A Good Man Goes To War (3207)

[Replicator Todd]

This episode was so amazing I cannot possibly begin to express my thoughts. My eyes were wide and happy the entire time. I could not stop smiling!

[Kamosis]

Wow! Just wow! That was amazing!

Until the last moment I'm was thinking: River is the doctor mom? The cousin? The daughter? His lawyer?

Just one thought: What separates humans from Time Lords are that Artron energy, right? So what if the time lords are in fact humans that landed in this weird planet full of weird energy and ended mutated by it?

[Admiral Mappalazarou]

Wow! Just wow! That was amazing!

Until the last moment I'm was thinking: River is the doctor mom? The cousin? The daughter? His lawyer?

Just one thought: What separates humans from Time Lords are that Artron energy, right? So what if the time lords are in fact humans that landed in this weird planet full of weird energy and ended mutated by it?

It's good speculation but I doubt it's anything they'll cover in the series. I'm happy that the place of the Time Lords is in legend and myths now. Gives the universe so much history.

[Nth Chevron]

Thats the one thing ive always disliked about Doctor Who, they've always skated over evolution.

Apart from a few stories here and there, theres been almost no change to humans from Roman times upto 100 trillion years, now with constantly changing environmental factors, not counting technology and time energy, there could have bee room for some improvement, but nothing

Now we find over billions of years Time-Lords became their namesake.

N.C

[DigiFluid]

Thats the one thing ive always disliked about Doctor Who, they've always skated over evolution.

Apart from a few stories here and there, theres been almost no change to humans from Roman times upto 100 trillion years,

False. We saw primitive cavemen humans in An Unearthly Child, modern humans (obviously), machinery-enhanced trans-humans in the episodes set in 200000 and 200100, learned from Cassandra that there were few to no Humans left who hadn't mingled with alien races around the year 5 billion, and in Utopia the Doctor stated that had evolved into gases and energy a few times but always returned to the same basic form.


Unrelated....for anyone wondering what Madame Vastra (the Silurian) looks like under those scales...

Spoiler:

Giggity

[Alan]

False. We saw primitive cavemen humans in An Unearthly Child, modern humans (obviously), machinery-enhanced trans-humans in the episodes set in 200000 and 200100, learned from Cassandra that there were few to no Humans left who hadn't mingled with alien races around the year 5 billion, and in Utopia the Doctor stated that had evolved into gases and energy a few times but always returned to the same basic form.


Unrelated....for anyone wondering what Madame Vastra (the Silurian) looks like under those scales...

Spoiler:

Giggity

Gorgeous.

One of the many thoughts that came to mind whilst I watched A Good Man Goes to War was that I think I'd like to see a spin-off show featuring Vastra and Jenny investigating odd goings on in Victorian London. Obviously it would have to be set sometime prior to 1879 otherwise you'd just be asking yourself "well where's the Torchwood Institute whilst all this is going on?". I think it'd be quite interesting.

[Nth Chevron]

Utopia the Doctor stated that had evolved into gases and energy a few times but always returned to the same basic form.

have to admit, i never actually heard him say that in the ep, but then again my hearing isnt that great anymore.

As for the others i probably didnt remember them.

What i was getting at mroe though, was that we hear of what Time-Lords are compared to humans etc etc a few times a season, weve never seen or heard of anything human becoming a super force for good, which is almost the silently accepted norm that "humans will become their manifest destiny"

In Stargate we were, in Star Trek we were, in Star wars it was 50/50, BSg was kept at OUR current level of evolution (socially) etc etc

I just thought with the Doctor raising us up above his shoulders every-time theres something to be remarked upon about us, they might have shown WHY the Doctor has such faith in us.

N.C

[DigiFluid]

What i was getting at mroe though, was that we hear of what Time-Lords are compared to humans etc etc a few times a season, weve never seen or heard of anything human becoming a super force for good, which is almost the silently accepted norm that "humans will become their manifest destiny"

We do know that on at least four occasions, Earth expands into "great and bountiful" empires. Presumably, with a descriptor like that, we become a force for good.

[Sealurk]

We do know that on at least four occasions, Earth expands into "great and bountiful" empires. Presumably, with a descriptor like that, we become a force for good.

Personally, with a name like Great and Bountiful Human Empire, I always thought it was somewhat contradictory, in much the way that most nation's calling themselves the People's this or the Democratic that generally...aren't.

[P-90_177]

have to admit, i never actually heard him say that in the ep, but then again my hearing isnt that great anymore.

As for the others i probably didnt remember them.

What i was getting at mroe though, was that we hear of what Time-Lords are compared to humans etc etc a few times a season, weve never seen or heard of anything human becoming a super force for good, which is almost the silently accepted norm that "humans will become their manifest destiny"

In Stargate we were, in Star Trek we were, in Star wars it was 50/50, BSg was kept at OUR current level of evolution (socially) etc etc

I just thought with the Doctor raising us up above his shoulders every-time theres something to be remarked upon about us, they might have shown WHY the Doctor has such faith in us.

N.C

The Doctor essentially sees us as complex creatures. He recognises that we can do great acts of evil and hatred and berates us for it but at the same time we can have such love and affection at the same time. I tink he sees this as a unique trait in the galaxy. He sees our courage and our determination in adversity and admires it, just as he admires how we can show kindness to even our worst enemies.
The Doctor, when it comes to humans is ultimately a bit of an optimist which is why he gets so angry when he feels let down by us. In the end though what fascinates him is humanity's massive complexity. When you consider all other races he's met they can seem so 2dimensional, whereas humans never cease to surprise him one way or another.
I think in more recent years he has grown more bitter towards them, partially because of the timewar and also the number of times humanity has let him down. But yet he still holds a belif that humanity has great potential just because of that vast quantity of curiosity and determination that we as a race hold.

[Archaeis]

But that whole idea of "humanity's potential" kind of loses its meaning when he knows (in general) their entire history from beginning to end.

[DigiFluid]

But that whole idea of "humanity's potential" kind of loses its meaning when he knows (in general) their entire history from beginning to end.

That's the reasoning that the Master used to bend Lucy to his will

[P-90_177]

But that whole idea of "humanity's potential" kind of loses its meaning when he knows (in general) their entire history from beginning to end.

It s true tat he knows both their ups and their downs, and he knows how they began and he knows how they ended. But there are still plenty of times in between he hasn't seen. And on top of all that, while he doesn't have as much faith in the human race as a whole any more after all his time, he still sees the good in groups and individuals, such as the Utopians.

[rosey_angel]

Slightly OT, are they both keeping secrets from one another. The Doctor knows that River is doing to die and River knows the Doctor is going to die but they are keeping that secrets?

yep, that's the way it seems =) awesome is it not?

It's funny that the eye patch lady (or whoever is behind trying to kill the Doctor) thinks that they can succeed. I mean even an alliance of the doctor's enemies could not defeat him!

i know! he always has a way out even when it looks like everything going to 5hit. heck, he survived the end of the universe and even had one of his companions rewrite the universe to their memories!

Wow! Just wow! That was amazing!

Until the last moment I'm was thinking: River is the doctor mom? The cousin? The daughter? His lawyer?

lol that last bit would explain why she knows his name, it's on all of the subpoenas.

speaking of something that annoyed me in the ep, did it annoy any one else when River referred to Rory and Amy as the Doctors best friends? I'm sure that in the second part of End of Time the Doctor refers to Donna as his best mate.
Maybe it's just me, but I loved their friendship so much, and they seemed much closer than the Doctor does to Amy or Rory.

[Spimman]

speaking of something that annoyed me in the ep, did it annoy any one else when River referred to Rory and Amy as the Doctors best friends? I'm sure that in the second part of End of Time the Doctor refers to Donna as his best mate.
Maybe it's just me, but I loved their friendship so much, and they seemed much closer than the Doctor does to Amy or Rory.

*Uses River Song Voice*

"Spoilers"

It doesn't hurt that she knows more about the Doctor's (and Amy & Rory's) future than they do.