Tracking Earth's Future via Current Events, etc.

[Ian-S]

Could you swear the oath on a classic copy of Playboy?

[Falcon Horus]

Could you swear the oath on a classic copy of Playboy?

Yes, following GF's logic, yes, you can.

[Gatefan1976]

Could you swear the oath on a classic copy of Playboy?

Yes, following GF's logic, yes, you can.

It's not -my- logic, it is the logic, nay the basis of swearing a damn thing.
If a playboy will keep you honest, then so be it.
If you cannot keep your oath, you are a nithling, a nothing, a coward.

[SoulReaver]

The great shameless, audacious bawler,
He will be elected governor of the army

~ Nostradamus, Century III Quatrain 81 (when talking about the Antichrist)

wonder who that shameless bawler could be
(doesn't he own a building @ 666th Avenue NY?)

[jelgate]

Yes, following GF's logic, yes, you can.

I just read the articles

[aretood2]

Whether people will see that verse and actually apply it (humbly within their own heart), remains to be seen. There's been so much talk about prophecies surrounding Donald Trump and some of his appointee selections, that such info could either be just mere hope of one's imagination or maybe it is the real deal.
Time will reveal what version this ends up being eventually.

Here's the thing. America is NOT God's country. It is not, nor has it ever been, a Christian nation. I don't say that as some sort of secularist. I say that as a Christian. At no point in American history has the USA ever behaved as a nation like a Christian ought to behave. At no point have the laws reflected the will of God. No prophet nor Apostle nor anointed one of God has ever directed the US in any capacity. Jesus himself didn't even care for mentioning the Roman government nor any desire for autonomous rule in Judea. It annoys me heavily when "Christians" decide to act with grave arrogance and presume that God somehow has a relationship with the US as a whole. If he were to have such a relationship to any nation of man, it'd be the state of Israel.

God cares not for the things of Caesar. That's why Jesus said to give to Caesar what is of Caesar, and to God what is of God. What makes you think that God cares for the US as a government or people? The Bible does talk about God's nation, and its name is the Kingdom of Heaven and it is not beholden to any rule of man.

We as Americans are not God's people. You have to decide where your true loyalties are as a Christian. Are you American first, or are you of the Kingdom of Heaven first? You can't serve two masters. I'm American by flesh, but my primary loyalty will always be with the Kingdom. That verse belongs only to God's people as a Kingdom of Heaven.

If you're hoping for healing -- Pence's vision is quite possibly not the kind, most Americans will be happy with.

Notwithstanding, they're still using a Bible to swear into a State office. *shakes head*
Where's that separation of Church and State?

As others explained, it has nothing to do with that. Besides, I can count on my one hand the number of presidents that didn't use a Bible for the oath. The Bible has been used since George Washington used it for his first swearing in. And before someone claims that he did it to keep himself from being lynched, John Quincy Adams didn't swear on the Bible just a few decades after Washington did.

And from what I read, it's a very delicate copy. Should it rain, they have someone on standby to put it right back in a conservation room.

Also, I would swear on a copy of the book of the dead.
Or a Horus-statue. Or perhaps, have my inauguration in the stone circle of Avebury or Stonehenge.

I know you're joking, but this would tell me that you're a very dishonorable person not to be trusted. The point of making an oath is that you swear on something you feel is important above all things. That if you break your oath, you are dishonoring that very thing that you hold dear.

It wouldn't make sense for a devout Christian to swear on anything other than a Bible...unless they have intentions to break that oath without dishonoring their faith (ignoring that there are issues with breaking promises within Christianity). The act is for the benefit of the witnesses and those who are holding the person responsible for keeping their word as well as those who depend on the person keeping their word.

Last I heard, you're not religious...so why swear on religious books?

[SGalisa]

If you're hoping for healing -- Pence's vision is quite possibly not the kind, most Americans will be happy with.

You may seem to be forgetting that the so-called "Hope and Change" President Obama *PROMISED* to all of America ended up NOT being the same idea of "Hope and Change" most Americans expected. Many lost jobs/thus lost hope. Many got Change -- change for the worst.

Change of seeing violent rioters being given *freedom* to letting out their rants by literally breaking down businesses, vandalizing, and gang-bangers beating up anyone just because they felt like it. Only when an outcry demanded for the problems to stop, did anyone in authority actually stop them..? Three days of a wrecking spree was 3 minutes beyond the point of tolerance.

It's Time for that sort of deliberate malicious behavior to stop. Follow the leader on any money trails.. If Soros is involved or any of the multi-elite(s), those persons are just as responsible for the damages and any injuries caused by the rioters and gang-bangers, as much as the ones who actually did the damage. How to stop or deal with it? Let the wisdom of the experts figure that one out. (Hint--Tough love enforcement, because letting the irate behaviors continue to froth out their anger -- just simply hasn't stopped that particular *bad* behavior / pattern.)

To be fair, the Bible is optional, same as it is in the courts. Lets face it, the notion was to swear an OATH on something you would not break, so for you it could be scrolls from the Library of Alexandria.
The oath is the important part, not what you swear -on-.

Yep. (The Bible or anything else used as an object to take an oath upon--) It's optional nowadays. If a Muslim was being sworn in, that Muslim might be taking an oath over the Koran/Quran. A Muslim has already done that (oath taking with the Quran) either in Michigan or Minnesota.

Here's the thing. America is NOT God's country. It is not, nor has it ever been, a Christian nation...

...That verse belongs only to God's people as a Kingdom of Heaven.

That's right, it does (belong to God/God's kingdom). However, since whatever we do on earth is also done "as it is in heaven" -- if you're still alive on earth and the crops are failing and you want/need to eat healthy -- you would want your agricultural fields to start blooming again; and so would hope/pray to gain wisdom for periods of plenty vs. the times of drought and despair, you'd be praying that prayer for healing of your land. Same applies to praying for healing bonds with your neighbors and to end the criminal nonsense that some folks let run amuck. Your leaders in authority will only go so far, so it's up to the praying individual to seek out the Lord God's help and intervene in situations that mankind won't or doesn't know how to resolve.

That does NOT mean that the person needs to pray that prayer *out loud* which might annoy anyone nearby. It means to quietly and humbly pray within the deep recesses of your mind and spiritual heart -- a prayer for complete healing, IF that is even possible.

I say that, because I witnessed it in *action* first hand with our own family. Both sides ending up having snit fits and grudges that were so deep that any looks could have killed the other person looking at the one holding the grudge. Man o'Man!! It took a miracle to restore some semblance of peace between the persons harboring grudges between each other. Not sure if things are safe enough yet to relax, so I'm not relaxing.. still praying for continued peace in those situations. God took care of the rest in ways that was heart-breaking to watch. Tears of relief and joy, but also tears of heart-breaking pain for the events that took place to bring about those moments of a peace-Truce.

BTW, there wasn't a person on this planet who could have intervened in either of the family disputes I just mentioned. Only God could repair the damage and heal the situations on both ends, enough for conversation to even begin flowing again. The same is often true of anger within a nation. Only God can intervene and heal/repair the damages that humans have either done to each other or even to their own land. I've seen that happen over and over again -- not on a world-wide level stage, but on a much smaller scale --- one family+in-laws at a time.

Same (healing prayer) principle would work on a national level, but only within one family+in-laws or neighborhood at a time. ..Eventually, the rest of the neighborhoods should heal as well as the land. (yeah, that's being hopefully optimistic, at best -- sometimes when certain situations appear to be against all odds for the positive good stuff to occur.)

[SoulReaver]

However, since whatever we do on earth is also done "as it is in heaven"

would that include pollution?

[Falcon Horus]

Here's the thing. America is NOT God's country. It is not, nor has it ever been, a Christian nation.

But your money says "In God We Trust":



History of 'In God We Trust'

The motto IN GOD WE TRUST was placed on United States coins largely because of the increased religious sentiment existing during the Civil War. Secretary of the Treasury Salmon P. Chase received many appeals from devout persons throughout the country, urging that the United States recognize the Deity on United States coins. From Treasury Department records, it appears that the first such appeal came in a letter dated November 13, 1861.

From the letter mentioned above;

"One fact touching our currency has hitherto been seriously overlooked. I mean the recognition of the Almighty God in some form on our coins.

You are probably a Christian. What if our Republic were not shattered beyond reconstruction? Would not the antiquaries of succeeding centuries rightly reason from our past that we were a heathen nation? What I propose is that instead of the goddess of liberty we shall have next inside the 13 stars a ring inscribed with the words PERPETUAL UNION; within the ring the allseeing eye, crowned with a halo; beneath this eye the American flag, bearing in its field stars equal to the number of the States united; in the folds of the bars the words GOD, LIBERTY, LAW.

This would make a beautiful coin, to which no possible citizen could object. This would relieve us from the ignominy of heathenism. This would place us openly under the Divine protection we have personally claimed. From my hearth I have felt our national shame in disowning God as not the least of our present national disasters."

Point in fact: I had no idea, so there, learned something new about the USA.

And the US is not the only country which has some reference to a deity on their currency. Kuwait references God (though Islam is the state religion), some UK coins make a mention 'By the Grace of God, Queen, the Defender of Faith).

As others explained, it has nothing to do with that.

It's a personal choice.

I saw the Lincoln Bible -- well, the book held in a picture -- and I was surprised to even let it out of its cage. Being outside of a controlled environment can so not be good for the conservation of that book.

I know you're joking, but this would tell me that you're a very dishonorable person not to be trusted. The point of making an oath is that you swear on something you feel is important above all things. That if you break your oath, you are dishonoring that very thing that you hold dear.

And what makes you think I do not hold these objects and places in high regard?

For the record, I have a Horus statue (about 30cm high) in a prominent place in my living room.
The Book of the Dead is an important Ancient Egyptian artifact, which depicts the travellings a soul makes to the underworld, and subsequent afterlife.

And ever been to either Avebury or Stonehenge? The feeling those places give cannot possible be described in words. Stonehenge perhaps a little less since it's way too touristy, but Avebury is ... well, if I ever get married, it would be in one of such old places.

It wouldn't make sense for a devout Christian to swear on anything other than a Bible...unless they have intentions to break that oath without dishonoring their faith (ignoring that there are issues with breaking promises within Christianity).

I doubt I would ever classify Trump as a devout Christian.

Last I heard, you're not religious...so why swear on religious books?

What religious books? The Book of the Dead?

It's a funerary text.

The Egyptian Book of the Dead is a collection of spells which enable the soul of the deceased to navigate the afterlife. The famous title was given the work by western scholars; the actual title would translate as The Book of Coming Forth by Day or Spells for Going Forth by Day. Although the work is often referred to as "the Ancient Egyptian Bible" it is no such thing, although the two works share the similarity of being ancient compilations of texts written at different times eventually gathered together in book form. The Book of the Dead was never codified and no two copies of the work are exactly the same. They were created specifically for each individual who could afford to purchase one as a kind of manual to help them after death.

would that include pollution?

Yes, as on Earth.

[SoulReaver]

Yes, as on Earth.

I wasn't thinking of Mars

[Falcon Horus]

I wasn't thinking of Mars

No no, I meant it as a confirmation.

[aretood2]

That's right, it does (belong to God/God's kingdom). However, since whatever we do on earth is also done "as it is in heaven" -- if you're still alive on earth and the crops are failing and you want/need to eat healthy -- you would want your agricultural fields to start blooming again; and so would hope/pray to gain wisdom for periods of plenty vs. the times of drought and despair, you'd be praying that prayer for healing of your land. Same applies to praying for healing bonds with your neighbors and to end the criminal nonsense that some folks let run amuck. Your leaders in authority will only go so far, so it's up to the praying individual to seek out the Lord God's help and intervene in situations that mankind won't or doesn't know how to resolve.

That was meant for the Apostles...I mean...unless you want to say that we can all forgive sins or prevent their forgiveness?

[aretood2]

And what makes you think I do not hold these objects and places in high regard?

For the record, I have a Horus statue (about 30cm high) in a prominent place in my living room.
The Book of the Dead is an important Ancient Egyptian artifact, which depicts the travellings a soul makes to the underworld, and subsequent afterlife.

And ever been to either Avebury or Stonehenge? The feeling those places give cannot possible be described in words. Stonehenge perhaps a little less since it's way too touristy, but Avebury is ... well, if I ever get married, it would be in one of such old places.

Holding something in high regard is not the same. What do you value most that you can place your hand on? I remember watching an educational show where a Native American swore on an eagle's feather. John Quincy Adams swore on a law book. It'd be hard to swear on Stone Hinge though...The point is that it is a governing principle that establishes you as a person. If you were to be President, somehow, of the US in 2020, what would you swear on?

I doubt I would ever classify Trump as a devout Christian.

But he plays one on TV.

What religious books? The Book of the Dead?

By every sense of the word it is a religious text. Unless people at the time intended it to be truth, not a story to be told. It involves and is related to their beliefs in gods and goddesses. I mean, the Songs of Solomon (A book of the Bible) is a love poem. That's it. That's all it is. But it is still considered scripture, a religious text. It still holds meaning. The Talmud is just a dictation of arguments between Jewish Scholars regarding Mosaic law. But still a religious text.

[SGalisa]

Here's the thing. America is NOT God's country. It is not, nor has it ever been, a Christian nation...

...That verse belongs only to God's people as a Kingdom of Heaven.

That's right, it does (belong to God/God's kingdom). However, since whatever we do on earth is also done "as it is in heaven" -- if you're still alive on earth and the crops are failing and you want/need to eat healthy -- you would want your agricultural fields to start blooming again; and so would hope/pray to gain wisdom for periods of plenty vs. the times of drought and despair, you'd be praying that prayer for healing of your land. Same applies to praying for healing bonds with your neighbors and to end the criminal nonsense that some folks let run amuck. Your leaders in authority will only go so far, so it's up to the praying individual to seek out the Lord God's help and intervene in situations that mankind won't or doesn't know how to resolve.

That was meant for the Apostles...I mean...unless you want to say that we can all forgive sins or prevent their forgiveness?

You're sounding like a legalist (meaning selecting to *whom* the verse applies to) and straying from the original topic, IMHO. The subject matter in 2 Chronicles 7:14 is HEALING --with God in control of course. Healing of the land.. healing of the people and for the people to become united-- stop the squabblings and hate-mongerings, vicious destructive behaviors, etc.

If you don't *want* healing, you GET exactly what just happened during those last 8 years we just experienced. Increased lawlessness, discontent, violence in the streets as well as the schools.. kidnapped children, the list goes on and on. Instead of focusing on keeping families together, regardless of your "likes/dislike" differences, society has been ripping itself apart beginning with the family, extending into the neighborhoods, the schools, and now the entire nation. If *THAT* doesn't scream for healing, which mankind cannot simply work out thru progressive programs, because the programs already in operation haveNOT worked, then your country is lost. No hope. Plenty of change (for the worst), but no hope.. drowning in emotional seas of misery. The land suffers too, as a result.

Add agricultural and beef/poulty disasters to the mixture, and you've got one giant MESS of a problem. Go fix it mankind.. (Generic) YOU don't need God to work out the healing in places beyond your control, YOU need wisdom and agents and gadgets to work this thru to a happier ending.

On the other hand, if you seek out *professional* EXPERT help from the only persona able to heal the land and people, then God will be brought into the picture somewhere, somehow. Many people looked at (former) *President* Obama as Messiah in the living flesh. Well, we know how he left our country when he transferred gov't control over to *President* Trump. Trump needs to sift thru the regs and figure out what needs to STAY, and what needs to be overhauled. But there are too many problems to sort thru to effectively make this work overnight.

So, since thinking inside the box hasn't worked, try thinking outside the box and apply 2nd Chronicles 7:14. Christians are not "under" the law (but grace), but the laws of God are part of being an obedient soul (regardless of who that person is). God's commands / commandments are broken when lawlessness occurs. Israel's testings thruout time have proven this to be true over and over. Israel was set apart to be an example for the rest of the nations.. Same principle can be applied to them as well as to Israel. Ancient Egypt was blessed thru Joseph's agricultural wisdom and prayers. Nebucadnezzar and his people became blessed thru Daniel's intercessary prayers. So it is with all nations, who once had, but have turned away from God's word(s) and commands.

If our USA doesn't want *healing* so be it. If the intercessary prayers are withheld, this nation may/will fall into further destruction, instead. That will be the "Change" the USA will have, and it may never ever recover again. And that *no recovery* aspect, I know, is NOT what praying Christians want for the land and the people living within the USA -- citizens and visitors alike. True, we cannot delay prophecies (of end times/ages), but in the meantime, we can seek for healing, if that healing is even possible to both people living here (in the USA) as well as the land.

[Gatefan1976]

The king and the land are one?
Just one more thing being ripped off I guess.