The Political Discussion Thread

[Col.Foley]

What do you mean they aren't being forced out of business? They can't maintain a business if it isn't profiting them. I think we can both just agree big business is bad in some practices such as making you completely dependent on them and limiting the growth of small business and becoming too big that they have some leeway into the affairs of the government because of the dependency.

No we cannot agree.

And actually they can, buisnesses do it all the time, especially if they have good financial backing. Whether it is to just start up, or 'under cut' someone. and then the buisness owner and people in question find ways of making up the difference either through increased inventory, finding another job, or....well there are a lot of ways to do it lets just say that.

[Rudy Pena]

No we cannot agree.

And actually they can, buisnesses do it all the time, especially if they have good financial backing. Whether it is to just start up, or 'under cut' someone. and then the buisness owner and people in question find ways of making up the difference either through increased inventory, finding another job, or....well there are a lot of ways to do it lets just say that.

Also there are some companies that will give people more days off, so they wont have to cut anyone from due to lack of money.

[jmoz]

Big business is good? That's what you're saying?

[Rudy Pena]

Big business is good? That's what you're saying?

Me? Nope, my last post is talking about smaller companies and what not.

[Col.Foley]

Also there are some companies that will give people more days off, so they wont have to cut anyone from due to lack of money.

Exactly.

Big business is good? That's what you're saying?

No Big Buisness is neither good nor bad, there are good buisnesses and bad buisnesses. Smart buisnesses and stupid buisnesses. And there are even buisnesses which do infact try and violate your life, your liberty, and your ability to pursue happiness...and try to lie to you and cheat you. And that is why you need a strong Government that is capable of being a cop on the beat, but not a participant on the field.

[mad_gater]

Exactly.

No Big Buisness is neither good nor bad, there are good buisnesses and bad buisnesses. Smart buisnesses and stupid buisnesses. And there are even buisnesses which do infact try and violate your life, your liberty, and your ability to pursue happiness...and try to lie to you and cheat you. And that is why you need a strong Government that is capable of being a cop on the beat, but not a participant on the field.

indeed....

[s09119]

Exactly.

No Big Buisness is neither good nor bad, there are good buisnesses and bad buisnesses. Smart buisnesses and stupid buisnesses. And there are even buisnesses which do infact try and violate your life, your liberty, and your ability to pursue happiness...and try to lie to you and cheat you. And that is why you need a strong Government that is capable of being a cop on the beat, but not a participant on the field.

Or you can have one part of the government that participates and one part that plays. They're separate entities, you know, it's not like the departments all operate in the exact same way. They can check one another and frequently do.

[Col.Foley]

Or you can have one part of the government that participates and one part that plays. They're separate entities, you know, it's not like the departments all operate in the exact same way. They can check one another and frequently do.

good for them.

[s09119]

good for them.

Oh come on, at least give me a response I can sink my teeth into! Letting me down, Foley

[Col.Foley]

Oh come on, at least give me a response I can sink my teeth into! Letting me down, Foley

lol

Ask and you shall receieve.

Under your system we would need a Governmental agency, a Governmental agency that will check and watch the Governmental agency, and then a Governmental agency to check the people and do their more police making jobs. This is at least three times more Government agencies that would be required then if Government was limited to just being the cop...or just watching themselves and being the cop. Which is to say that there would be more Government agencies, more people being hired, and more money being spent, and knowing the nature of the Government in modern times that would be an exponential growth curve. For every agency you create you would need two or three others to watch that agency then a few others to watch the watchers and...you see where this could lead to over complication? Abuse, and corruption? No wonder we are in so much debt.

When if the Government is just limited to protecting our life liberty and pursuit of happiness, setting up a court system and a police syste and be the cop, and then watch itself through the checks and balances established in the US Constitution then you would have much fewer agencies.

[jmoz]

There is already a division of governmental powers in the states. Judicial, Legislative, Executive.

[Col.Foley]

There is already a division of governmental powers in the states. Judicial, Legislative, Executive.

yes....

[s09119]

lol

Ask and you shall receieve.

Under your system we would need a Governmental agency, a Governmental agency that will check and watch the Governmental agency, and then a Governmental agency to check the people and do their more police making jobs. This is at least three times more Government agencies that would be required then if Government was limited to just being the cop...or just watching themselves and being the cop. Which is to say that there would be more Government agencies, more people being hired, and more money being spent, and knowing the nature of the Government in modern times that would be an exponential growth curve. For every agency you create you would need two or three others to watch that agency then a few others to watch the watchers and...you see where this could lead to over complication? Abuse, and corruption? No wonder we are in so much debt.

When if the Government is just limited to protecting our life liberty and pursuit of happiness, setting up a court system and a police syste and be the cop, and then watch itself through the checks and balances established in the US Constitution then you would have much fewer agencies.

Or we work with the agencies we already have and not overexaggerate and fearmonger to convince people that the big bad government is the most corrupt in history and seeks only to abuse them. Beck does that so well as it is, you don't need to help him

And you're assuming that fewer agencies and lack of government oversight/regulation are good things... which is opinion, not fact. Looking through history and even around the world today, governments have always been more successful when they tend larger rather than smaller. There aren't exactly many cases where prosperity followed after a regime slashed its budget, gave up most of its power, and stopped regulation. In fact, the central government stepping back to let its constituent territories do all the work is what ended up killing the Confederacy; the southern states were so obsessed with states rights that the overarching authority was unable to get anything done in an organized and efficient manner.

[Col.Foley]

Or we work with the agencies we already have and not overexaggerate and fearmonger to convince people that the big bad government is the most corrupt in history and seeks only to abuse them. Beck does that so well as it is, you don't need to help him

And you're assuming that fewer agencies and lack of government oversight/regulation are good things... which is opinion, not fact. Looking through history and even around the world today, governments have always been more successful when they tend larger rather than smaller. There aren't exactly many cases where prosperity followed after a regime slashed its budget, gave up most of its power, and stopped regulation. In fact, the central government stepping back to let its constituent territories do all the work is what ended up killing the Confederacy; the southern states were so obsessed with states rights that the overarching authority was unable to get anything done in an organized and efficient manner.

Huh?

Nazi Germany, the USSR, China, North Korea, Cuba, Venezueala, Elements of the British Empire, and in fact all the great empires for that matter, Bonapart France, Musolini's Italy, the Roman Empire.

I am not saying that all Big Governments are inherently evil. Just that the potential for evil is there and the slippery slope and the line tends to get blurred the Bigger the Government you get. And that the Government tends to be the only thing, in human history and in our modern day societies, which can distribute power, grow power, and force people into doing things with the threat of the law or some other action. And the potential for corruption and...inefficincy...gets worse...no matter what we are talking about.

Because you are quite right in your assessment, and our country is a perfect example of that..not sure if the CSA are the perfect example. But the AOC are, which changed into the COnsitituition, and then the amendments we made to the Constitution post civil war that dealt with the slave trade. Our Government was too small to do much good for people.

[s09119]

Huh?

Nazi Germany, the USSR, China, North Korea, Cuba, Venezueala, Elements of the British Empire, and in fact all the great empires for that matter, Bonapart France, Musolini's Italy, the Roman Empire.

I am not saying that all Big Governments are inherently evil. Just that the potential for evil is there and the slippery slope and the line tends to get blurred the Bigger the Government you get. And that the Government tends to be the only thing, in human history and in our modern day societies, which can distribute power, grow power, and force people into doing things with the threat of the law or some other action. And the potential for corruption and...inefficincy...gets worse...no matter what we are talking about.

Because you are quite right in your assessment, and our country is a perfect example of that..not sure if the CSA are the perfect example. But the AOC are, which changed into the COnsitituition, and then the amendments we made to the Constitution post civil war that dealt with the slave trade. Our Government was too small to do much good for people.

Yeah, I'm not seeing that historically, sorry. Just naming every empire ever doesn't really prove anything. It seems more like when you shrink your government in half is when decline starts, not prosperity. You're free to disagree, I suppose, but I just don't see any of those countries/empires doing better when their ruling body voluntarily shrunk.

Corruption and inefficiency are certainly problems, but we also live in a democracy in which we get a revolution every 2-4 years. It's not as if those people are necessarily in power forever if we don't want them to be.