Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix
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Originally posted by adam4evelyn View Postsorry now i may be wrong but im just going to throw this out here ............wasn't that meant to be a sort of meeting ground........not an actual database . but a way for them to communicate with each other in the simplest form ??? correct me if im wrong
I didn't actually say it was a database though, what I meant when I wrote that post was their may have been a copy of that text (the Universal language and what it would mean in Asgard that could be translated into any other languages the Asgard were fluent in) within the Asgard knowledge base that they gave us in the episode Unending, as there was supposed to be a copy of their entire recorded history in that device.
I think Earnest said "turn the page" to Daniel so I get the feeling that it's meant to be used like a book and represents the atomic make-up of various different objects that are contained within the Universe that the races would be aware of to be used to create a common thing they would, or could understand.
But it had to mean something, so perhaps it contained the 'dialogue' of each meeting and things that they all talked about in that Universal language amongst their discussions there must have been some juicy information that Earth could use other than the advanced Asgard tech, perhaps things the Asgard didn't consider to be of interest to them.
Hopefully that makes sense now.Last edited by Rise Of The Phoenix; 29 November 2008, 03:35 PM.
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Keep in mind that Western Civilization, the pinnacle of Earth's current technological and social abilities, is only a a few thousand years old.
The Asgard are obviously much older than 100,000 years, just as we are older than 2,500 to 3,000 years.
So basically, while humans are 200,000 years old or so, Western culture is only a few thousand. So the Asgard could be 200,000 years old as well, or 300,000. Who knows.
But they wouldn't have to be that much older than us to get to their current state of technology. Can you imagine Earth's technology in 10,000 years? Which is a very short span of time in the grand scheme of things.
It's quite possible that the Asgard existed much as we do on Earth today, and define the beginning of their civilization as when they banded together or something. War was stopped, cooperation and technological progress were pursued, etc.
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Originally posted by Finger13 View PostKeep in mind that Western Civilization, the pinnacle of Earth's current technological and social abilities, is only a a few thousand years old.
The Asgard are obviously much older than 100,000 years, just as we are older than 2,500 to 3,000 years.
So basically, while humans are 200,000 years old or so, Western culture is only a few thousand. So the Asgard could be 200,000 years old as well, or 300,000. Who knows.
But they wouldn't have to be that much older than us to get to their current state of technology. Can you imagine Earth's technology in 10,000 years? Which is a very short span of time in the grand scheme of things.
It's quite possible that the Asgard existed much as we do on Earth today, and define the beginning of their civilization as when they banded together or something. War was stopped, cooperation and technological progress were pursued, etc.
Everything you've said here makes perfect sense to me especially the last part of your post.
With regards to the "Can you imagine Earth's technology in 10,000 years?" part, I'd bet as long as we don't destroy ourselves with some dodgy experiments/technology or some terrorist cell group doesn't wipe us all out, then in 10,000 years provided that the Universal laws allow it we may have technologies and gizmos that science fiction can't even think of today.
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Originally posted by SupremeCommanderSora View PostThis is wrong, the lost tribe was formed so that they could work on their cloning problem without distractions and the cloning problem only became a problem 10,000 years ago and 30,000 years ago they had their first bodies.
So why would the lost tribe be formed 100,000 years ago to work on a cloning problem that they did not have or knew they would have?
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Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View PostI recently re-watched the episode you're referring to and it was The Torment of Tantalus (cool episode), Daniel seemed to think that each race played a part in creating that universal language, perhaps there's a copy of it in the Asgard knowledge base, I'd love to know what that thing said, even if I didn't understand a word of it.
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Originally posted by AncientWorshipper View PostI havn't seen that episode in a while but wasn't the 'universal language' a holographic periodic table, basically the elements?
I'm sure being that he was an archeologist and not a chemist, if the device in question was just a small catalog of 146 basic elements then he wouldn't have been quite so interested in it, plus Earnest had been able to study it for like 50 odd years and he said he'd tried to understand it, which he wouldn't really need to if it was just a list of elements.
My point is I think it had a much bigger meaning than just being a list of elements.
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Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View PostCatherine, Daniel and the others in the room during the scene you're talking about did mention I think 146 elements, but Daniel went on to say "how do you insure true Universal communication between different species? you reduce it to the basics common to everyone and everything in the Universe" or something like that.
I'm sure being that he was an archeologist and not a chemist, if the device in question was just a small catalog of 146 basic elements then he wouldn't have been quite so interested in it, plus Earnest had been able to study it for like 50 odd years and he said he'd tried to understand it, which he wouldn't really need to if it was just a list of elements.
My point is I think it had a much bigger meaning than just being a list of elements.
I am saying was the universal language not the elements as from this you could create anything and I literally mean anything as everything is composed from elements.
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Originally posted by AncientWorshipper View PostI did not mean the devise just being a list of the elements although after re-reading what I put I can see why you may have thought I did.
I am saying was the universal language not the elements as from this you could create anything and I literally mean anything as everything is composed from elements.
Well Daniel made the assumption that the language was in the form of elements, but of course there's no other thing that thing could be so he must have been right.
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Originally posted by AncientWorshipper View PostThe only body they could get hold of that was able to reproduce was the one that crashed on the planet in "Revelations". I cannot remember the quote but I'm quite sure Heimdall mentions the body also being a clone but still being able to reproduce sexually, although I may well be wrong.Never, never, never believe any war will be smooth or easy...
... or that any man can measure the tides and hurricanes he will
encounter on the strange journey.
Spoiler:
2 Cor. 10:3-5
3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds; )
5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
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It doesn't really matter to me if 100,000 years from "The Lost Tribe" is exact or not - maybe a few hundred thousand years ago might be when the race actually existed. What it does seem, however, is that the Ancients/Alterans, as a race, existed far earlier than the Asgards, maybe by two orders of magnitude. The Alterans that existed 50 million years ago were already scientifically advanced. Compare this with any reference to Asgard dates, which were always in the thousands or tens of thousands years ago.
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Originally posted by AncientWorshipper View PostThe only body they could get hold of that was able to reproduce was the one that crashed on the planet in "Revelations". I cannot remember the quote but I'm quite sure Heimdall mentions the body also being a clone but still being able to reproduce sexually, although I may well be wrong.
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Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View PostIf the Asgard civilization is 100,000 years old and they only gained faster than light propulsion in the last 30,000 years of their existence (which is a reference to the episode Revelations at the end of season 5 of SG1 from when Heimdall tells carter about her research into their genetic history) there is no way the Alliance could have been formed before the Ancients left for the Pegasus galaxy.
Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View PostIn fact the more likely thing to have happened is that a portion of Ancient's civilization remained in the Milky Way galaxy after setting off the Dakara genesis device and then contact was made with the other members of the Alliance over time.
Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View PostI recently re-watched the episode you're referring to and it was The Torment of Tantalus (cool episode),
Originally posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View PostWith regards to the "Can you imagine Earth's technology in 10,000 years?" part, I'd bet as long as we don't destroy ourselves with some dodgy experiments/technology or some terrorist cell group doesn't wipe us all out, then in 10,000 years provided that the Universal laws allow it we may have technologies and gizmos that science fiction can't even think of today.My timeline of the Ancients here.
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We don't know what kind of technology the Asgard had 30,000 years ago. They had to have had hyperdrive since when that episode was written, we thought that the closest galaxy to the Milky Way was 70,000 lightyears away, and it could barely be considered a galaxy.
We don't know if the 30,000 year old Asgard was a clone, Heimdall only said, "He is from a time before our program of genetic manipulation became irreversible."
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