The Political Discussion Thread

[Col.Foley]

For a libertarian that's not very libertarian is it? When your children are adults who are you to tell them what they can and can't do.

Libertarians draw their line at the Government forbiding this and forbidding that. For making laws to control how people behave. Libertarianism says nothing about individuals doing things. Because in fact if the Government cannot be expected to behave in a moral fashion...they cannot by the way...then the individuals have to

But I was also not talking about in any way shape or form of someone being an adult. Nope, but while you are my daughter, or son, below the legal age, you will not do such a thing...not if I can help it. And if you do so as an adult theen I will excercise my freedom and my Libertarian nature and not have anything to do with you. Ever again.

[jmoz]

You make a good point about the representativeness of our Government actually. The only thing is that 'legalizing' something is not putting a stamp of approval on it. Not the Governments, and not the society at large and certainly not the individual. I certainly do not approve of such an activity even though I see the arguments for wanting to legalize it.

And torture under no circumstances should be 'legal'. Torture actually does physical harm to someones body and life, which should be against the law.

And the slippery slope argument, good luck making it, but I do see it.

By legalizing it, you make things more and more socially acceptable. Let's do this at another angle, say some government legalizes small forms of racism, and it becomes slowly more and more acceptable to society at large. What's to prevent full blown racism becoming the next line that government crosses and legalizes? There has to be some lines there before things just collapse.

lol, so if a terrorist is known to know the location of several bombs that is about to go off and he refuses to divulge the information, you wouldn't approve the means of torture to extract that information to save 1000's of lives? Yeah, right. And it doesn't matter anyways. Some CIA person once said to a reporter something like, Such persons are going to get tortured because of the information that person is withholding regardless. The only question is whether you want a CIA person in there or not.

[jmoz]

I dont see a slippery slope between consenting adults to child abuse and rape.

I get the whole some people don't mind letting there body be used for monetary gain, I mean I guess some form of it is ok if it's consensual. But I'm talking about society at large, where are the lines, or are there any? When does it go from being wrong, to being ok, to being socially acceptable. When does it stop for anything in general?

But I do see the whole 'institutionalize it so that at least there is some form of control over it where there is less misery spread around.'

[Ukko]

By legalizing it, you make things more and more socially acceptable. Let's do this at another angle, say some government legalizes small forms of racism, and it becomes slowly more and more acceptable to society at large. What's to prevent full blown racism becoming the next line that government crosses and legalizes? There has to be some lines there before things just collapse.

.

What about Boxing (Something thats actually encouraged as a good way of keeping people off the street.). Basically to people attempting to punch each other out. Thats legal, but im yet to hear the government trying to mak it legal for me to punch in the face anyone i dissagree with.

[Col.Foley]

By legalizing it, you make things more and more socially acceptable. Let's do this at another angle, say some government legalizes small forms of racism, and it becomes slowly more and more acceptable to society at large. What's to prevent full blown racism becoming the next line that government crosses and legalizes? There has to be some lines there before things just collapse.

lol, so if a terrorist is known to know the location of several bombs that is about to go off and he refuses to divulge the information, you wouldn't approve the means of torture to extract that information to save 1000's of lives? Yeah, right. And it doesn't matter anyways. Some CIA person once said to a reporter something like, Such persons are going to get tortured because of the information that person is withholding regardless. The only question is whether you want a CIA person in there or not.

This is an interesting statement and phenmon because Government, especially those in the South, very much did lead to rascism and slavery and practices which took a century to stamp out...and its not fully there. But I do wonder what someone means by legalizing racism.

But you see al this would be solved if we would be strong individuals. The Government can legalize drugs, prostitution, and launching Jews into the ocean with a catipult, but I will never support it, and I do not think a lot of the people, even those who want to legalize such things, would neccessarily use it. I think we have a lot more dangers with prostituition like dehumanizing people.

And that, is not a matter of legality. I will not bat an eye if the only way to save millions of people is to toruture some terrorist, but it is still wrong.

[Ukko]

I get the whole some people don't mind letting there body be used for monetary gain, I mean I guess some form of it is ok if it's consensual. But I'm talking about society at large, where are the lines, or are there any? When does it go from being wrong, to being ok, to being socially acceptable. When does it stop for anything in general?

But I do see the whole 'institutionalize it so that at least there is some form of control over it where there is less misery spread around.'

Think of this as part of my other post

But sex isnt wrong or immoral to begin with and shouldnt be treated as such, so if someone whats to charge for that i dont see it leading to the acceptance of child abuse or rape. To things that deffinately are wrong.

[jmoz]

What about Boxing (Something thats actually encouraged as a good way of keeping people off the street.). Basically to people attempting to punch each other out. Thats legal, but im yet to hear the government trying to mak it legal for me to punch in the face anyone i dissagree with.

from boxing to ufc to .....? What's next? It's getting more and more brutal, isn't it? I could easily foresee something in the form of mortal combat/fighting becoming something that becomes more and more socially acceptable sometime in the future.

[Ukko]

from boxing to ufc to .....? What's next? It's getting more and more brutal, isn't it? I could easily foresee something in the form of mortal combat/fighting becoming something that becomes more and more socially acceptable sometime in the future.

But those are nothing compared to what we used to do, compared to dules to the death (and im not talking about pistols) its pretty tame.
And those are sports wich people choose to take part in. No forcing or abuse.

[Galileo_Galilee]

The big problem about sex is most people don't seem to be concerned about the consequences, they just want to get laid.

It never even occurs to them that having sex can get them in to a lot of trouble.

[jmoz]

So it'll be ok if sometime in the future, forms of roman gladiator thing happens where you have groups of people fight each other to the death for society's amusement? That's ok as long as those groups of people consent to it? That's ok that the society is amused by people killing each other?

[Ukko]

The big problem about sex is most people don't seem to be concerned about the consequences, they just want to get laid.

It never even occurs to them that having sex can get them in to a lot of trouble.

Thats where propper education comes in, but some people seem to be against educating.

[Col.Foley]

The big problem about sex is most people don't seem to be concerned about the consequences, they just want to get laid.

It never even occurs to them that having sex can get them in to a lot of trouble.

No kidding.

[Galileo_Galilee]

No kidding.

Pun intended?

[Col.Foley]

Pun intended?

Probably.

[Ukko]

So it'll be ok if sometime in the future, forms of roman gladiator thing happens where you have groups of people fight each other to the death for society's amusement? That's ok as long as those groups of people consent to it? That's ok that the society is amused by people killing each other?

Our society is already amused by people killing each other. The difference being that nowadays most people dont see such things (and probably couldnt stomach it) in real life. We wach movies, read books and watch it on TV today, and although its faked, its still violence, killing and etc etc for enterainment.