Problem with chevron theory

[XToDaZ]

Errors in Daniel's 7 chevron theory !

So, now I have started with nice cute warning. I have found out that the dialing sequence with the 7 chevron seems quite rigged and is not at all like Daniel wanted us to believe.

Let's look



This is our galaxy and we're pretty close to the edge of the galaxy. We are about 28 000 lightyears away from the center of our galaxy. The entire galaxy however is 95 000 lightyears in diameter.
So far, no problem.

Now, I'll give you some distance to the stars that make up stellar systems, as they're seen in the skies and on the stargate.
Sirius : 8.6 lightyears
Aldebaran : 67.7 lightyears
Betelgeuze : 644.8 lightyears
Even the farthest stars visible in the sky are nowhere near enough to travel to any place in this galaxy if you to take the plans Daniel gave us in the movie, stating you need 6 points in space, which make up 3 lines which intersect in 1 point, the point of destination.
Only a few thousand stars are visible in a very clear night, but you can also see a Milky Way belt in the sky, indicating that many billions of stars are way beyond the stars that make up stellar systems.

So, using the official theory as "the one" for gate travel, you wouldn't get very far.

Ofcourse, now I even forgot to mention the fact that stellar systems are not to be defined as one point in space. They're merely a 2-dimensional view we see when look up in the sky. In fact, 2 stars of 1 particular stellar system may be a few tens to hundreds lightyears apart, so that doesn't even make sense either.

Now, even if we were to neglect the previous and say that stellar systems really ARE 1 single point and the farthest point really IS on the other side of the galaxy, still there is problem.
Daniel started with saying that a point in space in defined by 6 other points which make up 3 intersecting lines. The chance how that you can find 6 points in such an huge space, that can make up three lines that really intersect, is minimal to say the least.

[Erik Pasternak]

The ancients are pretty smart, they might have figured out a way.

[XToDaZ]

Now, that's what I call an easy answer, lol

[Jarnin]

The coordinate system in the show is the same system they used in the movie: 6 symbols for intersecting points to determine your destination, and the point of origin to plot a course.
The thing is, in the movie, Abydos was in a totally different galaxy, called the Kalium (sp?) galaxy. In the movie, the constellations were reference points for galaxies, which would intersect on the destination galaxy outside of the Milky Way.

When they began SG-1, they moved Abydos to the Milky Way, which totally borked up the coordinate system. As said above, you can't use constellations as reference points, because they're not actual points in space, but spread out over hundreds of lightyears.
Also, the stars in the constellations only take up about 15% of the Milky Way, so you'd only be able to travel about 7,500 light years away from Earth if you used them as points of reference.

I saw a really good explanation for the symbols on the gate in this post. It basically said that since the gate it millions of years old, the symbols on the stargate can't represent constellations because millions of years ago the stars in those constellations would have been in different positions.
Instead, the nomadic humans used the symbols on the gate to create the constellations.

[TechnoWraith]

I saw a really good explanation for the symbols on the gate in this post. It basically said that since the gate it millions of years old, the symbols on the stargate can't represent constellations because millions of years ago the stars in those constellations would have been in different positions.
Instead, the nomadic humans used the symbols on the gate to create the constellations.

According to the GateWorld Omnipedia (Technology, DHD), the entire gate network undergoes a Correlative Update program that takes interstellar drift into account. Gate DHD's dial surrounding DHD's and transmit revised coordinate data as their positions change due to the drift. This keeps the entire gate network intact. So even though the stars in a constellation drift, the gates will still function. Therefore the symbols on the gate are still correct, even though the stars in each symbols constellation keep moving relative to Earth's position.

[Uncle Bob]

....or lack of funds or initiative to hire consultants on the subject.

The stuff that Jackson talks in the movie about the necessity of 3 lines and 6 points to define a point is all load of crap. You only need 3 coordinate points (x,y,z) to define a point in 3-d space. Period.

If you wanna talk about multi-dimensional space, then you take into account the "derivatives of infinitesimal momenta", which are not distance-dependent parameters.

But the idea of worm-whole travel is NOT a scientific impossibility, unlike, for example, time travel.

[Jarnin]

....or lack of funds or initiative to hire consultants on the subject.

The stuff that Jackson talks in the movie about the necessity of 3 lines and 6 points to define a point is all load of crap. You only need 3 coordinate points (x,y,z) to define a point in 3-d space. Period.

If you wanna talk about multi-dimensional space, then you take into account the "derivatives of infinitesimal momenta", which are not distance-dependent parameters.

Bravo!

But the idea of worm-whole travel is NOT a scientific impossibility, unlike, for example, time travel.

Time travel is totally possible. We're all traveling into the future right now at a rate of 1 second per second!

Oh, you meant travel backwards in time...

Anyway, if in the future we can use wormholes to travel from one point ot another, then we'll have effectively built a time machine.

Take one end of the wormhole and put it on a ship traveling away from Earth at the speed of light for 10 years. Leave the other end in orbit around earth. When the ship with the wormhole returns, you'll have yourself a time machine that takes you back in time in one end, and sends you to the future in the other.

Time dilation is a pain in the buttocks, but it's good for some things.

[Uncle Bob]

Time dilation and length contraction are hinged on a little bit different premices. Besides, time dilation is compensated by length contraction. It is explained rather straight-forwardly with a "twin" paradox, for example. And no, "inter"-time travel is not possible, just like sec/sec is not a rate.

[lantesh]

dont dought the ancients

[Manic]

The stuff that Jackson talks in the movie about the necessity of 3 lines and 6 points to define a point is all load of crap. You only need 3 coordinate points (x,y,z) to define a point in 3-d space. Period.

I thought about that once, but I figured the Ancients used a system of math similar to ours, but not entirely like ours. We indicate points on a 3 dimensional map with (x,y,z), but what if the Ancients (for some odd reason) needed 3 additional points to differentiate the negatives and the positives? Then they'd need 6 points for (x,-x,y,-y,z,-z). You'd have a symbol to determine the 'x' point, a symbol to say whether or not the '-x' point was used or moot, a symbol for 'y', a symbol of a used/inactive '-y', ect. It could be a way of double-checking their coordinates. It would also allow for a much larger network, as you can create more gate addresses with 38 symbols using 6 digits, than 3 digits.

[Uncle Bob]

That may indeed be so. However, personally, I would not even bother trying to decipher something that was made-up by some mathematically challenged producers....errr....ancients, and is therefore plain wrong.