"Chief Exorcist says Harry Potter is the devil" - Dont read if offendeded easily!

[Seastallion]

*sigh* Whatever.

I'm not a big fan of the Catholic church at all, but I'm not at the other extreme either. Religion has its place, but I'm more about the personal spirituality aspect than anything else. Religion itself is hollow, it is only the spiritual connection that people make and whatever enlightenment they can gain from it that really matters.

My point is, don't bash the spiritual faith of people, or your just as guilty as those who would force their religion on you. Some people actually have good reason for believing in some sort of deity. I am as strong a follower of science as anyone, yet I don't allow it to blind me to the greater realities of what may be beyond. I believe in science. I also believe in God. My definition of God anyways. Not necessarily yours. In either case, I have my reasons for believing in a reality beyond this one. I wouldn't be so arrogant as to claim to know exactly what that looks like, but I believe it is there.

Does that make me a nut? Oh, well.

[Flyboy]

1. Is Harry Potter practicing magic? Yes. It is evil. Magic both "good" and bad when not drawn from God are drawn from Satan.

2. Is there clairvoyance and other psychic practices in Harry Potter? Yes there are. Such powers once again come from Satan.

3. Monsters/ghosts/spirits/evil. Yes. All are illusions of Satan.

Even though Harry Potter is fictional what kind of message is it promoting to children? Children are very easily influenced by things available to them. They see magic being done in Harry Potter, they want to research it so they look on google for "magic" they find love spells and **** like that and then they read about witches and wicca and they keep getting interested. Then they talk to wiccans and see photos of wiccans and see how they dress and monkey see monkey do. Then they hang around with wiccans and most smoke "herbs" so now your children are on drugs. Then they get tattoos and piercings and skip school to practice magic. Then they cut themselves to draw out energy. They turn to crime or prostitution to support their drug habit. All because they saw little Harry casting a spell.

But it is fiction remember...

One look at the author of Harry Potter and you can tell theres something screwed up with her.

The only reason witchcraft is suppoedly satanic is becuase it was the rival religion when Christianity came to these shores. Its much easier to say "Dont follow them! Theyre with the DEVIL!" than to say "oh yeah, theyre ok too, but please follow us."

One of my personal interests is researching religions and paranormal phenomenon and frankly, I have a LOT of respect for Pagans and those who follow Wicca. They're usually a lot nicer than certain Christians I've met, and they usually care more about protecting the environment and being good to fellow man. You know witches DON'T believe in Satan?? How's that for you!

You my friend, are an exact representation of those higher up bodies in the Catholic church, you are so extremely into your religion (not faith, religion) that you believe everything told to you by your church without question and would, if told to, probabley chase JK Rowling with torches and pitchforks.

On my final note, can I point out that in Harry Potter, the character of Sirius Black is Harry's GOD father.

[Trek_Girl42]

*sigh* Whatever.

I'm not a big fan of the Catholic church at all, but I'm not at the other extreme either. Religion has its place, but I'm more about the personal spirituality aspect than anything else. Religion itself is hollow, it is only the spiritual connection that people make and whatever enlightenment they can gain from it that really matters.

My point is, don't bash the spiritual faith of people, or your just as guilty as those who would force their religion on you. Some people actually have good reason for believing in some sort of deity. I am as strong a follower of science as anyone, yet I don't allow it to blind me to the greater realities of what may be beyond. I believe in science. I also believe in God. My definition of God anyways. Not necessarily yours. In either case, I have my reasons for believing in a reality beyond this one. I wouldn't be so arrogant as to claim to know exactly what that looks like, but I believe it is there.

Does that make me a nut? Oh, well.

Nope, that was a very nice post with some very good points. Wish I could green you but I just did.

[Flyboy]

Nope, that was a very nice post with come very good points. Wish I could green you but I just did.

I'm in agreement.

I think faith can be a wonderful thing, especially when it is YOUR faith. When you believe something truely. If I had proof there was no God (hypothetically speaking), I would destroy that proof. The world needs faith. Unfortunatly, religion is what happens when people believe more in the system than the God.

Why is Harry Potter evil? Because the church says so.

And because the church says so, its followers say so.

What's worse is they BELIEVE it. Just because they've been told it.

That's what I have a problem with.

[sgeureka]

I think faith can be a wonderful thing, especially when it is YOUR faith. When you believe something truely. If I had proof there was no God (hypothetically speaking), I would destroy that proof. The world needs faith.

Ooooh, dangerous grounds. Destroying proof is not much better than making up proof for, say, fictional characters being impersonated by evil beings. (I'm in a light-heartened mood, so never mind. )

Back on topic...

Thank goodness we can choose what we believe in and to whom we're listening. Rev. Gabriele Amorth is definately not one of them. Thanks for the article, FOB. I needed a good laugh.

[Wraith Scientist]

Yeah, faith gets dangerous when it becomes religion

"I believe in God" becomes "I believe God wants me to do x y z"

Imagine a small insular religious community, where the children are told that they must be tortured every weekend, so that their pain can "keep the gates of heaven open" or some such nonsence. The children are taught from birth that if they don't suffer every weekend they will burn in hell for all eternity when they die, and so they go willingly.

Is that right? It's "their choice" isn't it? Or is it? Did they really make that choice, or did others choose for them?

As immhotep said, religion is slavery. If you want to believe in God then good for you, but claiming revelation and transmiting that belief as a religion is IMHO very wrong.

[Arative]

I'm in agreement.

I think faith can be a wonderful thing, especially when it is YOUR faith. When you believe something truely. If I had proof there was no God (hypothetically speaking), I would destroy that proof. The world needs faith. Unfortunatly, religion is what happens when people believe more in the system than the God.

Why is Harry Potter evil? Because the church says so.

And because the church says so, its followers say so.

What's worse is they BELIEVE it. Just because they've been told it.

That's what I have a problem with.

That's the problem inherent in any organized religion. Its not the word of a God but the word of the people in charge. Just take a look at the differences between the different sects of christianity. Here is one example, One sect will say that God hates gays because the preacher in charge said that God told him so, another sect will say that God loves everyone and welcomes everyone because the preacher said that God told him so. So who has God on their side? Why would God tell people two different things?

This is why I believe that organized religion is nothing more than the prejudices of its followers and not the word of God. Its why I believe that organized religion is the greatest evil ever created by humans. Don't get me wrong, I believe faith is important. I have faith there is a supreme being but I look to reason and science to my answers. Its when faith is used to control people is where the evil begins.

As far as Harry Potter, everyone knows that Harry is going to commit suicide in the last book, thereby making a generation of children that grew up reading the books commit suicide!!!

All right, just kidding there, seriously, its just a book that is meant to entertain, nothing more. What this guy was attempting to do was cash in on the books popularity to bring to light his message of hate and control.

[Kyle]

I wholeheartidly agree with the Chief Exorcist on this point of the love child of Satan, Harry Potter. One fictional character gives birth to another

And they say that the Bible is God's holy book, and contains everything he would want. But who wrote it, many different men, who could use it as an excuse to make their beliefs very high on the agenda.

[jesserella]

i agree with a lot of what is being said here, faith is good it gives people hope and whatnot, but religion seems to stop people from thinking for themselves,

TrustNo1
i feel very sorry for you, you must have been very indoctranated to think that way, its a shame, but in my opinion you are wrong, my 10 year old sister loves harry potter, and yet stangly enough she is a very smart imaginative and creative person, why if you have so much faith can't you put it in the child, or the parents for that matter, harry potter is a fictional book, which allows children to believe in wonderful things, so if you believe that is evil and satanic, then what about disney
Cinderella
beaty and the beast
peter pan
to follow your logic all of these things must be evil and thus lead to tattoes and prostitution,
i truly hope you were joking because i'm sorry to say that what you said is laughable,

this is just my opinion and i'm sorry if i'm bashing yours i really don't mean to upset anyone, i'd just like to show you another point of view

[Exiled Master]

After reading that article, I must put Pope Benedict XVI on notice.

[Flyboy]

After reading that article, I must put Pope Benedict XVI on notice.

?

[Exiled Master]

?

Colbert Report reference. Initially, I thought that Benedict would be inferior as pope compared to John Paul II, but this tells me he will be very much so [inferior]. Also, Benedict is pretty scary looking.

[TrustNo1]

But it is difficult to see a point when you have jumped from 'reading Harry Potter' to 'a life of prostitution'.

Obviously not everyone is going to do this but it happens. Hang around Flinders Street and meet the Wiccans there and you will see why I said it.

Maybe the Church should focus more on more important issues like faith, rather than a ficitional story? But this is all just my opinion (and I am rather biased - I love the Harry Potter series)

The problem isn't with the story, it's the messages behind it and the dark ideas it has.

Another edit: The last part... WTF? JK Rowling. That just seems like a petty insult to me.

I was watching some teen choice award and they were doing an interview with her. She sat there, she looked like she was stoned. She gave one word answers to this kid who was excited to meet her. If she was such a great lady then maybe she should grow a personality and stop taking drugs.

If you're going to ban your kids from Harry Potter because magic is a product of Satan, then you may as well ban them from Shrek, pretty much every fairy tale ever written, including a massive number of Disney movies, every other fantasy book written (otherwise banning them from Harry Potter would be biased to senselessness, just because it's popular), etc. Wow, suddenly your kid knows nothing but the horrors of this world. If your kid even knows anything about this world.....

Yes there are some hardcore Christians that do and they're kids turn out ok. Kids will still imagine, why do they need magic and witches to do it? Did you see the last Harry Potter? He cut his arm off and blood squirted everywhere. Do you really want your children seeing that? You call Christians bad because they shield them from this kind of stuff

The only reason witchcraft is suppoedly satanic is becuase it was the rival religion when Christianity came to these shores. Its much easier to say "Dont follow them! Theyre with the DEVIL!" than to say "oh yeah, theyre ok too, but please follow us."

Magic has been in nearly every continent for as long as history can remember, it's just called different things or done different ways. The people aren't getting this power from God so where else are they getting it? That is why it is evil.

You know witches DON'T believe in Satan?? How's that for you!

They don't have to to be practicing something evil.

You my friend, are an exact representation of those higher up bodies in the Catholic church, you are so extremely into your religion (not faith, religion) that you believe everything told to you by your church without question and would, if told to, probabley chase JK Rowling with torches and pitchforks.

Oh now you're judging me without knowing me? I don't go to church, any religious ideas I decided myself through hours and hours and hours or research and talking to theologians and reading the BIBLE. The direct word of God. Do you know why churces tell people things? Because it's in the bible. That's their job. But let's take a look at the bible incase you don't believe me.

"There shall not be found among you anyone who ...practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. For all who do these things are an abomination to the LORD, and because of these abominations the LORD your God drives them out from before you. You shall be blameless before the LORD your God. For these nations which you will dispossess listened to soothsayers and diviners; but as for you, the LORD your God has not appointed such for you."
Deut. 18:10-14

It doesn't talk about white or dark magic or good or evil magic, it mentions all magic.

This book not only has magic but it has MURDER in it. Do you want your children reading gory murders in a "fantasy" book?

On my final note, can I point out that in Harry Potter, the character of Sirius Black is Harry's GOD father.

Wow that was a waste of time.

Why is Harry Potter evil? Because the church says so.

And because the church says so, its followers say so.

What's worse is they BELIEVE it. Just because they've been told it.

That's what I have a problem with.

Oh yeah and the bible says so too.

Here is one example, One sect will say that God hates gays because the preacher in charge said that God told him so, another sect will say that God loves everyone and welcomes everyone because the preacher said that God told him so. So who has God on their side? Why would God tell people two different things?

That's why we look at the bible.

As far as Harry Potter, everyone knows that Harry is going to commit suicide in the last book, thereby making a generation of children that grew up reading the books commit suicide!!!

It happened in China with the Tamagotchi. The pets died and kids killed themselves because you couldn't reset it. Harry Potter is even more popular than Tamagotchis were so you may be right.

TrustNo1
i feel very sorry for you, you must have been very indoctranated to think that way, its a shame, but in my opinion you are wrong,

Thank God it is just your opinion then.

harry potter is a fictional book, which allows children to believe in wonderful things,

Like murder and dismemberment.

this is just my opinion and i'm sorry if i'm bashing yours

If you're sorry you wouldn't have said it.

[Flyboy]

Where do you get off on the holier than thou routine with the "Wiccans are evil" thing." It's a load of nonsense. The thing about that power being from Satan is in the bible because the MEN who wrote it saw the "power" as a threat to their efforts to impliment control of indiviudals. If people thought they could get power themselves then they wouldnt need to bow before the church.

How DARE you excuse JKR of taking drugs, you have NO evidence of that. That's libel.

As for Murder. Read more fantasy. IT HAPPENS. It happens in real life too. Personally I think the HP books enable children to grasp a better understanding of the real world.

So the bible is the direct word of God then? Contradicts himself a bit doesnt he. It was written by MEN.

I'm guessing you think Evolution is a load of rubbish too?


Educated yourself before you reply again - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wicca

Or is that article evil too?

Honestly, linking wiccans with drugs and prostitrution is propaganda for the sake of it.

[sgeureka]

Disclaimer: TrustNo1, I hope you read the title of this thread (...Don't read if offended easily) and knew what you were getting yourself into...

But it is difficult to see a point when you have jumped from 'reading Harry Potter' to 'a life of prostitution'.

Obviously not everyone is going to do this but it happens. Hang around Flinders Street and meet the Wiccans there and you will see why I said it.

It seems you're saying that if those people [Wiccans] hadn't read Harry Potter, they wouldn't be doing what they're doing. I'd think there are other reasons for that, and it's hard to point the finger in the right direction. I say refusing your children to read HP (what the Chief Exorcist wants) accomplishes N-O-T-H-I-N-G.

The problem isn't with the story, it's the messages behind it and the dark ideas it has.

I was pretty disturbed when I read Revelations some time ago. Think of all the messages and dark ideas there. But I don't see the Pope and Amorth bashing that.

Another edit: The last part... WTF? JK Rowling. That just seems like a petty insult to me.

I was watching some teen choice award and they were doing an interview with her. She sat there, she looked like she was stoned. She gave one word answers to this kid who was excited to meet her. If she was such a great lady then maybe she should grow a personality and stop taking drugs.

Are you sure she was stoned? I haven't seen this award show, so I wouldn't know. Maybe she suffered from stage fright and took tranquilizer? And I don't know what that has to do with evil messages in the HP series, other than her being a spokesperson. wikipedia says about her charity projects For every pound raised, a pound would go towards combatting poverty and social inequality across the globe and Since going on sale in March, 2001, the books have raised £15.7 million ($30 million) for the fund. Yes, she does sound really evil to me.

If you're going to ban your kids from Harry Potter because magic is a product of Satan, then you may as well ban them from Shrek, pretty much every fairy tale ever written, including a massive number of Disney movies, every other fantasy book written (otherwise banning them from Harry Potter would be biased to senselessness, just because it's popular), etc. Wow, suddenly your kid knows nothing but the horrors of this world. If your kid even knows anything about this world.....

Yes there are some hardcore Christians that do and they're kids turn out ok.

Yes there are people who loved HP as a kid, and they turned out ok.

Kids will still imagine, why do they need magic and witches to do it? Did you see the last Harry Potter? He cut his arm off and blood squirted everywhere. Do you really want your children seeing that? You call Christians bad because they shield them from this kind of stuff

Point not taken. In my country, the fourth HP movie was for people 12 years and older, so people watching it should be mature enough. My mother (atheist) was also very careful not to show me movies that weren't approved for my age. No-one is bad for protecting their children, but IMO it's bad when someone says franchise A is the devil himself, and other established franchises that might be as gruesome (like Disney) are okay. You should be as fair as possible, even if you're working with/for the Pope.

This book not only has magic but it has MURDER in it. Do you want your children reading gory murders in a "fantasy" book?

No, I wouldn't. But that's what being a parent means: to check what you're children are doing and how they take it, so that the kids later know what they can bear, and what they can't. Heck, I'm in my mid-twenties, and I won't watch movies for people 18 years or older. I don't need an Exorcist telling me a fictional character is the devil (obviously a lie). Just say it's not suitable for children under 10 years or something because it contains gory scenes.

Big snip, coming to one of your last statements...

As far as Harry Potter, everyone knows that Harry is going to commit suicide in the last book, thereby making a generation of children that grew up reading the books commit suicide!!!

It happened in China with the Tamagotchi. The pets died and kids killed themselves because you couldn't reset it. Harry Potter is even more popular than Tamagotchis were so you may be right.

Are you serious? I know, certainly things like that have happened, which is sad. But here's another example for you: Guess how many (young) people have committed suicide because their crush didn't requite their love. That's exponentially more people than the poor slubs killing themselves for a fantasy book. Does that make love the devil, which has to be compared to Hitler and Stalin? Right, I didn't think so.