Deadlock (416)

[Gatz]

I think it obviously means the Cylons know exactly where they are and have always.
But i'd say something to do with not being able to resurrect has bought the fleet some time.

It makes sense. If they try to attack the fleet they risk losing forever entire basestars full of cylons, specially now that the fleet has its own basestar

[STC]

This one cracked me up

MadDog: "How many dead chicks are out there?"

that cracked me up. Also loved the line" Grampa was a power sander!"

[STC]

By the way, was it just me or did it seem that when Ellen and Tigh were getting busy on the table, that when he looked up at her he was saw the white glow around her briefly? I thought that was the case, but I am still not able to make the connection between the "glow" and a specific emotion set or circumstance, as of yet.

he saw her briefly as Caprica.

[Bruman]

OMG! An epiphany for me. I didn't really buy into the "Cylons need Love to Reproduce," and just took it as Cylon self-mythology, but maybe it really is true.

My theory is that Ellen may have deliberately made it so that love (or the feeling of love) is required to reproduce, so that cylons who are angry like Cavil can't. She's obviously proud of the fact that she's given free will and "something so much more important:" which might be the capacity to love. So the hope is that Cylons will be capable of love and those will be the ones that can reproduce.

Remember that she told Saul "she really needs to hear that you love her." Maybe that was much more than "she would really like to hear that you love her."

[Bruman]

"Grampa was a power sander!"

"How many dead chicks are out there?"


Ditto! Probably my two favorite lines this week! Those were great.

[STC]

Some thoughts and comments to all..........

1) I'm rusty on the history, so I don't remember how Boomer got away, so somebody remind me.

2) where are Helo/Athena and Hera??

3) I don't buy the "all it takes is love to make a baby'. doesn't any else find it odd that they could build 'skinjobs", but didn't have the technology to give Gaeta a prosthetic limb? We have it, why didn't they? We have technology to prove fertility; why didn't they??

4) I find the whole discussion and use of the term 'One True God' a little disquieting because I would have thought in a world or time where science has evolved to such a high degree that the characters (or in this case the writers!) would not default to such an easy way out.

[Espeon1962]

Some thoughts and comments to all..........

1) I'm rusty on the history, so I don't remember how Boomer got away, so somebody remind me..

Remember, she was shot and died in Galen's arms way back in Season 2.

2) where are Helo/Athena and Hera??

Thats one of those annoying details I think lots of us are wondering. I thought that maybe that was Athena at the hospital bed with the eight and the final five when they were voting on leaving or staying, but she was never addressed by name and when she spoke she did not "act" like Athena so I concluded it was not her.

3) I don't buy the "all it takes is love to make a baby'. doesn't any else find it odd that they could build 'skinjobs", but didn't have the technology to give Gaeta a prosthetic limb? We have it, why didn't they? We have technology to prove fertility; why didn't they??

This love thing has me vexed as well. I did postulate in an earlier post in this thread (post #74) that I thought that Ellen's whole speech at the end where she was telling Caprica that the baby living was proof of Saul's love was all a setup for her to drive a wedge between Saul and Caprica when the baby died, as she knew it would die, and now when I think about it, maybe love is a prerequisite, and Ellen knows that if the machine side of the cylons senses confusion about the love, then the baby aborts.

I always found it annoying that with all the technology about, Gaeta never got a new limb nor Saul a new eye. One of those plot holes we just have to live with.

-I would have liked a scene where Adama and one of the Colonial-Cylons have a conversation about changes, the future and the past. Something that acknowledges all of the past between the Humans & Cylons and the fact that a blending of the two is the only hope for either and it doesn't mean for a moment that it won't be a difficult road. Mentioning also that its a lot easier to nuke your enemy or run from them than to live and cooperate with them.

I totally agree about the fact this conversation should have occurred by now. It goes to my point I made earlier in this thread (#74) about their letting Ellen just go about her business without questioning her completely on all the information she knows, as it is obvious she has the ability to fill in so many blanks. We saw in past episodes that the rebel Cylons usually had one cylon "elected" to be the spokesman and negotiator with the humans (ex Natalie) so who is fulfilling that role now? The whole interaction seems somewhat haphazard, and I doubt a machine based race would progress in that manner.

Post is getting long so going to stop, although lots more comes to mind. Some good points made by many that I would love to debate further!

[Darkside_Six]

It's a cool looking gun, but it's anything but an assault rifle. It's a civilian semi-automatic submachine gun, which actually packs less firepower than the standard BSG pistol (an FN Five-Seven).

[lordolorin]

This blending of the cylon-human crew is coming more and more often in the shows, as in this one. They obviously want to show that they have to be together to survive. So to draw a conclusion, and to place blames..., I think that for everything that happened is fault of the Lord's of Kobol!
Think about it, they crated all of them. Well humans created cylons, but lord's created humans, but cylons were accepted as another human tribe, 13th, and received the Lord's love bla, bla, bla....
Lord's were deeply hurt that they eventually all left from them, and with all this they wanted to put thing right again, to show them they cannot live apart each other, or to punish them all for leaving Kobol, or both...
Well... that's just one of my theories....

[HAL2100]

I guess I can see where you are coming from, but I'm not really that big on the "mindfraks" -- nearly every episode of Lost is a mindfrak and it gets tiring as the show just becomes a parody of itself. Granted, I am sure it can be done well, but I just don't really think it is necessary. I like the fact that we only found out that Ellen was the Fifth Cylon when the four Fifths found out. It strikes me as being a bit more subtle

The trick is to hold of on the mind fraks and use the sparingly. Lost is getting a bit tiresome to the point where I'd love to make a two hour movie where its nothing but 'We don't have to the time, Jack, we have to go now' and other whatnot where it all turns out to be getting the main character to his son's birthday party. A total farce of it.

[HAL2100]

OMG! An epiphany for me. I didn't really buy into the "Cylons need Love to Reproduce," and just took it as Cylon self-mythology, but maybe it really is true.

My theory is that Ellen may have deliberately made it so that love (or the feeling of love) is required to reproduce, so that cylons who are angry like Cavil can't. She's obviously proud of the fact that she's given free will and "something so much more important:" which might be the capacity to love. So the hope is that Cylons will be capable of love and those will be the ones that can reproduce.

Remember that she told Saul "she really needs to hear that you love her." Maybe that was much more than "she would really like to hear that you love her."

I'm liking that theory, ensure that love is pervasive in the race before the race propogates.

[HAL2100]

4) I find the whole discussion and use of the term 'One True God' a little disquieting because I would have thought in a world or time where science has evolved to such a high degree that the characters (or in this case the writers!) would not default to such an easy way out.

What if its true?

Independent from that which is easier for the characters of the series to believe in - multiple gods at odds with one another and thus its human versus cylon OR one God overall all the humans and the cylons implying that he is acting on behalf of both races

[Back40]

3) I don't buy the "all it takes is love to make a baby'. doesn't any else find it odd that they could build 'skinjobs", but didn't have the technology to give Gaeta a prosthetic limb? We have it, why didn't they? We have technology to prove fertility; why didn't they??

Not really, the technology to build "skinjobs" lay with the 13th Tribe and, eventually, with the Final Five, not with the Colonials. Other than some special technology surrounding space travel, the Colonials really aren't any more advanced than we are. Prosthetic limb? Well, that's a specialized piece of work and maybe there's no-one left in the fleet with the knowledge. Technology to prove fertility? I'm thinking you maybe meant to say technology to IMprove fertility? Well, that depends on the physiology of the skinjobs. What if they are genetically engineered to NOT be able to carry a fetus without the physiological and hormonal changes that come with the belief that we are truly loved or "in love"? (And yes, there are changes in human physiology that come with these "conditions" )

4) I find the whole discussion and use of the term 'One True God' a little disquieting because I would have thought in a world or time where science has evolved to such a high degree that the characters (or in this case the writers!) would not default to such an easy way out.

Easy way out of what? Are you saying that in a time or world where science is well-advanced that belief in gods or a god wouldn't/shouldn't exist?

[Berg417448]

Ellen Tigh is from Earth. She would know the way.

We have no evidence they are still near earth. Tigh told D'anna that the fleet was preparing to jump away from earth at the end of Sometimes a Great notion. Adama told Gaeta to locate the nearest G, F, or k star sytems and then tell them to ask th ecylons if they want to join the fleet. From the webisodes we know they did an emergency jump from somewhere and then jumped back after the false alarm but we have not seen exactly where they are.

[Mamid]

I too think Anders started to download into the only available cylon matrix and as part of the download process, started to speed up the child's development rate which caused a problem and started the entire miscarriage process. The Tigh/Tigh/Cap scene was just a red herring.