Smith and Jones (2901/301)

[ShadowMaat]

By "old series" we mean anything from the 1963-1989 era of Dr. Who.

I figured. But you can never be too sure. "Old" is a very relative term. After all, I just came from a thread that decided that any shows that aired more than ten years ago were "too old" to be discussed.

Anyway, now I'm curious. IS the new incarnation of Who really that much dumber than the old stuff?

EDIT: But I'll start a separate thread for that.

[BruTak]

IS the new incarnation of Who really that much dumber than the old stuff?

Hmmm... Good question...

Well, the first books I remember reading when I was a sprog were the old Target Books novelisations of old Dr. Who stories - this would be mid 1970s we're talking here, pre-video.
That being the case, the books were the only way I could "catch up" on the stories that I'd missed, had been before my time, or simply did not exist in the BBC archives any more (which is another story for another day).

Many years later, I'd find myself rather disappointed in the naffness of the writing, acting and FX in some of the stories I watched on video, and had read the novelisations of when I was a kid - the pictures in one's head were always so much better.

And yes - IMO the new Dr. Who has had it's share of dumb moments. There's all these damnned "celebrity" cameos for a start - and don't get me started on that ruddy Absobaloff!

[ShadowMaat]

I started a thread for the whole "dumber" thing, but as for the cameos thing, I think that's one way that being from across the pond comes in handy. I tend not to recognize the celebrities. Who was the plasmavore?

[Gregorius]

Nice episode, although the whole hospital on the moon thing was a bit over the top for me.

Anyway, I'll be looking forward to the next episodes of S29.

[Matt G]

Bru, I thought the John Simm as Master rumour was dead and buried. Simm denied he was up for the part a couple of months back!

[Madeleine]

I just watched it again with the sproggies. They said it was the scariest yet, they hid at the bits with the straw. I did think that was good, in a sinister way.

LOL at 'Planet Zovirax'.

[Naonak]

Bru, I thought the John Simm as Master rumour was dead and buried. Simm denied he was up for the part a couple of months back!

Well, he confirmed a couple of weeks ago in a radio interview that he's playing Mr Saxon, so we'll have to wait and see about the Master...

[Commander Ivanova]

[URL="http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=42640"].. as for the cameos thing, I think that's one way that being from across the pond comes in handy. I tend not to recognize the celebrities. Who was the plasmavore?

I spend a lot of time in the UK (only some of it watching TV!) but I can't say I recognised her. No doubt someone else will fill us in.

I have to say I do like Dr Who in general, it's zany, exuberant (sp?), tongue in cheek, sometimes spilling over into silliness, but also with some darker moments. Nothing else is quite like it. Can't speak for the previous incarnations though, before my time

[Dusk]

Meh, bit limp for a season opener/companion intro.

OK so here's what annoys me about the show now:

I'm REALLY getting sick of ALL big events taking place in London, London, London. And London. And don't forget London! LONDON!!!!! It's not hard to pull of a few cheap tricks and appear to be anywhere besides London in the world, ala Alias. It's detracting from the show!

[Dusk]

Meh, bit limp for a season opener/companion intro.

OK so here's what annoys me about the show now:

I'm REALLY getting sick of ALL big events taking place in London, London, London. And London. And don't forget London! LONDON!!!!! It's not hard to pull of a few cheap tricks and appear to be anywhere besides London in the world, ala Alias. It's detracting from the show! And showing up the producers as pompous, arrogant Brits who shan't dare send the Tardis beyond the grasp of the Hempire!

Secondly, when in London, it's always set in the here and now. This makes two companions in a row that are a) from London, b) from the early 21st century, and c) young, attractive females. This formula is wearing thin. Why not pull a girl from the future, or from the 80s? Indeed, why not pull a guy? Do they have to be young? Do they have to be from London? Earth?

The trouble is that they are trying to make the Doctor's companion his love interest as well, and it shows like duct tape on a torn up Van Gough.

Having Martha's family in the mix makes the show seem like EastEnders on LSD, but EE all the same. Camp, trashy, domestic namby pamby. With Rose it was tolerable, but redressing the family unit and passing it off again with the second companion... unforgivable.

Too much of this episode resonated with the episode Rose, it almost felt like a hack and slash affair cobbled together on a train on the way to work. With coffee stains here and there, and crumpled, worn edges. A companion's intro should be more unpredictable and surprising. Now it almost seems like the Doctor goes shopping for a new companion and brings her aboard like a 40-something brings his young girlfriend home on the back of a motorcycle.

[SIGH] I never meant for this to become a ramble, but it has. I'll finish by saying that the aliens were cool, plasmavore with straw included. But really, that's it. A disappointing start to the season, I think we all expect better.

Times I mentioned London: 11.
Times I want to mention London in future post of this series: 0

[BruTak]

OK so here's what annoys me about the show now:

I'm REALLY getting sick of ALL big events taking place in London, London, London. And London. And don't forget London! LONDON!!!!! It's not hard to pull of a few cheap tricks and appear to be anywhere besides London in the world, ala Alias. It's detracting from the show!

Amen to that, oh my brother!

But have you considered if the Daleks or Cybermen were to invade - say, Glasgow - the local street urchins would have them stripped down for spare parts in no time flat. The Doctor would have nothing to do.

[ShadowMaat]

Well, on the whole London/Earth issue, I can definitely agree. I think that's one way in which the old series clearly trumps the new: their effects may have been cheesy, but at least they visited some by-gods alien planets! So what if they all looked like the same gravel? All the planets in Stargate look like Vancouver, but it still manages to work (more or less).

I wish RTD wasn't so hellbent on Earth-centric stories. It puts a serious crimp in things, IMO.

[Alipeeps]

I loved this new ep. Gotta say David Tennant has officially eclipsed Tom Baker (yes, they do say your fave is usually the one you watched as a child) as my favourite Dr. As someone put it on another thread, he brings just the right level of eccentricity to the role.

I enjoyed the plot in this episode, loved the J'Doun, the H20 scoop, the plasmavore. I liked Martha and think she looks like shaping up to be a good companion. Different enough from Rose and to not feel like a simple replacement sidekick. There were so many little touches in this ep that I loved... the cheeky wink at Martha when she's checking his heartbeat, the Dr running around barefoot, the scarily messy hair when he gets frustrated with the hospital computer (I can't help chortling when I rewatch that bit!), the lamenting over the loss of his sonic screwdriver, the self-sacrifice to save the day... just so much to enjoy...

The fact that EVERYONE was panicking over the whole oxygen thing seemed a little overdone. I mean, Martha can't be the ONLY one with enough common sense to realize that if they aren't all dead already then there must be something protecting them. I'm also disappointed that no one mentioned the fact that Earth normal gravity was brought along as well.

I also couldn't help but wonder how come the hospital was still fully powered given that it was hardly connected to the national grid anymore?!

One thing I thought was good is how they explained why she looked the different character she played during the Cybermen invasion, without having to go into great detail about it. I think "i had a cousin who worked at Canary Wharf" worked out better than some fancy explanation I had expected them to come up with.

I liked that.. the fact that they just popped in a throwaway comment there to acknowledge that...

The "it's bigger on the inside" thing has been done with everyone who ever goes inside, and it has to be done, but it was a nice touch having the Doctor mouth Martha's words, just to make it a bit different.

Did you watch Dr Who Confidential afterwards on BBC3? They mentioned on there that that touch was actually David Tennant's idea... he asked if the director if he could do that for one take and they loved it and kept it in...

Amen to that, oh my brother!

But have you considered if the Daleks or Cybermen were to invade - say, Glasgow - the local street urchins would have them stripped down for spare parts in no time flat. The Doctor would have nothing to do.

BWAH! Oh you made me chortle there... Gotta admit that is one thing that bugs a little... London is NOT the be all and end all of the UK, folks! Aside from that, it's always not just London but right slap bang in the centre alongside all the famous landmarks... it's a heck of a coincidence that the hospital that was scooped up happened to be right across the Thames from the Houses of Parliament!! Obviously the show is sold and broadcast internationally but still, it comes across as a tad patronising to keep battering us around the head with "Lookit! Big famous landmarks! It's LONDON everybody!!" Or maybe RTD is just trying a wee bit too hard to trade on the whole Cool Britannia idea...

[Missster.Freeman]

Meh, bit limp for a season opener/companion intro.

OK so here's what annoys me about the show now:

I'm REALLY getting sick of ALL big events taking place in London, London, London. And London. And don't forget London! LONDON!!!!! It's not hard to pull of a few cheap tricks and appear to be anywhere besides London in the world, ala Alias. It's detracting from the show!

haha! Dusk. Are you Scottish matey? At last, a few folk saying what I've been thinking for the last two years. I know I've been getting a bit fed up of London lately. ("Chippy" Scot here. ) It's not just London I'm tired of, however. I'd really like to see the Doctor leave Earth and go visit some aliens for a change. Ah well, maybe next time. Oh wait. Mind you, the next episode will be set at a time when London was the hippest location on the planet.

I wonder when we'll see a male companion or more than one, for that matter.

LOL Bru, they would have a traffic cone stuck on top and a dosser sleeping inside their empty carcasses.

[BruTak]

.LOL Bru, they would have a traffic cone stuck on top and a dosser sleeping inside their empty carcasses.

Oh, good God in Govan yes!

I have this bizarre notion that if "The Epmty Child" and "The Doctor Dances" had been set in Glasgow at the height of the Blitz, the gasmask kid would've been enquiring - in that strange gruff voice that all Glaswegian children seem to have "Ur you ma mammy?"