The Wedding of River Song (3213)

[Alan]

The white & black Guardians would.

Indeed. The Trickster and the Trickster's Brigade would too I think.

[Nth Chevron]

If the Silence knew nothing of these fixed points, then why did they go through ALL the effort, i mean from Season 5 toknow, setting the stage for River Song?

Admittedly, Rivers reverse timeline interference can be attributed to her existence itself.

But it still begs the question, why did the Silence raise the army it did to kill the Doctor, using an abducted human infused with Artron energy, stick her in a space suit that *may* have been able to move on its own and send her to kill the Doctor?

As for the "who knows" question about fixed points, as we've never heard of others as a point in time where if something doesnt happen then Time collapses, are these 'fixed points' or seemingly fixed events, another repercussion of the Time-War?

We know that Time was in a debilitated state after the destruction of Gallifrey, this could be another new symptom, knowing the Moff though i doubt he would want to resort to RTD canon.

N.C

[Carter1994]

Indeed. The Trickster and the Trickster's Brigade would too I think.

Not to mention the Tesalecta. They mentioned fixed points rather frequently.

[morbosfist]

Dorium is quite clear that the Silence were deliberately engineering a fixed point, and Lake Silencio was a perfect place to do that.

[Quizziard]

But it still begs the question, why did the Silence raise the army it did to kill the Doctor, using an abducted human infused with Artron energy, stick her in a space suit that *may* have been able to move on its own and send her to kill the Doctor?

To kill the Doctor! They'd tried blowing up the TARDIS, which failed, so they were for a more direct approach. They did so in the cruelest way possible: stealing the child of his companions, training her from infancy for the task, then taking her at the right time for the job that they wanted doing. Isn't the death of a Time Lord inevitably a fixed-point in time?

[Cold Fuzz]

To kill the Doctor! They'd tried blowing up the TARDIS, which failed, so they were for a more direct approach. They did so in the cruelest way possible: stealing the child of his companions, training her from infancy for the task, then taking her at the right time for the job that they wanted doing. Isn't the death of a Time Lord inevitably a fixed-point in time?

It depends I suppose if regeneration is a fixed point in time. If Dorium's warnings about the fields of Trenzalore are correct, then I can't help but wonder if that's a fixed point in time too. It could be that the Silence will face their ultimate defeat there and in order to thwart a fixed point in time, they wanted to create another with the Doctor's apparent death at Lake Silencio?

[Quizziard]

Doesn't it depend if "the fall of the Eleventh" means "the death of the Eleventh".

[Flyboy]

Doesn't it depend if "the fall of the Eleventh" means "the death of the Eleventh".

Could mean tripping over a brick...

[P-90_177]

It depends I suppose if regeneration is a fixed point in time. If Dorium's warnings about the fields of Trenzalore are correct, then I can't help but wonder if that's a fixed point in time too. It could be that the Silence will face their ultimate defeat there and in order to thwart a fixed point in time, they wanted to create another with the Doctor's apparent death at Lake Silencio?

I'm starting to reckon that a fixws point in time is merely one that contains a paradox.

[Cold Fuzz]

I'm starting to reckon that a fixws point in time is merely one that contains a paradox.

Definitely possible. However, I'm not quite sure what the temporal paradox would be in a fixed point like Pompeii.

Could mean tripping over a brick...

... which causes the Eleventh to fall, thus causing his death and bringing about the regeneration process to give us the Twelfth Doctor.

[Alan]

Doesn't it depend if "the fall of the Eleventh" means "the death of the Eleventh".

Maybe "the fall of the Eleventh" means the Doctor's eleventh incarnation falling from grace rather than dying. In A Good Man Goes to War they said the Doctor has never risen higher...what goes up must come down. Possibly a BIG mistake the Doctor is going to make will have people turn on him and that in turn results in the creation of the Silence and their war with him?

[4thDoctor]

With Moffet it could mean the fall of the 11th planet or the 11th season for all that we know.

[Cold Fuzz]

Maybe "the fall of the Eleventh" means the Doctor's eleventh incarnation falling from grace rather than dying. In A Good Man Goes to War they said the Doctor has never risen higher...what goes up must come down. Possibly a BIG mistake the Doctor is going to make will have people turn on him and that in turn results in the creation of the Silence and their war with him?

I think that part about how the Doctor will "rise higher than ever before and then fall so much farther" refers to the events in "A Good Man Goes to War" and not necessarily what's coming later. Now that the known universe will believe he's dead, he will definitely fall back into the shadows. Unless of course...

Spoiler:

... if what I've heard about the Christmas special is true. If it is indeed a DW take on the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe story, people will think that Doctor is like Aslan, going through a miraculous resurrection. The Silence would then hate him even more so since such a resurrection would make the Doctor almost like a religious icon. Again, it depends on what happens with the Christmas special.

[mi_guard]

I've stayed away from this thread because so far I had not been able to watch the episode and now I can't go through 7 pages of posting (not bad by the way ).

I need some help. I was watching the episode which I had DVRed before and was near the end when Amy and River are staying in the garden of Amy's house and River says: "I am his wife" and Amy replies "and I am his mother-in-law" and then Bang! my DVR recording stopped nothing more. I can't imagine that that really was the end of the episode. Can anyone tell me if something more happened or was said afterwards? Would really appreciate a feedback. Thank you very much in advance.

[Alan]

I've stayed away from this thread because so far I had not been able to watch the episode and now I can't go through 7 pages of posting (not bad by the way ).

I need some help. I was watching the episode which I had DVRed before and was near the end when Amy and River are staying in the garden of Amy's house and River says: "I am his wife" and Amy replies "and I am his mother-in-law" and then Bang! my DVR recording stopped nothing more. I can't imagine that that really was the end of the episode. Can anyone tell me if something more happened or was said afterwards? Would really appreciate a feedback. Thank you very much in advance.

From The TARDIS Index File entry for The Wedding of River Song:

Spoiler:

A monk carries Dorium's head back to the Seventh Transept. Dorium realises it is the Doctor and demands to know how he escaped. The Doctor tells him: River actually shot the Teselecta, with the Doctor safe inside, waving happily at her. Now that the entire universe believes him dead, it's time for him to step back into the shadows.

As the Doctor leaves, Dorium shouts at him that Fields of Trenzalore and the first question still await him. As the Doctor pauses by the TARDIS, Dorium shouts: "Doctor who? Doctor who? Doctor who?"