Prepare for Starburst: A Farscape Rewatch Thread

[jelgate]

Revenging Angel

I guess it's my turn.....I'll have to now sound very repetitive....jel put me in a cage and feed me crackers please!

But I'm gonna take the devil's advocate here and take the opposite stance. I don't like this ep. Yep I said it. *holds up protective shield* Jel you keep that TNT away from me!!
Don't get me wrong I love cartoons as much as the next guy. And I too like jel grew up watching these cartoons. (I honestly think jel is more my age and just pretending to be younger )

I honestly found the cartooning to be quite distracting and also out of place, almost to the point of being absurd. I mean just last ep I was bawling my eyes out over the loss of Talyn John and here we have some Roger Rabbit crazy going on? I just feel it minimalizes the build up of what we just went through with the loss of John and I'm dying to see how this will effect the Moyan crew. (Nope I'm not paying )

I get that the writers probably felt they needed to really lighten the mood, but I think it's because of eps like this coupled with 'John Quixote' that causes them not to get a real 5th season. I honestly think they went off the rails just a little too much here. Again, I respect the creativity, I respect the humor and the fact that they really did take a risk on this one. But for me, it just didn't do it for me.

So enough of the complaining. What I did like about it was the Jool scene. I thought that was such a genuine scene with her and D'Argo. spoiled for future eps

Spoiler:

I actually could've seen them possibly becoming a couple if Jool's character had been around longer. I don't exactly remember why she didn't stay. Does anyone know why Tammy had to leave the show? I sort of remember she got another gig, but I can't be certain. I guess I could google it but meh...I'm a tad busy right now. Maybe the companion book will have something to say about it later.

Ok so the other bit I quite liked was all the Chiana scenes. I have missed her. Seems we've been Chiana light as of late and I loved seeing her and John close and talking, working things out. I also loved her one off comment to D'Argo, "Why'd you give up on me" ....or something to that nature. I enjoyed the ship too. Thought it was something new for D'Argo to mess with. But I'm with jel on this one that he was like a 2 year old when he just threw his blade down. That was so stupid and actually jel thinks this ep's theme should be hilarious, I think it should be childish. That is what everyone was acting like a bunch of selfish, broodish brats. Everything from the girls arguing, to John and D fighting, to Head Scorpy and John bickering, to Jool...the list goes on. But I did enjoy (as a nice juxtaposition) the little talk Crichton had with Pilot about what should he do about the revenge or not revenge and how should he handle D'Argo. Loved it when Pilot got all therapist on John and told him (something I tell my students everyday) you don't play along they will eventually tire out. Great advice Pilot!

All in all I think it was, in my book anyway, a B episode....funny, quaint and creative, but just a bit daft!

You miss the point. You can't have everything be drama. Besides moya doesn't know about the other John. Cartoons doesn't seem that much different to the various Harvey scenes we see

[squirrely1]

You miss the point. You can't have everything be drama. Besides moya doesn't know about the other John. Cartoons doesn't seem that much different to the various Harvey scenes we see

Calm down sweet jelgate! I'm allowed to have a differing opinion. It's ok.... I just have a different feeling about it than you do....which is what usually happens. Now where are my crackers??!!

[jelgate]

Your opinion doesn't prevent debate

[Bluemeany]

I decided to go ahead and scan in these few pages from the Script to Screen section. Enjoy... Spoiled for size

Spoiler:

Thanks for uploading these SQ. The bit about Crichton's originaal 'reason to live' is interesting. I wonder what that was? If it's not Aeryn... then there aren't many other options really. I suppose Earth or Dad/getting home to family. But the characters moved on a bit from that.

[squirrely1]

Your opinion doesn't prevent debate

I know this but you seemed to be taking offense.

Thanks for uploading these SQ. The bit about Crichton's originaal 'reason to live' is interesting. I wonder what that was? If it's not Aeryn... then there aren't many other options really. I suppose Earth or Dad/getting home to family. But the characters moved on a bit from that.

You're welcome. I'll be honest I didn't read it yet. ask jel I don't read.

[jelgate]

I'm not

[squirrely1]

You're not what? Taking offense? Or going to substantiate my non reading. I don't mean take offense so much as sounding upset that I don't share the same opinion. I have said I see your side and I don't hate the ep just I don't think it's one of their stronger eps and to me it seems too ludicrous for this stage in the story, especially since we just lost John...it's a bit jarring. For me that is. Granted to Blue's point, I get that it is in John's mind and it is similar to Won't Get Fooled Again, but it still seems rather (to me anyway) almost disrespectful to have such a crazy cartoonish ep just after the death of John. But then again that is what makes Farscape so great because they do take those risks and tread into waters that very few series have gone. I like that they are always willing to go the fresh route and do something totally unpredictable and for that I think the ep was successful.

[jelgate]

This is not hard to understand SQ. I don't take offense to your dislike. That would be idiotic. I think we know why you say you only have 3 brain cells

[squirrely1]

Hey! You don't have to rub it in.

[jelgate]

The Choice

I know what you are thinking SQ. Its time for us to fight about the moody and the suicidal Aeryn. Well you wait for later. For this episode I actually think its understandable. The whole point of this episode is that Aeryn is grieving. Which I can understand. Even if their are two Johns, Talyn John is still a person. I think we even see the other characters grieve. Even Rygel. Speaking of Rygel, one of my favorite moments of him occurs in this episode. Even if Aeryn told him to frell off I really love saying how much he knows how she feels. Their are two main reasons why Aeryn struggles the most with John's death. For one of all the people on Talyn she loved John the most. That is not to say that people like Stark didn't care about John but they didn't care for him like Aeryn did. Their are some who loved ( note the difference between romantic and friendship love) John just as much on Moya but that is a whole another debate. Second Aeryn is a emotional child. Her Peacekeeper training makes them all very deficient in expressing emotions. Her lack of understanding compassion in the pilot proves that. So really this episode is Aeryn for the first time really exploring the loss of a loved one. Although I wonder why she didn't have this problem when Zhaan died. Again discussion for another time. We have all unfortunately experienced the complete loss of a loved one I believe. If you haven't I think you are truly luckily to be blessed. Aeryn is going through the typical stages of grief here I think. It explains why she was at a planet that had a supernatural element. After all denial is the first stage. I could go on but rambling is more of SQ's thing. I for one find the return of Xhalax and fake Talyn unnecessary. Everyone including Aeryn knew he was a fake so it seems unnecessary for Xhalax to make this giant plot of convincing Aeryn John could be rescued. That is the whole reason Aeryn was on the planet. We don't need the confrontation between Aeryn and Xhalax since we had that in a previous episode. I think it would have been better about Aeryn exploring the loss of John by herself then the return of her mom. I always was interested in Stark leaving to find Zhaan and was disappointed in S4.

[Bluemeany]

The Choice

I love this one. Getting an entire 45 minutes for an emotional character pause occasionally happens if a series is good. But focusing that episode-pause on a strong, female character; you don’t get that a lot.

I remember watching this as a teenager and it really had an effect on me. As a 13 year old, I already wanted to be Aeryn, but in this episode she just seems so real, so relatable.

That’s not to say I had or have any circumstances comparable to my lover dying and being stuck on an alien world with ghosts and a whole ‘previously-dead mother killing father Greek tragedy’ thing going on.

I think it was purely that here was a female, strong character experiencing, processing and not resolving lots of multifaceted emotions. I’d not really seen that before. She doesn't deal with it immediately, or even by the end of the episode. It takes her a long time.

Similarly, at various points in the last eighty years, men in my family have gone off to fight in wars. The women get left behind, and carry on. It’s a different, quiet and more reliable heroism but it’s equally as important. I love the line of “Was it easy to be a hero?” And I’m totally with Aeryn's feelings on this: Crichton knew what he was doing.

From an editing pov, it’s both a beautiful and unusual looking episode. It’s got this whole kind of early 80’s-punk, decaying vibe going on. All these oranges, purples and greens. Claudia Black looks otherworldly (and it just generally awesome). And the inter-cuts/call backs to Aeryn’s memories are great.

Speaking of which, I love that the Ghost!Crichton is dressed in outfits from Human Reaction. I can’t decide why that is: maybe it’s because Earth is where he belongs, so that’s where Aeryn thinks he’s gone? Maybe it’s because that’s where, for Aeryn, their relationship began?

Or maybe it’s because Human Reaction is the point where Aeryn really started to change? To go back to what you were saying Jel, about why Aeryn reacts to loosing Zhaan and John so differently. I agree it’s not just because she’s closer to Crichton.

I think it’s because she’s not just grieving John: it’s not just one of the Crichtons that dies. A part of Aeryn dies too. The part of her that started to evolve by tasting the rain in Human Reaction. The part of her that suggested to Talyn-John that they could live on Earth in Icarus Abides. That’s gone now, and I don’t think it ever entirely comes back. Not in the same way.

We’ve talked before about how the twinning arc (none with standing the double screen time for Ben Browder) is really about Aeryn. At the end she gets to choose between two lovers: living John and dead John, the reality and the memory.

Actually in the same way Crichton realises the difference between idealised life with Aeryn and what the reality of life together will be in Dog with Two Bones.

My favourite couple of shots (in maybe actually the whole series) is at the end when Ghost!Crichton in the orange light of the window saying ‘Come here’. Aeryn saying ‘No’ gets me every time.

Oh and I love the speech Aeryn gives Stark about ‘you’re so much worse (than Crais) because you think you’re so much better’. Teenage-me really understood that: first time I’d ever heard someone (in real life or on TV) vocalise what I suppose we’d now call ‘nice guy’ syndrome.

[squirrely1]

The Choice
Ok my turn to ramble.... I do love this ep as well and it is so real and all about Aeryn grieving as you've both already mentioned. I think the reason Aeryn is grieving more over Talyn John is (Blue pretty much nailed it) Aeryn had allowed herself to become totally open and vulnerable to John and she completely put her old life away in order to love him fully and trully and then when he died a part of her (that part) died with him. I have to agree with jel that it wasn't necessary to bring up the Xhalax story line..that tended to muddy it all up. I had totally forgot about that...that Crais had not actually killed Xhalax, so this again makes you not ever believe in any of these deaths because here they come back again a few eps later, so I think it was sort of a cheap shot and not really necessary. I can see that many times though when we lose a spouse or mate we do tend to turn to family for comfort, I think they drew Aeryn's parents into it because of that possibly ...to try to catch Aeryn at a really vulnerable moment, but I wasn't really sure it worked that well. I enjoyed Aeryn's encounter with Crais and Stark and her pretty much putting them in their place and keeping them at bay.

To Blue's question about why John was in the Human Reaction white t-shirt again I think they just wanted to use that "innocent" Crichton...the one where they first kissed and had that intimacy on Earth and they superimposed that kissing scene which I loved that they did that as if to portray perfectly mirrored bookends to symbolize their beginning and ending of their romance. But also notice that in Human Reaction it was John who was leaning over and kissing Aeryn, where as in this ep it was Aeryn leaning over and kissing John. That also symbolizes just how far Aeryn had come...she came around full circle to where she no longer thwarted his advances but actually accepted them and then went further to reciprocate them. They also showed those flash backs of Aeryn's memories with Old Man Crichton. I thought those were all so poignant.

I too loved the Rygel scenes and him trying to speak with her and "talk her off the ledge" so to speak. I thought that was very "human" of Rygel.

All in all I give this an A. I think Claudia did a fantastic job in how she played it and you just ached right along with her.

[squirrely1]

The Choice - From the Companion Book

"I told David Kemper that I really wanted something to sink my teeth into," Claudia Black says. "I was being greedy because I've had a great season, but I said I'd love an episode that was really Aeryn-driven." Black's request fitted with Kemper's plans. "As soon as Justin knew that we were going to kill Crichton, he said that Aeryn would be ready to commit suicide," he explains. "He wanted to write an episode that dealt with the fact that her boyfriend had died."

Black worked with Monjo and director Rowan Woods to create an episode that Black admits "ran the risk of alienating the audience." "Claudia and I love to work together," Woods says, "and to push her to those places is exciting and heart-wrenching at the same time. I was very jazzed about "The Choice": The design represented an enormous challenge, because it obviously referenced Blade Runner to a certain extent, but it also represented a more gothic tradition of film-making."

Kemper describes Black's performance as a "tour-de-force", and Woods feels that this is a result of the daring choices the actress made. "It's quite astonishing, because she could have made a lot of conventional, tear-jerking choices, but she didn't," he says. "She played everything the opposite way to what you'd expect, and that was due to her very serious and rigorous homework in the weeks preceding the shoot. Claudia will really explore the opposite way to play things if she thinks its the real, plausible, logical way to go. She'll turn the rules of drama on their head."

Woods points out that 'The Choice' is not simply about Aeryn mourning her dead lover. "It's more a really interesting profile of somebody in denial and coming out of it," He says. "When Aeryn turns her back on ghost Crichton, she's resolving that story."

'The Choice' also gave a great deal of work to the puppetry team, as Rygel came to the fore. "Rowan went to a lot of trouble to do the scenes in the marketplace down in the foyer of the hotel," Tim Mieville recalls. "It was full-on for us in terms of getting Mat McCoy and his team moving through all those other characters -- Rygel's just the tip of an iceberg of two or three people being wheeled underneath!"'

"I love it when Rygel is a character of integrity, and not just doing his Dr. Smith thing," Woods says, referring to the manipulative schemer from Lost in Space. "He has some beautiful mements, especially when he's trying to convince Aeryn to get off the ledge."

The Creature Shop also created the Seer. "Mario Halouvas did a lovely job with that," praises Sean Masterson. "I think the Seer is incredibly 'human', while being utterly alien at the same time," Andrew Prowse adds. "Where you come unstuck is where you've got outrageous big pieces of plastic, with clunky mouths and lifeless eyes that can only really communicate cliches. The genius of what Dave Elsey does is to create aliens that you can register subtleties with -- and subtleties are what Farscape is all about." "Maybe the Seer knows something that we don't know," David Kemper hints. "I don't discount that. Between the Seer and Stark, you never quite know what's out there."

Linda Cropper enjoyed her final appearance on the series to date. "I liked the Greek tragedy element to it," she notes. "It had to be a fairly remarkable conclusion for Aeryn and her mother, and it had to be a very cathartic scene -- which it certainly turned out to be!"

'The Choice' was Paul Goddard's final episode of the year as well, as the actor went to appear in a play at Sydney Opera House. "He gave a magnificent performance here," Says Kemper. "He wasn't going to be in the rest of the season, so we came up with the idea of the mask at the end. The whole episode closes things off, and sets us up for the next story. Remember, there's always darkness before the dawn..."

[jelgate]

Fractures

I'll ask the obvious question? Why in the frell does D'Argo think John looks better in black? When did he get fashion sense? Joking aside, this kind of feels like a S1 episode where their is a problem on Moya. And its just a mystery of how frelled up we are. Some people would think this is a bad thing but I think its important to have a stand alone episode so the these two separate crews can reintergrate together. Lets be honest. Not about SQ's weight. That's a discussion for another day. A sabotouer or traitor on Moya is hardly a original. It seems like everyone is always out to get us. This is classic Farscape of making an episode and then using that story to focus on the characters. Their is the elephant in the room. I told you no SQ, the elephant is not about you. We will discuss your health problems later. Although I know this where we are going to fight. This is where Aeryn really ticks me off. I get really annoyed how she treats the other John as a stranger because she is hurting because Talyn John died. I can understand her being conflicted with emotions. I will even agree that it is in character for Aeryn to be cold and distant when it comes to conflicted. However, just because it is in character does not justify it. Its not right for you to be a jerk to a person because you are hurting. Part of living in this world is world is being empathic of how Moya John feels and not being a jerk when he has done nothing wrong. Yes I know that may be in character for her but doesn't excuse Aeryn's actions. What I like about this episode is how the Moyans (I'm never getting paid)pairs up with these guest characters. I think it leads to different dynamics. I liked seeing the curiousity of Chiana with meeting an androgynous person of her race. I liked the little tidbits of telling us that most Nebari born like this are killed. As I have said before its a shame they had to abandon that story for the almighty ship What I liked is that we saw a Scarran that wasn't our enemy. A good thing Farscape has always done is show not all races are good and evil. Aeryn and Crais at this point prove that point. Even if this is the only good Scarran we see its nice. I kind of thought Jool and Crais together was strange. I found the concept of an alien starfish (for lack of a better word) intriguing. I can see this being Jool's area of expertise as we have established she is gifted in medicine and science. Not really sure how Crais contributes but I did think it was funny seeing the two banter. Speaking of funny, like John I don't not need the vivid imagery that Rygel was projecting on him and the female Hynerian. My biggest compliant for this episode is that it was obvious she was the traitor. It seems a common trait they are all greedy and selfish. At least we got to see Lo'Lal in actions. The ending scene is clearly a setup for the season finale. Its kind of out there we have to stop Scorpy so he doesn't take over the galaxy because of the danger wormholes represent. As Chiana said, its suicidal but it reinforces the family bond that Moya sticks together even though the insanity of going after Scorpious. That is all I have about this episode. I promise we will address your eating habits tomorrow SQ

[Bluemeany]

Fractures

Most important thing first: Crichton's t-shirt. I actually agree with D’Argo’s sartorial taste, jel. He definitely looks better in black than green.

Which is a good thing because starting from this episode until… well, the rest of the series actually… he’s pretty much constantly in mourning/ moping/ bad ass black due to unresolved issues with Aeryn. Yes, innocent white-T shirt or orange jumpsuit John are now long gone.

As mentioned when we were discussing The Choice, I like that Aeryn is still angry, grieving and (arguably) unreasonable. And I think it’s particularly awesome that she continues to be for a very long time.

She’s not there to be nice or reasonable. She’s not there to be pleasant. She’s not there to be Crichton’s girlfriend. She’s a fully rounded character and, because she takes time, is totally believable. Claudia Black spends most of the episode emphatically not looking at Crichton.

The boolite (I’ve picked a way of spelling that and am going with it) as the alien starfish is a pretty gross and cool idea. I suppose we could say it’s a metaphor for the crew or Aeryn or the relationship… in that it’s messily putting things back together that have been blown apart or separated. However, that might be reading too deeply into things.

I too found Jool and Crais together funny if a little odd. I wonder if it was Stark who originally was meant to be ‘helping’. That would have made more sense with his medical/assisting the dead training. SQ’s guide from last week said that Paul Goddard had checked out for a bit to do a play. And that scream, whilst hysterical, was definitely not a normal Crais mannerism.

Still Stark does show up to doing a Princess Leia routine, so that’s something.
‘
The end scene, with the rock, paper, scissors game between the two Crichtons is the one that made me really made me realise that Talyn-John was a distinct character in his own right.

In my memory, for the final ‘throw’ one Crichton picks scissors and the other picks rock…thus showing that they are now different, due to their experiences – one on Moya without Aeryn, one with Talyn with her. That’s what I thought I saw.

However, having re-watched… I think they do in fact both throw scissors ! It’s hard to tell because the outline is blurry. Ah well, I liked my original way.

We end with a great scene: Moya Crichton gets a chance do something heroic like his counterpart. Yet again, he chooses to do it despite the fact that he knows he’ll probably die. Aeryn was right: Talyn Crichton did know what he was doing.

And I love the blocking of the Human/Sebacian vs the rest of the aliens divide. Does start to highlight the shared history between the two which really starts to come out in season four.

From an editing pov, it’s actually quite a still and dark episode. Still the action sequence at the end with the jump through space on to the other ship is nice.

Speaking of which, just before that jump when Aeryn says ‘it worked in the Budong’, I like the fact that Crichton now doesn’t get all references to previous episodes. He’s always been a sort of audience proxy. If you haven’t tuned in religiously every week for the past three years, that’s cool… like Crichton you’ve missed something but the action can still carry on without anyone having to explain.