would encounter some galactic calamity, become personally involved, go near the brink of destruction (or someone near the point of death), find some amazing solution to the problem, and all gets better and ends up as if it all never happened. TNG was specifically tailored for syndication because Paramount had the "1990s foresight" to see that the money made from The Original Series would be pennies compared to the profits that TNG could generate from syndication sales (they were right by the way). What they didn't anticipate back then was that a technology would be developed (DVD) where it would be possible for mainstream buyers to purchase an entire season of a show, and that the money generated would rival that of syndication.

TNG was developed for no main over-lining storyline or story arc in order to help sell the show for syndication. Don't give me the "search for new civilizations" stuff as the main storyline for TNG - we're talking about an ongoing story that we visit on a regular basis. There were hints at such attempts through the cast's personal development, such as Worf's discoveries about dishonor and Klingon politics that were given their due attention once or twice a season. But an over-arching storyline encompassing their entire mission or existence? Never happened.

Deep Space Nine, behind Steven Ira Behr, was supposed to be developed for syndication. The Star Trek brain trust however, quickly realized that unlike the Enterprise, the space station wasn't going to zoom away to the next adventure, leaving whatever changes it made in the universe behind in the warp drive rear-view mirror. The people there would be affected, and things would change. On-going stories from episode to episode and an on-going main storyline weren't just an idea, it became the logical conclusion for action on the show. - The main storyline of Deep Space Nine was something that every Star Trek fan, at least it seemed, wanted and begged for.

All this (on going storylines) started to happen half way through season 2 where they began to lay the seeds for a 5 1/2 season storyline that would pit the vicious and mysterious "Dominion" against the Federation, Kingons, Romulans, and Cardassians ... with alliances in the war changing from episode to episode. The massive search for artifacts and power behind "The Prophets" in an intergalactic race for domination, control, and freedom was the central theme of DS9. A four year war ensued, with lives lost, conspiracies exposed, spies caught, all while the crew of the most important space station in the galaxy managed to hold things down.

Now - don't think that I feel that EVERY DS9 episode was tailored for the purpose of the on-going story arc. It was plainly obvious that a power play between the writers, the producers, and the higher-ups at Paramount was underway for the direction of Star Trek Deep Space Nine. Would the show be developed for syndication (like TNG), or would the show be one on-going story where episodes connect from one to the next? The power plays took away from the direction of the show, and jerked audiences everywhere. In the end, the proponents of the on-going story won, and in amazing fashion, and 8 part series finale was developed (despite heavy criticism from many in the high positions in charge of the entire Star Trek franchise).

I have also read interviews with famed DS9 writer Ronald D Moore (who joined DS9 at the start of season 3, right when the long stoyline arcs began). He was delighted that DS9 was using long arcs, one of his biggest complaints while working on TNG was the lack of arcs to give the show a lasting direction.

Sorry for such a long answer, but it isn't a simple one to answer. All in all IMHO it was a combination great and stubborn writers who wanted to do something different in the Trek franchise. They got it right!, by creating such a beautiful and brilliantly made show that wasn't afraid to be different and have long storyline arcs, they in turn gave us a unique series that is as enduring today as it ever was. As usual kmiller you made me think, and it is such a great question it deserved a well thought out answer.

[Starbase]

I first saw John Glover as a special actor on "Search for Tomorrow" an old soap opera my wife and I used to watch when we were just getting started. He played this sensitive, crazy, nutjob who kidnaps the main soap opera matriarch and holds her in captivity for like a week and a half. The guy was so good for the setting that it really became a must see. Usually, I would nod off or pretend I was interested...The guy has quite a resume.


http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001278/

"Search for Tomorrow" TV Series ...Billy Vargas (unknown episodes, 1983-1984)

I count myself as a big John Glover fan as well. I know him from Smallville, Numb3rs and I also remember him where he played the devil on the rather obscure show called Brimstone.

I haven't watched it in years, but I aslo used to follow a soap opera with my wife. She got me hooked to Day's Of Our Lives when I was home from work on disibility.

Good to see you back on the superior thread Kmiller.

[Trek_Girl42]

I count myself as a big John Glover fan as well. I know him from Smallville, Numb3rs and I also remember him where he played the devil on the rather obscure show called Brimstone.

I haven't watched it in years, but I aslo used to follow a soap opera with my wife. She got me hooked to Day's Of Our Lives when I was home from work on disibility.

Good to see you back on the superior thread Kmiller.

Ahhh- I loved his episode of Numb3rs, and he's sadly one of very few redeeming factors on Smallville in my opinion. I remember that I was very plesently surprised to see him on DS9.

[Rac80]

I tried to watch the new NightStalker but I couldn't get into it at all. I was a fan of the original, I don't remember much about it but I do remember being scared and loving all the mysteries that Kolchak tried to solve each week. I do remember one episode in particular where Kolchak went into an underground city that was hidden to find these zombie like people that live down there.

I do enjoy a good horror movie (although I am somewhat of a scaredy cat), as long as they aren't gory just to be gory. I can remember my uncle sneaking my little brother and I into a drive-in theater to see The Exorcist, I think I had nightmares for about 6 months after viewing it. Other freaky films I saw as a youngster that left a lasting memory were The Omen, Carrie, Night of the Living Dead, The Omega Man and Soylent Green. As far as more modern horror/fantasy type movies that left an impression, I would have to list the original Nightmare on Elm St., the orginal Alien and Silence of the Lambs. I would have to put more thought into expanding that list.

I loved soylent green (I love anything heston did) and the omega man. My worst run-in with a horror movie was when the remake of "invasion of the body snatchers" was made in 1978. My best friend and I went to it. Now you have to understand I was raised in rural maine....lots of drives through the woods on long winding roads. WELL, after seeing the movie we drove home at 11 ish at night and around every turn I swear I saw Donald Sutherland or brooke adams...if you have seen the movie you get my drift! Then there was night I read "salem's lot" by stephen king (of course, being from Maine, what else would I have read) and there was this honeysuckle tree by my window! then there was the summer i was a camp counselor and we (the counselors) went to see "friday the 13th" at a drive in! I got an overactive imagination! I prefer now to watch tame horrors like the planet of the apes movies these days. I do not like gore at all.

[Rac80]

I first saw John Glover as a special actor on "Search for Tomorrow" an old soap opera my wife and I used to watch when we were just getting started. He played this sensitive, crazy, nutjob who kidnaps the main soap opera matriarch and holds her in captivity for like a week and a half. The guy was so good for the setting that it really became a must see. Usually, I would nod off or pretend I was interested...The guy has quite a resume.


http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001278/

"Search for Tomorrow" TV Series ...Billy Vargas (unknown episodes, 1983-1984)

I count myself as a big John Glover fan as well. I know him from Smallville, Numb3rs and I also remember him where he played the devil on the rather obscure show called Brimstone.

I haven't watched it in years, but I aslo used to follow a soap opera with my wife. She got me hooked to Day's Of Our Lives when I was home from work on disibility.

Good to see you back on the superior thread Kmiller.

Ahhh- I loved his episode of Numb3rs, and he's sadly one of very few redeeming factors on Smallville in my opinion. I remember that I was very plesently surprised to see him on DS9.

I too remember John Glover from a number of shows and he often portrayed a crazy man. He played a "straight" (non-crazy) role in a movie called White Nights (1985) and I most recently saw him portraying another nutcase on law and Order :CI.
I loved this role from DS9, he is a very good actor. The differences that being joined meant to his character was astounding. He was entirely believable. This episode enabled us to see that having a trill would fundamentally change the character of the person. I enjoyed seeing more of Dax's backstory.


It is nice to know that my husband wasn't the only man to get hooked on a soap. I got him hooked on the edge of night and one life to live many many years ago. (he got mono as an undergrad....working too hard) Since then we have both gotten off the soaps. (no time!)

[Starbase]

I loved soylent green (I love anything heston did) and the omega man. My worst run-in with a horror movie was when the remake of "invasion of the body snatchers" was made in 1978. My best friend and I went to it. Now you have to understand I was raised in rural maine....lots of drives through the woods on long winding roads. WELL, after seeing the movie we drove home at 11 ish at night and around every turn I swear I saw Donald Sutherland or brooke adams...if you have seen the movie you get my drift! Then there was night I read "salem's lot" by stephen king (of course, being from Maine, what else would I have read) and there was this honeysuckle tree by my window! then there was the summer i was a camp counselor and we (the counselors) went to see "friday the 13th" at a drive in! I got an overactive imagination! I prefer now to watch tame horrors like the planet of the apes movies these days. I do not like gore at all.

If I remember right the 1970's remake (and IMO better than the original) starred Leonard Nimoy, Donald Sutherland, a youngish Jeff Goldblum and was set in my home town San Francisco. That movie (the original and the 70's version) almost made my list, I was thinking about it. Sutherland made some creepy B-type horror flicks in the 1970's.

Great call on Salems Lot's Lady Rac, that scene where the little brother saw his older brother floating outside his bed room window, all zombied out, still creeps me out to this day.

Another truly great and ultra creepy 80's flick that stands out in mind is The Shining. I can remeber covering my eyes through some of the scenes in the theater. I saw that movie with my dad, I believe I was a junior in High School. We went and saw it the night it premiered, we came out of the theater and there was a huge line of people waiting for the next showing. A lot the people that came out of the theater with us were shaken up and had this look of fright and shock, which in turn creeped out the poeple waiting in line to go see it.

A few others off the top of head that come to mind - American Werewolf in London, the 80's version of The Thing with Kurt Russell, Amityville Horror, The Fog, Dawn of the Dead, and Brian De Palma's Dressed to Kill now that is one scary azz film!.