Religious Beliefs

[AvatarIII]

Of course not. The alternative to a standard code of conduct is anarchy. It frees everyone to do whatever they like. You would use your intellect to do what is good. Others would use theirs to do what you would consider evil. Pretty much what we have today even with religion. Might it be worse without religion?

~Dave

to me this seems very black and white. and not a very good arguing point
"world w/ religion = bad, religion = good, therefore world - religion = very bad"

why can people not be taught to be good without religion? why do we need religion to be good? if it is not to scare bad people into trying to be good then what is it good for?

[AvatarIII]

You want irrefutable proof of the existence of God before you will believe. But you accept vague theories of evolution as "pretty solid".

Technically, for me at least, both the BBT and evolution are the same basic question. The origin of everything which led to the origin of life. Evolution says that life was a random accident, and took place over millions of years. That's mutually exclusive to religion. Yet, if you could just show me the process by which non-living matter becomes living matter, it would go a long way toward making me a believer. But we still have to take on "faith" that this happened. Sounds like just another religion to me.

~Dave

evolution has nothing to do with the origin of life, evolution is the concept that genetic changes over many generations cause larger changes and that the traits favoured by the environment tend to survive, therefore the species becomes mroe suited to it's environment. and that has been seen and studied in many places, did you not know?

[GhostPoet]

Why? If it makes someone feel better to know that their belief in God is saving them from damnation or that their belief in God brings "super happy feelings", why should you begrudge them that happiness or self-fulfillment?

We all look to get different things out of life. It may not be why you believe or what you look to God for, but it works for the other guy so what does it matter?

Because that's not what Christianity is about. If you are gonna follow a belief, then follow it. But for the sake of humanity...don't follow it halfway or you just make everyone look bad. Why do you think we have wacky Christians out there banging people over the heads with bibles? It's not because God says too...it's because of people who claim to be Christian who don't even really follow their own beliefs teachings.

[~Dave]

to me this seems very black and white. and not a very good arguing point
"world w/ religion = bad, religion = good, therefore world - religion = very bad"

why can people not be taught to be good without religion? why do we need religion to be good? if it is not to scare bad people into trying to be good then what is it good for?

Because in order to be taught good from you or another other person, the students have to be forced to take your word for it. People are fallible. Why should I listen to what you say is good? Why can't I define good in terms of what gets me what I want in life?

~Dave

[Pandora's_Box]

You want irrefutable proof of the existence of God before you will believe. But you accept vague theories of evolution as "pretty solid".

Vague? Have you been paying attention to scientific advancements, read The Origin of Species, or any other definitive text on the subject?

Technically, for me at least, both the BBT and evolution are the same basic question. The origin of everything which led to the origin of life. Evolution says that life was a random accident, and took place over millions of years. That's mutually exclusive to religion. Yet, if you could just show me the process by which non-living matter becomes living matter, it would go a long way toward making me a believer. But we still have to take on "faith" that this happened. Sounds like just another religion to me.

Actually no.

Evolution is the change in the inherited traits of a population of organisms from one generation to the next, through variation, reproduction, and selection.

It is not a random occurrence and is solidly backed up by evidence.

[~Dave]

evolution has nothing to do with the origin of life, evolution is the concept that genetic changes over many generations cause larger changes and that the traits favoured by the environment tend to survive, therefore the species becomes mroe suited to it's environment. and that has been seen and studied in many places, did you not know?

That's adaptive evolution. I'm talking Darwin and the origin of species by natural selection.

*edit* What do you think "origin of species" means?

~Dave

[AvatarIII]

Because in order to be taught good from you or another other person, the students have to be forced to take your word for it. People are fallible. Why should I listen to what you say is good? Why can't I define good in terms of what gets me what I want in life?

~Dave

that is no different to the status quo, why should you listen to what your religious leader say is good when a leader of a different religion tells you something else is good.

[AvatarIII]

That's adaptive evolution. I'm talking Darwin and the origin of species by natural selection.

~Dave

they are exactly the same thing!!! when darwin says "the origin of species" he does not mean "the origin of life" he means how one species can become more then one species due to divergence or a completely different species due to evolution.

[GhostPoet]

that is no different to the status quo, why should you listen to what your religious leader say is good when a leader of a different religion tells you something else is good.

You shouldn't. Any good preacher will tell you not to only listen to him, but research it yourself as well to be sure it's true. and the truth may not always be "good" or "easy".

[Pandora's_Box]

Because that's not what Christianity is about. If you are gonna follow a belief, then follow it. But for the sake of humanity...don't follow it halfway or you just make everyone look bad. Why do you think we have wacky Christians out there banging people over the heads with bibles? It's not because God says too...it's because of people who claim to be Christian who don't even really follow their own beliefs teachings.

But you weren't talking about being Christian, you were talking about why people believe in God.

I don't much care for organized religion, so I can't say I much care for the "good image" or Christianity. As far as I'm concerned, it lost it's good image when it began persecuting non-believers. All religion did in my mind.

Because in order to be taught good from you or another other person, the students have to be forced to take your word for it. People are fallible. Why should I listen to what you say is good? Why can't I define good in terms of what gets me what I want in life?

~Dave

But you can and you do. Everyone does.

That's why people interpret the Bible in different ways. That's why people are constantly butting heads on what's right and what's wrong.

[AvatarIII]

You shouldn't. Any good preacher will tell you not to only listen to him, but research it yourself as well to be sure it's true. and the truth may not always be "good" or "easy".

if that were true, no two people would have exactly the same beliefs.

[Pandora's_Box]

That's adaptive evolution. I'm talking Darwin and the origin of species by natural selection.

Adaptation is a characteristic of an organism that has been favored by natural selection and increases the fitness of that organism.

Now you're just mixing stuff up.

[GhostPoet]

But you weren't talking about being Christian, you were talking about why people believe in God.

I don't much care for organized religion, so I can't say I much care for the "good image" or Christianity. As far as I'm concerned, it lost it's good image when it began persecuting non-believers. All religion did in my mind.



But you can and you do. Everyone does.

That's why people interpret the Bible in different ways. That's why people are constantly butting heads on what's right and what's wrong.

Ohh, in that case. Sorry about that. I should have been more clear. In my mind believing in God and Christianity go hand in hand...I forgot it's not that way for some.

[~Dave]

Adaptation is a characteristic of an organism that has been favored by natural selection and increases the fitness of that organism.

Now you're just mixing stuff up.

LOL! The only thing I'm mixing up is myself. This is a complex topic.

~Dave

[AvatarIII]

Ohh, in that case. Sorry about that. I should have been more clear. In my mind believing in God and Christianity go hand in hand...I forgot it's not that way for some.

i'd say a lot of people beleive in god or a higher power but do not follow an actual religion, but those kinds of people are often forgotten in these kinds of discussions.