Daybreak, Part 3 (421)

[Corona]

So was Cavil the leader who started the first and then armageddon wars?

Did he issue the .exe?

[Ranlier]

it was said though that the dying leader would have a wasteing disease............what was his?

His brain was falling apart, getting worse and worse.

[kharn the betrayer]

I'm sure you can fill in the rest

it was made before daybreak i thought of tory

r00fles

[Ian-S]

So was Cavil the leader who started the first and then armageddon wars?

Did he issue the .exe?

yes and no...

The Final 5 came from Earth to warn mankind but the war had already started, so they did a deal with the original centurions gave them resurrection in return for leaving humanity alone and created Cavil & other humanoid models (first war - pre-miniseries), he then got jealous of the attention other models were getting after he helped create them, so he killed Daniel (#7) and then killed the Final 5, resurrecting them and inserting false memories and placing them on the Colonies to witness (& hopefully die) in the attack (the mini series) and dumbed down the centurions.

He then spent 4 years chasing them down (his words in CIC scene) and manipulating events so that when they eventually died and were resurrect, they'd admit they were wrong and humanity didn't deserve to survive.

But they didn't so in a childish final show of mutiny, he stuck a gun in his mouth.

[P-90_177]

His brain was falling apart, getting worse and worse.

becoming a hybrid fixed that though. hybrid doesn't exactly think like we do but he was still stable.

[KhaosNite13]

Baltar's faith actually reaches Cavil (i kept waiting for someone to shoot him), setting up the true end to the war.

I was waiting for the Marine behind him to shoot Cavil. Yes everyone else would have seen it, but not Mr. High and Mighty Cavil!

[Night Marshal]

I started watching BSG after the first season I think the show has suffered from lack of plan on the part of the writers, however I felt that finally seems true to itself. Not giving up more than it had to but at the same time not really about the action either. All and all as a person who hasn't has much love for Galatica for the last few seasons I felt the show went out on a high note. And the random Ron Moore cameo at the end made me smile.

Was the pacing slow yeah, Were the flash backs really needed. I think they were a bit heavy handed for my taste but I can see why they were put in. The tie into the opera house was way to literal and felt kinda cheap.
But putting those aside I still liked it. I'm glad the show its over lets put up a big stone slab for it and remember the good times. And not lie to ourselves if it had kept going I don't think they would have done better than this. In fact I think the show was suffering in quality enough by the end. All things have there time this was Galaticas'. You left me with a smile and that is more than I expected.

~NM

[apollo123]

I was out of town, so *finally* got home to watch it. Still collecting my thoughts, but .... WOW... just simply WOW. "Earth" as our Earth, Hera is Mitochondrial Eve, finally the secret of the Opera House, Roslin's death, Starbuck explained (sorta), "God" explained (sorta), ridiculously crazy battle scene... they crammed a lot into it and it all worked. I really loved that they pretty much explained everything that needed to explain and left certain things vague, things that they couldn't possibly explain, mostly notable the idea of "God" - someone/something manipulating and controlling all of these events. What exactly is "God"? Except that "it" doesn't like to be called that. A super computer? The laws of the universe? The biblical version? A little bit of everything? I'm not a religious person, but I found their take on it absolutely perfect and satisfying - there was a mystical/religious element to it, but a possible scientific explanation as well. It was perfect. Everything I thought was perfect. I couldn't have asked for anything more and I'm so sad it's over. So say we all! *sniff*

[CincyLady]

What a great episode, great ending to the series, and RDM was correct, most of the things were wrapped up.

Although there is one thing I still not sure, just what was Starbuck.
An Angel of God (or gods) or ghost or what?

I agree, all in all, I think it was a wonderful ending to the series. As someone who watched the orginal BSG, when I heard the theme song from the original series, as Anders took the fleet into the sun, it really pulled at my heart.

As for Starbuck, and the 'head' Gods, I think that it was in reference to the 'angel's of light' from the original series, and perhaps Starbuck's father was one of those beings. In the original series, in the failed 1980 one I should say, there was a child that was supposedly a child of light where the Father was Starbuck, that led the fleet to Earth. Perhaps the same could be said for Starbuck as well.

One other though here, is that during the series, it was revealed that Starbuck's Mother was a prisoner of war, and that Starbuck was conceived during that period.

Could she of been much like Hara, a Cylon/Human child as well?

She's the only part that I wish they would of tied up the loose ends on, but all in all it was a good ending overall.

[CincyLady]

also Kara being the Angel of Death and leading into humanity....well it kind of was a death with the slate being made clean again and humanity becoming half human half cylons

Wasn't also said though, that Kara would lead Humanity to it's end? Didn't she in effect, do just that and lead that to the end of their journey?

It was also the end of that type of Humanity as well, since when they blended with the natives, what came forth was an ending of the race as they knew it, and the beginning of a new one.

[langdonboom]

Wow, that was bad. After 5 years, I find out that BSG never was a science fiction story -- it was Ron Moore's religious creation mythology. The Book of Moore.

This was horribly lame. Not worthy of being called sci-fi, or even syfy.

Wouldn't any sane creation myth or theory be by definition science-fiction?

And I don't agree that it has to be religious, its just that up until now science and religion have competed for explanation territory, when really, as this show brilliant made clear, they are just two sides of the same coin, describing the same thing in different language.

Its time to move beyond this dichotomy and see where both areas have merit and fault.

[langdonboom]

You sure? It was a part of the Abrahamic God's plan that the Caananite's be wiped off the map in order for a (presumably) good thing to occur -- the Hebrews living in their promised land. And is it not true that Jesus had to be beaten until he was no longer recognizable and crucified in order for him to take the sins of the people onto himself, becoming the ultimate sacrifice, and offer salvation to the sinners? What I was taught (and it may be different from what you were taught) is that God does indeed have a plan and that this plan may include things we commonly consider to be bad -- the aforementioned conquering of the Caananites, the testing of Abraham's faith through the near sacrifice of Isaac, the treatment of Jesus. Even if you ultimately believe that God is good, I see very little room for a conclusion other than that he is above morality given the the things his plans often entail.

The problem is you're doing what a lot of people are doing and mapping your concept that were taught of GOD into this show. its not Christian or Jewish theology that's at play here exactly, but a quasi-New Age/theosophist kind of take on spirituality. And I think a very plausable one if you're able to forgo the need for rational explanations for everything.

[Skydiver]

i've found that some of hte best and most memorable scifi has drawn from earth's own myths and legends and that wraps their science in some classic fiction

[CincyLady]

Hera must have something in her blood that allows her offsprings to be fitter to survive. That's not out of the question.

Up until that point at the end, I was slightly annoyed by how unimportant Hera had become AFTER all that effort to rescue her.

As far as the rest of the humans, you might also consider another theory that's out there, which is the Toba Catastrophe Theory, where 70,000 to 75,000 years ago a supervolcanic event at Lake Toba, on Sumatra, reduced the world's human population to 10,000 or even a mere 1,000 breeding pairs, creating a bottleneck in human evolution.

Which might explain in regards to Mitochondrial Eve where it states while she (Hara) might be the only 'Eve' we can see, because when a son is produced with no daughters, then the ability to trace to the previous generation (Eve) would then be lost.

[SoulReaver]

After 5 years, I find out that BSG never was a science fiction story

took you 5 years to figure that out ?
btw RDM himself never referred to it as sci-fi