Baelor (109)

[The Mighty 6 platoon]

Also, I have another question. Previous episodes gave me the impression that after rough start Dany warmed up to Drogo, considerably, and they came to like each other. In Drogo's case, maybe even something more. But in this episode she all of a sudden acted like she was deeply in love with him and that left me a little confused. Were they in love in the book?

She was in love in the books.Also keep in mind that as well as that, if Khal Drogo dies she's dead, anyone else wanting to be Khal will kill her and her child to prevent any rivals. And even if she runs, she's back to square one, no army, on her own apart from Jorah, and at I think at this point, she doesn't know Robert is dead, so she still thinks she will hunted by assassins. Combine the fact that she loves him, and she's thinks she's dead if he dies, and yes, it's quite believable how desperate she was for him to live.

Hmm..Honestly, I don't mind lack of battles. Show's gore-ish enough as it is and as long as the battles aren't important in terms of what happens to the characters (being killed or injured) I can live without them.

Several of the battles in later books are important to the plot, so they have little chocice but to depict them.

Wait, what? 5 kings? As in Joffrey and 4 other pretendents/rebels?

Yup. There are already 3 claimants, Joffery, Renly and Stannis. One more will be revealed next week (in fact it was spoiled in the preview for ep 10, grrrr) and then the final "King" will be revealed in season 2.

[magictrick]

Also, I have another question. Previous episodes gave me the impression that after rough start Dany warmed up to Drogo, considerably, and they came to like each other. In Drogo's case, maybe even something more. But in this episode she all of a sudden acted like she was deeply in love with him and that left me a little confused. Were they in love in the book?

Yes. In the book there's more time to explore this and make it clear, although I thought they did a pretty good job in the show as well.

Wait, what? 5 kings? As in Joffrey and 4 other pretendents/rebels?

Ned's death will have huge repercussions. So without spoiling anything, yes, multiple people vying for the throne. And just to clarify, Joffrey himself is technically a rebel, as he is not the rightful heir.

But as one of the characters mentioned in a previous episode (either Littlefinger or Varys) its not who the rightful heir is but who has the largest army and most backing that has claim to the throne.

Yup. There are already 3 claimants, Joffery, Renly and Stannis. One more will be revealed next week (in fact it was spoiled in the preview for ep 10, grrrr) and then the final "King" will be revealed in season 2.

But you already know who it is from reading the books

[Petra]

Yes. In the book there's more time to explore this and make it clear, although I thought they did a pretty good job in the show as well.

She was in love in the books.Also keep in mind that as well as that, if Khal Drogo dies she's dead, anyone else wanting to be Khal will kill her and her child to prevent any rivals. And even if she runs, she's back to square one, no army, on her own apart from Jorah, and at I think at this point, she doesn't know Robert is dead, so she still thinks she will hunted by assassins. Combine the fact that she loves him, and she's thinks she's dead if he dies, and yes, it's quite believable how desperate she was for him to live.

Ah, thanks. For the record, I wasn't criticising, I just thought I missed something and wanted to make sure.

And I think the show did a good job explaining what would happen to Dany if Drogo was to die, but still, she acted like a woman very much in love and not "merely" like a woman trying to survive, if that makes sense.

Several of the battles in later books are important to the plot, so they have little chocice but to depict them.

Fair enough.

Yup. There are already 3 claimants, Joffery, Renly and Stannis. One more will be revealed next week (in fact it was spoiled in the preview for ep 10, grrrr) and then the final "King" will be revealed in season 2.

Err..it was?

*goes to YT to rewatch the preview*

[chrono trigger]

WOW i knew it would happen as i spoiled myself but still it was such a sad moment overall it might be my fav episode of the season so far. also it has to be said these kid actors are fantastic i hope they win an award for all their hard work.

[gotthammer]

Walder Frey is the mumbling farmer w/ an arsenal in 'Hot Fuzz', right?

Great episode...but it just feels 'rushed'. I guess it's the lack of showing actual battles.
That and I guess I wish they'd shown more of the Sept of Baelor.

I thought they represented the Stark host rather well (zoomed out shot of the Twins w/ movement indicating Stark forces crossing in the background, w/ a small number of horsemen moving toward the foreground), but a battle would've been nice.

Stuff I liked:
- Tyrion, Bronn and Shae (huh. Never imagined her anywhere near that...then again, I guess I did get 'lazy' back then and relied on the art for the card game for how to visualize some of the characters. Oh, and Shae's pretty )
- Tyrion in armour (I didn't see that mallet coming )
- the Twins and the Freys (I still hate them, tho' )
- Jorah's fight (hehehe, I guess Dothraki aren't so used to fighting folk in plate )
- seeing Ice again -> did they ever call the sword by name?
- Arya
- the execution scene (I like it, but, at the same time, it feels a bit lacking...I can't place my finger on why/how, exactly. My brain is, I think, still fixated on wanting to see more of the Sept of Baelor )

[Lahela]

Wow! That was a complete mind****! I knew it was coming, but it was just so bloody brilliantly executed (pardon the pun). The music, the visuals, Ned looking around at the sea of faces, Sansa and Cersei trying to stop that nutter Joff, Ser Ilyn putting on the hood, Yoren clutching Arya, and the pigeons. Such beautiful imagery, making the whole thing even more powerful than I could imagine. Nothing "shock value" whatsoever in the deaths in this series (TV or books). Just mortality. Pure, human mortality.

I was very disappointed that the battle where they capture Jaime was glossed over (as TM6P said, they could have just had a few shots of people swinging swords in the woods). And that's not just my pathetic Jaime fangirling talking - it did seem like they skipped over something really damned important for the sake of... well, a drinking game, I suppose.

Dany and Drogo and Jorah - that was so well played. Emilia is amazing. Just freaking amazing.

Maester Aemon, how I love thee! In a grandfatherly way. So very, very, very cool.

And I'm liking Varys more and more.

[Shylodog]

- the execution scene (I like it, but, at the same time, it feels a bit lacking...I can't place my finger on why/how, exactly. My brain is, I think, still fixated on wanting to see more of the Sept of Baelor )

It did feel 'smallish'. In the book, there was no way Ned could see Arya due to the throngs of people - even when she was standing on the statue. Chalk it up to a tight budget, I suppose. If they could have CGI'ed a couple thousand more folks there, I think it wouldn't have felt as lacking. Also, I don't recall seeing the Grand Septon (High Septon? I forget what he's called) anywhere. Seemed like Grand Maester Pycelle was doing all of the talking at the confession. Was he filling a dual role to keep things less confusing?

[The Mighty 6 platoon]

One thing I find amusing is how many people are surprised Ned died, when he's played by Sean Bean. The actor best known for dying in almost all his roles except Sharpe. Alright yes good writing and him being a major character made it shocking and unexpected for non book readers, but still. I remember when I told some of my friends about the show, and they said "ohh it will be nice to see Sean Bean in a role where he doesn't die." I burst out laughing and nearly spoiled it for them then.

It did feel 'smallish'.

It did? it felt big to me, there were hundreds in the crowd. Probably part of the money that would have gone into any battle scene when into this scene instead, HBO realising it would be much more talked about than a battle scene, similar to countless other ones we've seen in shows and movies. In my case I wish we could have had both battles and crowd scenes, and they should have got clever with the attack on Jaime's camp, shown part of it still, but one of the most important things was Ned's execution, it is the pivotal moment, both in the book and the series, and imo, I think they nailed it.

[Petra]

THE scene certainly didn't feel smallish to me.

One thing I find amusing is how many people are surprised Ned died, when he's played by Sean Bean. The actor best known for dying in almost all his roles except Sharpe. Alright yes good writing and him being a major character made it shocking and unexpected for non book readers, but still. I remember when I told some of my friends about the show, and they said "ohh it will be nice to see Sean Bean in a role where he doesn't die." I burst out laughing and nearly spoiled it for them then.

LOL. Frankly, I know Sean Bean mainly from LOTR and GoldenEye, so I had no idea he usually dies.

But I must say I'm very surprised by the fans' outcry. I kinda thought that people who watched GoT - because let's be honest, it's not a series for everybody - would be more...accepting of the changes. Not to mention folks who have read the book - they shouldn't have been surprised at all, IMO. And yet I've read today a disturbing amount of posts containing attacks on HBO for daring to kill off Ned, calling TPTB names, throwing tantrums, making threats, swearing to never again watch even 1 more episode etc. Honestly, I'm bewildered. Even some folks who claim to have read the book say things like: "they should have let Ned live, tv is a different medium than a book" etc. Granted, all those comments were on general entertainment sites and not on any fan ones, but still...it's like mass-hysteria.

EDIT. Btw M6P, you were right re the preview for the next ep

[The Mighty 6 platoon]

But I must say I'm very surprised by the fans' outcry. I kinda thought that people who watched GoT - because let's be honest, it's not a series for everybody - would be more...accepting of the changes. Not to mention folks who have read the book - they shouldn't have been surprised at all, IMO. And yet I've read today a disturbing amount of posts containing attacks on HBO for daring to kill off Ned, calling TPTB names, throwing tantrums, making threats, swearing to never again watch even 1 more episode etc. Honestly, I'm bewildered. Even some folks who claim to have read the book say things like: "they should have let Ned live, tv is a different medium than a book" etc. Granted, all those comments were on general entertainment sites and not on any fan ones, but still...it's like mass-hysteria.

While I've seen some comments complaining, on the whole I've seen far more positive ones. In fact in general this episode has garnered far more discussion across the net than any previous episode, quite hard when it was already pretty much the most talked about tv show on the air at the moment. I think it will lead to a ratings rise and more people watching the show, everyone's talking about. Yes some people will throw a hissy fit, buy most will be desperate to see what happens next. And on this board at least the reaction has been nothing but positive, and the only negative reactions I've seen to characters being killed or injured is some grumblings from some Jason Momoa fangirls over the direction his characters story has gone.

EDIT. Btw M6P, you were right re the preview for the next ep

I'm always right.

[dragongirl]

I am a proud Jason fangirl (it isn't hard to tell if you have seen my sigs ) but I would never grumble over GoT. It isn't like some shows that kill willy-nilly I knew when Jason got the part what was in store for his character.

I agree I have seen some people make some comments about the deaths but I think since most people know it is taken from a book series and if they have not read the books they know people who have. A lot of shows kill people off on a whim so fans complain bring back so and so, why would they do this, sign petitions to get this character back (I can think of a couple shows that actually worked) but with this it isn't hard to find out who dies and since they are being so true to the books, even taking conversations right from the books, it seems to, to me anyway, that most people are accepting of the deaths because who can you complain to? Martin is not going to re-write his books and HBO will not totally change what happens in the story just to appease a small handful of people that are not happy with a characters death.

[magictrick]

I would be curious to see these posts, as I really haven't seen any complaints. Especially for fans who have read the books, who would complain when everyone knows what's coming from the start of the series?

[dragongirl]

The only minor complaint I had was in the Drogo/Dany wedding night because in the books He didn't rape her like he did in the series but even then given the time and everything that they needed to get through I was understanding in how it was done.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Petra,

Wow. Just wow.

Okay, so I was spoilt (stupid Wiki ) and knew Ned wasn't going to make it but I was sure it would happen in the last episode of the season. So I had my surprise despite spoilers

If you've read the series the title of the episode is a dead giveaway. There's only one scene in the "Great Sept of Baelor" in AGOT.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Petra,

But I must say I'm very surprised by the fans' outcry. I kinda thought that people who watched GoT - because let's be honest, it's not a series for everybody - would be more...accepting of the changes. Not to mention folks who have read the book - they shouldn't have been surprised at all, IMO. And yet I've read today a disturbing amount of posts containing attacks on HBO for daring to kill off Ned, calling TPTB names, throwing tantrums, making threats, swearing to never again watch even 1 more episode etc. Honestly, I'm bewildered. Even some folks who claim to have read the book say things like: "they should have let Ned live, tv is a different medium than a book" etc. Granted, all those comments were on general entertainment sites and not on any fan ones, but still...it's like mass-hysteria.

Could you please link, I'd love to read some of the fall out.

Spoiler:

you ain't seen nothing yet