Originally posted by Gatefan1976
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I have issue with blaming just the Tea Party or even just the Republicians for the government problemsOriginally posted by aretood2 -
You're not explaining your position, you're just rewording it. What are the issues you have with blaming the Tea Party, and why? It sounds like you're just tossing out a kind of "they're both as bad as each other" rhetoric without actually knowing what has gone on.Originally posted by jelgate View Post
The Republicans are refusing to fulfil their government function by not passing a budget. Ted Cruz is leading this because he thinks it's something he can use as proof of him being strong in the face of Obama when his presidential run rolls around, same with his pretend filibuster against a bill he ended up voting for. The Tea Party are following because Obama is usually so weak in negotiation they believe they can use the budget to blackmail him into defunding the Affordable Care Act and claim a victory. It's objectively the Republican's fault, and only the Republican's fault.Comment
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Saw this headline (on the internet) in the New York Times --
"Urging Patience, Obama Says Problems With Health Care Sites Reflect Demand"
By JACKIE CALMES
Published: October 5, 2013 (New York Times)
hmmm. Those in the USA gov't in favor of this entire healthcare package seem to have narrow vision.
There are three main reasons surrounding the *demand-to-access* of this entire healthcare exchange POV--
Reason #1--
Those who *fear* getting sacked with a hefty FINE/Penalty for NOT signing up or getting health insurance.
(reminder -- penalty fee goes up to $695.00 USA dollars in 2016, for anyone NOT obtaining healthcare insurance...!)
Reason #2--
Those who believe (probably with all their heart, mind, and soul) that they will be getting a bargain deal along with "best of care" in signing up and (finally) getting some form of healthcare insurance.
Reason #3--
Those who are just signing in, because they have NO other alternative, except to get the insurance on their own, because their employer bailed out from getting a group policy. Otherwise, refer back to either reason #1 or #2 for having a possible reason for joining up on the healthcare . gov exchange site to get what they've been told (ordered, lest they get FINED) to do.
Sort of like holding a person hostage, but with the threat of "You WILL do this, or ELSE..."
(pay the penalty price one way or another).
If I'm reading that incorrectly -- I don't know, but maybe this next bit will help clarify the above---Originally posted by jelgate View Post
Gov't shutdown was as much caused by the Democrats when
#1 -- Democrat side continually threw NO votes back at the Republican side during the night of September 30, 2013, especially during the last six hours before midnight, when October 1, 2013 began and opened up the lines for the healthcare (dot) gov site to sign in anyone willing or begrudgingly attempting to get their *mandatory* healthcare insurance -- lest they suffer from that nasty threat of being penalized.
At midnight, according to one radio report (heard on one of those "talk" radio shows), the scenario was reminding listeners that the image went this way--
The Republicans showed up for the meeting to cast votes, and the entire Democratic side walked out or ended up in a NO-SHOW. That was the Democrat side's way of basically saying,
*No. You (Reps) won't vote for this insurance deal, therefore, YOU (Reps) are shutting off your end of the gov't. Until you come to terms with OUR side and OUR way, these negotiations are closed, will remain CLOSED, and in essence--the gov't will remain shut down until you give in to OUR "bill"...*
So, the blame is being shifted entirely to the Republicans.
The entire ACA/AHCA bill has been the beloved baby project of the Democrats from day 1.
Certainly, and especially Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid won't back off of their *pet* project, which has probably grown to more than 10,000 pages of reading documents, and that's not including the news coverage covering it either..!!
So, for anyone who thinks this situation will be short-lived, here's another article reinforcing the potential length -- in weeks
Spoiler:
Also, reminder.. for most of the summer, there were were several articles that came out claiming that something BIG was going to happen with the USA gov't during the months of OCTOBER and possibly NOVEMBER of 2013. Most of the articles were claiming Syria might be the core of the cause. There is also an *Emergency Exercises* situation that would be set up in the USA for Canada and Mexico (and maybe South America) to participate. However, in light of recent events, it seems that maybe this current USA gov't situation/crisis just might be at the core of the *Emergency Exercises*. Seriously?
Most of the comments regarding the manuevers claimed these are normal exercises that go on every year, except this year is supposed to include Canada and the USA's southern neighbors, as well.
Don't even try to speculate what *it* might or could be about...
Jeesh. The entire east coast of NJ/NY were hoping NOT to be involved in anything drastic this year or any year for the next 20 to 50 years -- since many are still dealing with issues caused by hurricane SANDY from October 2012..! Oh, and it wasn't really surprising reading the list of "ObamaCare" casualties of full timers being reduced to part timers--
to see that most of the public (gov't?) employees in Toms River, NJ were getting their hours cut due to "ObamaCare".. because they are still reeling from trying to recover from Sandy's flood and wind damages to that entire area.
However, it was also a bit disturbing seeing another name on that same list of a school system (entire town of) from my childhood having their hours cut to part time.. sounds like the good old days of split classroom sessions, because of overcrowding, but this is because of... what..? lack of funds for or because OF healthcare insurance..??
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ObamaCare went through... deal with it, and move on!
Enjoy the fact you can have health insurance if you so please, affordable health care no less. If that's not pleasing, then die of a cold but seriously...
I'm unemployed at the moment, and I enjoy affordable health insurance and thus affordable health care should I need it (which I hopefully don't).Heightmeyer's Lemming -- still the coolest Lemming of the forum
Proper Stargate Rewatch -- season 10 of SG-1
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might I remind you that slavery was once the law of the land as well? were we supposed to just "shut up and deal with it?"Originally posted by Falcon Horus View Post
and a health care policy that's so far done nothing except RAISE premiums (and force people to pay for services they might find morally objectionable through their taxes to boot) is beginning to look an awful lot like slavery to me, slavery to the bigwig pharmaceutical companies which were and still are its biggest defendersComment
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Read this and make up your own mind..
http://www.politicususa.com/2013/10/...own-pride.html
It's all about pride and the Tea Party only happened after Obama. It's the "old white man's party" reallyGo home aliens, go home!!!!
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And I bet their was such groups when Bush was president, when Clintion was president, and so on for the past decades. I have no doubt the Tea Party is just trying to cause problems. But that is the government selfish corruption that has been going on for decades and why I hate politics a lot of timesOriginally posted by Coco Pops View PostOriginally posted by aretood2Comment
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While out shopping, I met some lady (a complete stranger in passing) who had nothing nice to say about this whole healthcare bill scenario. She said that her and her family have a huge list of bad health ailments and surgeries that they've already gone thru, and still have more health (and probably financial) problems to deal with (but -- however...)... and believes there really ARE "death panels" out there waiting in the wings, just waiting to tell folks whose health is just so far gone that they are putting a strain / burden on others, and have nothing worthy to contribute to society.. so these will be the folks getting denied care, even when they *have* the insurance to get surgery, meds, etc.
She's only one of many others that have voiced (on radio call-in programs) the same *issues*.
They may be proud of it, but if these folks don't start working in compliance of a law that is NOW law (the law of the land, so to speak), they're all gonna find that pride a bit short-lived when they end up out of a job. ...and then the multi-trillion dollar question would be, will they be denied (quality) health care (because of simple "general principles") or still get it..? Or would that depend on which way they vote, as well..?Originally posted by Coco Pops View Post
Also, there have been numerous articles in the past year from various news around the rest of the world about -- if the USA falls, it will fall from "within" (within its own gov't/people). Is this the beginning of that, and has the situation reached a point beyond any return, or could there be any hope of seeing
"peace and prosperity" occurring this side of the oceans ever again..?
After reading numerous articles, etc., I think the degree of folks are greater against the GOP, etc., than for it. On the other extreme, it wouldn't be surprising if some of the rest of the world is just shaking their head or laughing from watching the 3-ring circus acts going on in multiple places.
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What the American public wants is largely irrelevant these days. The US won't get it's democracy back until it gets money out of politics.Comment
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Ok, but now you are expanding the scope.Originally posted by jelgate View Post
Government problems are a result of greed, and all sides are guilty, this is true.
The topic at hand is the shutdown however.sigpicALL THANKS TO THE WONDERFUL CREATOR OF THIS SIG GO TO R.I.G.A lie is just a truth that hasn't gone through conversion therapy yetThe truth isn't the truthComment
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Right now, with the whole concept of non coverage for "pre existing conditions" she is ON the "death panel".Originally posted by SGalisa View PostWhile out shopping, I met some lady (a complete stranger in passing) who had nothing nice to say about this whole healthcare bill scenario. She said that her and her family have a huge list of bad health ailments and surgeries that they've already gone thru, and still have more health (and probably financial) problems to deal with (but -- however...)... and believes there really ARE "death panels" out there waiting in the wings, just waiting to tell folks whose health is just so far gone that they are putting a strain / burden on others, and have nothing worthy to contribute to society.. so these will be the folks getting denied care, even when they *have* the insurance to get surgery, meds, etc.
She's only one of many others that have voiced (on radio call-in programs) the same *issues*.
What goes on in these peoples minds???
Even the average poli is a multi-millionare, do you really think they will not have health insurance, job or not?They may be proud of it, but if these folks don't start working in compliance of a law that is NOW law (the law of the land, so to speak), they're all gonna find that pride a bit short-lived when they end up out of a job. ...and then the multi-trillion dollar question would be, will they be denied (quality) health care (because of simple "general principles") or still get it..? Or would that depend on which way they vote, as well..?
Do you think Romney with his multiple, multi-millions can't afford a good doc, just because he is no longer in politics??
That's up to you folks.Also, there have been numerous articles in the past year from various news around the rest of the world about -- if the USA falls, it will fall from "within" (within its own gov't/people). Is this the beginning of that, and has the situation reached a point beyond any return, or could there be any hope of seeing
"peace and prosperity" occurring this side of the oceans ever again..?
We ARE laughing at you, sorry.After reading numerous articles, etc., I think the degree of folks are greater against the GOP, etc., than for it. On the other extreme, it wouldn't be surprising if some of the rest of the world is just shaking their head or laughing from watching the 3-ring circus acts going on in multiple places.
Problem is, because so much is tied to the US, we can only laugh so much before your own stupidity threatens other countries.sigpicALL THANKS TO THE WONDERFUL CREATOR OF THIS SIG GO TO R.I.G.A lie is just a truth that hasn't gone through conversion therapy yetThe truth isn't the truthComment
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You (Gatefan1976) just reinforced my point.
Sadly, an article came out today from the Asian Pacific side of the world that the USA shutdown IS beginning to affect the rest of the planet's businesses.
Spoiler:
Based on last week's news (heard via radio), one could easily get the impression that some sadistic side of the USA governing bodies seemed to either enjoy watching or thriving on the drama(s) unfolding -- via the world scene. If that is true, then it makes many previously suspected conspiracy *theories* more real than imagined -- meaning (mildly translating), How much of history's horrid political events were actually pulled together by some mad elites (folks with money and power) at the top making such (man-made) events actually occur or not..?
Is that why the entire world is a "Stage"..
and its various regions are often referred to as "theater" (or "theatre")..?
where every living entity is a *puppet* being used or manipulated by someone else..
If so, what is "normal living"..? or is there no such thing as *normal* in this world..?
Seriously, that *drama* is stuff that goes on in the movies and fictional world -- not something to toy with in real life! Yet, centuries have shown that apparently, that is what some *real-world* humans seem to thrive on... while the rest of us (peons / nobodies) get stuck in the middle and crushed in some form or another.
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This time, that was my point.Originally posted by SGalisa View PostYou (Gatefan1976) just reinforced my point.
Because of your size, and impact on other cultures, we HAVE to take you (the US) into account, do you think we are happy about watching your moronic activities??
If the world is a cracker, your politics is the crap joke in the centre.
And yet, you will not grow up.Sadly, an article came out today from the Asian Pacific side of the world that the USA shutdown IS beginning to affect the rest of the planet's businesses.
To large, to ignorant, and too stupid to care about what happens outside your borders if there is no gain in it for the US.
(I don't mean anyone here, I mean your country)
OK, two points going on here.Based on last week's news (heard via radio), one could easily get the impression that some sadistic side of the USA governing bodies seemed to either enjoy watching or thriving on the drama(s) unfolding -- via the world scene. If that is true, then it makes many previously suspected conspiracy *theories* more real than imagined -- meaning (mildly translating), How much of history's horrid political events were actually pulled together by some mad elites (folks with money and power) at the top making such (man-made) events actually occur or not..?
1: I really think the US political *system* is quite frankly, too stupid to know, and too arrogant to care what their little hissy fit does to the rest of the world. Honestly, I think all "western nations" should drop the US like a bad habit and go back to European dominance of "the west"
You are a bunch of children playing with a loaded gun.
2: As for "Mad Eliteists"
You are right, it's people caring more about their own pathetic hide than the impact of their actions.
There is normal, but what is "normal" does not rule, sad but true.Is that why the entire world is a "Stage"..
and its various regions are often referred to as "theater" (or "theatre")..?
where every living entity is a *puppet* being used or manipulated by someone else..
If so, what is "normal living"..? or is there no such thing as *normal* in this world..?
Yes we do.Seriously, that *drama* is stuff that goes on in the movies and fictional world -- not something to toy with in real life! Yet, centuries have shown that apparently, that is what some *real-world* humans seem to thrive on... while the rest of us (peons / nobodies) get stuck in the middle and crushed in some form or another.
sigpicALL THANKS TO THE WONDERFUL CREATOR OF THIS SIG GO TO R.I.G.A lie is just a truth that hasn't gone through conversion therapy yetThe truth isn't the truthComment
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I wonder if they will run close to the 21 days that the Clinton shutdown ran, or even worse through pig headedness run past the deadline?
It's a curious thing.Go home aliens, go home!!!! Comment
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