The Political Discussion Thread

[Keeper]

http://www.solitarywatch.com/2011/05...y-confinement/

Hmm, after reading this article, I would have to conclude that this man's punishment (28+ years of solitary confinement in a room no larger than a king-sized bed (6' x 7')), is unconstitutional because of the eighth amendment to the United States Constitution. What do you think?

tried responding when the forum was breaking. not good. anyway: i don't know your amendments, but sleep deprivation is a form of torture, so yeah. pretty sure there's something on in there which edits are here - i forgot to finish something on in there which is a bit odd. his room though is not much smaller than the one i had for my first year at college - can't see the problem (bad humour, i know )

All the experience I have had with the NHS has been good. I agree it has its problems but that has more to do with how it's run than it being free at the point of care.

BBC 4 'nough said .

northern ireland's health service isn't as good as some english hospitals, thankfully my relative got the care they needed because of rather than despite the NHS b*lls-ups. thats without even touching some of the politics (yes, politics have helped our system go down. and yes, it's messy and unconfirmed, and that's all i'll say on that side.) i've also been inside the NHS as a training employee (office side) which is how i know about the lack of cash for demolitions of hazards.

and bbc website, tis usually run by competent monkeys, not the incompetent ones

First of all: I've had mostly good experiences with the NHS, but thankfully I've never been in a serious enough position to warrant hospitalisation.

Secondly: I come from Sweden, which not only has one of the highest rates of taxation in the world (most people pay over 50% in tax), but also has one of the best welfare systems in the world (but by no means perfect). I know this may chock some of our more conservative friends from across the pond, but I don't give a damn about how much tax I have to pay. If I need to pay 70% tax, I'd happily do it. Why? Because I know that if I ever get in trouble, become homeless or unemployed, the state will help me out. And I take absolutely no shame in that. Some people may say that claiming benefits is bad, but it isn't. For me, there is no stigma in taking money from the state in the form of benefits or welfare. Everyone contributes to it, and everyone is entitled to it.

in the UK if you have more than a certain amount in savings you can't claim, if you work 16+ hours a week you can't claim, and some other ton of restrictions. but yeah, i've heard sweden has one of the best systems in the world... you also have cold weather, and proper snow... hmm... you're EU too, i wonder should i think about moving sometime?

claiming benefits is bad when you get trapped on it and can't see a way out. not everyone can handle it

[Goose]

Except in America not everyone will be entitled or qualify for it.

In Sweden, there are obviously restrictions, but in general, if you need it, you'll get it.

in the UK if you have more than a certain amount in savings you can't claim, if you work 16+ hours a week you can't claim, and some other ton of restrictions. but yeah, i've heard sweden has one of the best systems in the world... you also have cold weather, and proper snow... hmm... you're EU too, i wonder should i think about moving sometime?

claiming benefits is bad when you get trapped on it and can't see a way out. not everyone can handle it

Sweden's a wonderful place... as long as you can take darkness for months on end.

[Ukko]

In Sweden, there are obviously restrictions, but in general, if you need it, you'll get it.



Sweden's a wonderful place... as long as you can take darkness for months on end.

Only months?

[Keeper]

In Sweden, there are obviously restrictions, but in general, if you need it, you'll get it.



Sweden's a wonderful place... as long as you can take darkness for months on end.

i'm a night owl at the best of times, so thats good

and frankly, i prefer the cold. just that when it goes below, say, -10C in ireland, things get bad because we as a region aren't used to it, and there's a different quality to the air. i spent a couple months over in canada during the winter a few years back, and i could deal with much colder there than i would at home, simply because of the air

[Goose]

Only months?

Well, depends on where in Sweden you are

i'm a night owl at the best of times, so thats good

and frankly, i prefer the cold. just that when it goes below, say, -10C in ireland, things get bad because we as a region aren't used to it, and there's a different quality to the air. i spent a couple months over in canada during the winter a few years back, and i could deal with much colder there than i would at home, simply because of the air

Believe me, even for a night owl, the months of darkness gets really old really fast! And I agree with the cold; when I'm in Sweden, it's fine, but here in Eastern England it's very different!

[Keeper]

ok lets put it another way: sunlight hurts my eyes


i feel almost alive (as much as i ever do anyway) sitting up at night. even when i was working, i was half asleep in the office and wide awake at night

[Galileo_Galilee]

Ah the Swedes. They're so... Swedish.

[Goose]

Ah the Swedes. They're so... Swedish.

Gee, I wonder why

[mad_gater]

First of all: I've had mostly good experiences with the NHS, but thankfully I've never been in a serious enough position to warrant hospitalisation.

Secondly: I come from Sweden, which not only has one of the highest rates of taxation in the world (most people pay over 50% in tax), but also has one of the best welfare systems in the world (but by no means perfect). I know this may chock some of our more conservative friends from across the pond, but I don't give a damn about how much tax I have to pay. If I need to pay 70% tax, I'd happily do it. Why? Because I know that if I ever get in trouble, become homeless or unemployed, the state will help me out. And I take absolutely no shame in that. Some people may say that claiming benefits is bad, but it isn't. For me, there is no stigma in taking money from the state in the form of benefits or welfare. Everyone contributes to it, and everyone is entitled to it.

yeah well us conservatives that get rained on so much simply prefer a little freedom of choice as to how we who have been successful help our needy obtain the chance to be just as successful....if I'm surrendering all my money to government control....where's the freedom of choice in that? as I've said many times...MY money is simply that: MINE! not anybody else's...therefore it should be the individual that gets final say in how it's spent

[Goose]

yeah well us conservatives that get rained on so much simply prefer a little freedom of choice as to how we who have been successful help our needy obtain the chance to be just as successful....if I'm surrendering all my money to government control....where's the freedom of choice in that? as I've said many times...MY money is simply that: MINE! not anybody else's...therefore it should be the individual that gets final say in how it's spent

And you are more than welcome to have that opinion. Just as much as I have the opinion that it's the role of the State to help the needy ones. As for the freedom of choice? Sweden is a democracy. If people want change, then they vote for change. And there hasn't been much want for radical change, so there hasn't been any, because people don't vote for it.

[mad_gater]

the only trouble is that if your opinion gets legislated into law you've negated the right of people like us to hold our opinion.....as I said if we'd played our cards right from the outset and not given into the entitlement mentality used so much to justify collectivist thievery of money from the producers to be given to the non-producers then the only basic thing we'd need to have in place could be provided by the non-profits

[Goose]

You're still more than welcome to hold whatever opinion you have; however, in a democracy, the opinions of the majority outweigh the opinions of the few. I know we're never going to agree on this, but my basic standpoint is that the redistribution of wealth by the State to those who need it the most is nothing but a good thing.

[Galileo_Galilee]

the only trouble is that if your opinion gets legislated into law you've negated the right of people like us to hold our opinion..

The hell?

Edit:

And i don't suppose it works the other way around, that if you get you opinions legislated it somehow negates theirs and they can't keep or express their opinions?

Ever heard of the First Amendment?

[mad_gater]

The hell?

that opinion is a collectivist opinion....collectivism hold that the rights of the individual must be sacrificed to meet the needs of the whole....therefore if his opinion and others like him becomes law....in other words if the government becomes collectivist.....the right of people like us who wish to have a little freedom to manage our own monetary affairs has been usurped

[Goose]

that opinion is a collectivist opinion....collectivism hold that the rights of the individual must be sacrificed to meet the needs of the whole....therefore if his opinion and others like him becomes law....in other words if the government becomes collectivist.....the right of people like us who wish to have a little freedom to manage our own monetary affairs has been usurped

And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that! I believe more in collectivism than I do in individualism.