Build a ZPM

[Spimman]

That's fair enough, I don't need you to agree with me to know it's a possibility that at some point during their war with the Wraith the Ancients could have decided to just share some sensitive info among themselves (at least perhaps among the council members, or in the case of ZPMs with those individuals that were responsible for reproducing them) and wipe the data on how to make them from the database so there's no way it could eventually fall into the wrong hands, namely the Wraith.

Why would we even assume they made the ZPM's in the Pegasus galaxy. Their would have been some major manufacturing type facility to create ZPM's, likely house in the Milky Way or even on Earth.

No way something that complex would have been in their heads, also what about all the parts, pieces and computers used to make it happen?

[Rise Of The Phoenix]

Why would we even assume they made the ZPM's in the Pegasus galaxy. Their would have been some major manufacturing type facility to create ZPM's, likely house in the Milky Way or even on Earth.

Apologies for my (usual) long answers, but I'll let you know what I think:
We know that the Lantians were trying to get away from the Plague in the Milky Way, once they thought Humans and Alterans had been wiped away with the Dakara genesis device they wouldn't really have much to come back for.
There's been no mention of the Ancients returning to the Milky Way before around 10,000 years ago and ZPMs clearly don't last millions of years when being used to constantly power many things.
If all ZPMs that the Ancients possessed were made in the Milky Way they'd have to carry a lot to cover their power needs for the 5 or 10 million years they were in the Pegasus galaxy as well as defending themselves and other Humans from the Wraith.
Merlin had that thing that made the Sangraal, it looked strikingly similar to the repositories so I could see that potentially making the physical ZPMs, although we've never found one, maybe the one in The Quest Part 2 was one the Ancients carted around for making some of their sophisticated technologies or Atlantis has a slightly different looking device somewhere in the city.
As for containing the region of subspace time, it could require a different device, although maybe a part of the actual ZPM facilitates containing the region of subspace to extract vacuum energy from.

No way something that complex would have been in their heads, also what about all the parts, pieces and computers used to make it happen?

Like I said above the thing Merlin used to make the Sangraal could be all that is needed to actually make a ZPM, I believe that the ZPM is simply a gateway to the specific region of subspace from which it draws power, so a device like the Sangraal builder thing could be used to make a new ZPM and then the ZPM does the rest, provided it's pieced together in the right way.

[Quadhelix]

i mean ZPMs to the ancients were just a power source theyve used for millions of years, and although they were inportant, yes, but not so inprotant that they memorized exactly how to make them and deleted everything on them from the database.

Actually, I look at it the exact opposite: ZPMs were "just a power source," so there was no reason to record specific instructions on how to build them in the Database: those who needed to know how to build a ZPM would know from vocational training, rather than from looking it up.

i mean what would be the purpose of a repository that overloaded your mind with unneeded information about how many screws are in the chairs that are typically used in the mess hall or the type of bulb the lamps in the halls take.

There is also the possibility that an actual Ancient would be able to handle the entire contents of a Repository without difficulty.

No way something that complex would have been in their heads, also what about all the parts, pieces and computers used to make it happen?

Well, the fact that the Repository of the Ancients' Knowledge was designed to upload its entire contents into a person's head would seem to indicate that individual Ancients could handle that much information easily.

[stargater1990]

Actually, I look at it the exact opposite: ZPMs were "just a power source," so there was no reason to record specific instructions on how to build them in the Database: those who needed to know how to build a ZPM would know from vocational training, rather than from looking it up.


There is also the possibility that an actual Ancient would be able to handle the entire contents of a Repository without difficulty.


Well, the fact that the Repository of the Ancients' Knowledge was designed to upload its entire contents into a person's head would seem to indicate that individual Ancients could handle that much information easily.

yeah but today info on how to lets say wire a house is proboly online somewhere but it is proboly just taught to the electricion wireing the house so why put it online or in books? because what if there was an explosion in the ZPM lab and all the people who knew how to make ZPMs were killed, more people intrested in that field would look in the database and read up on ZPM technology and how to make them and start building ZPMs or in my example, wire a house.

[delta1135]

Sorry If this has been stated already, but I didn't feel like reading the multitude of ridiculously long posts to see if this had been posted.

Anyway, I believe on page 2 somebody said that there was probably a ZPM lab where they made ZPMs. If this is so, why were they such a rare commodity. If Atlantis can just churn them out why are there so few? And If the city had a ZPM room you would think that the ZPMs would be created when instructed to or when one of the Atlantis ZPMs ran low. And If this is so, you would think that there would be a machine that would put the new ZPM into the ZPM console. It seems inefficient to have somebody run down to the ZPM maker then run all the way to the ZPM room and stuff it into the little socket. And If they did have a room that made them, why don't they have spares? Throughout the entire series I think we have actually only seen 9 ZPMs with power, That's 1 Atlantis had at the beginning, 1 they found in 'Childhoods End' another in 'The Brotherhood' 3 Fresh ones when the replicators took over the city. And the 2 that Todd gave Atlantis in the last episode. We knew that there was one on the super hive but we never saw it. So ok 10. If they had a lab that churned them out. Where are they?

(Sorry I got carried away)

[Rise Of The Phoenix]

Actually, I look at it the exact opposite: ZPMs were "just a power source," so there was no reason to record specific instructions on how to build them in the Database: those who needed to know how to build a ZPM would know from vocational training, rather than from looking it up.

I agree, I mean there were probably quite a few Ancient people who knew about the process, maybe any educational info on ZPMs was just kept on isolated computers if it was stored anywhere other than by person.

There is also the possibility that an actual Ancient would be able to handle the entire contents of a Repository without difficulty.

Exactly I mean they built the repositories to transfer everything they knew presumably into less advanced beings than themselves, if the Ancient's legacy was meant for us (humans in general) then there's no way they'd make it for beings that are more advanced in evolutionary terms than them.

Well, the fact that the Repository of the Ancients' Knowledge was designed to upload its entire contents into a person's head would seem to indicate that individual Ancients could handle that much information easily.

Precisely.
I was gonna green you but apparently I've gotta pass it around a bit.

Sorry If this has been stated already, but I didn't feel like reading the multitude of ridiculously long posts to see if this had been posted.

Anyway, I believe on page 2 somebody said that there was probably a ZPM lab where they made ZPMs. If this is so, why were they such a rare commodity.

You may be referring to one of my posts, I think the Ancients would just make as many ZPMs as they would need, the same goes for the Asurans as they must have had the same capability.
Since we now need more and the Ancients only made enough to suit their needs they wouldn't be thinking about replacing the ones we now need to power their tech and boost our own.

If Atlantis can just churn them out why are there so few?

It's probably a matter of needs and what we've found is all that was around 10,000 years ago, since the Ancients weren't gonna continue to fight to their deaths they had no need to make more.

And If the city had a ZPM room you would think that the ZPMs would be created when instructed to or when one of the Atlantis ZPMs ran low. And If this is so, you would think that there would be a machine that would put the new ZPM into the ZPM console. It seems inefficient to have somebody run down to the ZPM maker then run all the way to the ZPM room and stuff it into the little socket. And If they did have a room that made them, why don't they have spares? Throughout the entire series I think we have actually only seen 9 ZPMs with power, That's 1 Atlantis had at the beginning, 1 they found in 'Childhoods End' another in 'The Brotherhood' 3 Fresh ones when the replicators took over the city. And the 2 that Todd gave Atlantis in the last episode. We knew that there was one on the super hive but we never saw it. So ok 10. If they had a lab that churned them out. Where are they?

(Sorry I got carried away)

Above all I think the lack of masses of Ancient ZPMs is down to the Wraith, I mean it's not all that far fetched to think that the Ancients knew the Wraith had captured some of their ships and were using their ZPMs to grow their numbers.
If the Ancients hadn't returned by the time the city's shield had failed then they would have no need of it, leaving it producing ZPMs until the universe ends seems unnecessary too me.

If the Wraith like The Lost Tribe managed to figure out a way to pass through Ancient city ship shields and Atlantis was constantly making ZPMs or had a whole bunch of spares then the Wraith would have an unlimited source of energy for their tech.

What I'm saying is a lack of automatic ZPM manufacturing is probably just a safety measure, or the Ancients simply didn't think to make the city that way.

BTW welcome to Gateworld have some green.

[Ukko]

My two cents
If there was some kind of ZPM lab, im sure Janus would have told Dr Weir when he left her to take care of the city. Or he would have left some behind for the expedition to find in atlantis, she did explain how important they were. Insted he gave her some gate adresses to planets were they had left some.
If they could just churn them out, why not make thousands to power there ships to a nearly indestructable level and destroy the wraith.
I think ZPMs were actualy pretty rare or realy difficult to make even for the ancients. The weapon on Dakara must have needed massive amounts of power yet it still mannaged to fire.
The first time we saw the ancient headsucker it was in a room that must have been getting power for thousands of years.
I think they must have had some other kind of power generating tech just as good or mabye better.
But the idea of making them the same way merlin made the sangral is a good one i think.

[ggf31416]

I think the reason there are so few ZPM is that is was difficult to the ancients to make one. If you are in a total war like the ancients against the wraith you want to give your ships all the advantages against the enemy.
If you can make ZPM easily then just give every Aurora multiple ZPM and make many, not as efficient as posible but cheap (in resources and time to build), energy weapons to use them.
Wraiths stealing the ZPMs are not a problem as they could make the ship self-destruct (and detonate several small nuclear weapons next to the ZPMs) if a wraith comes close to the ZPM.

[delta1135]

Wraiths stealing the ZPMs are not a problem as they could make the ship self-destruct (and detonate several small nuclear weapons next to the ZPMs) if a wraith comes close to the ZPM.

Do you realize how big of an explosion that would be? The trust tried to blow up Atlantis by doing something similar. Like in Critical Mass. And that was only ONE ZPM.

BTW, My posts are being moderated, is that because I'm new? It's Irritating.

[Ukko]

Do you realize how big of an explosion that would be? The trust tried to blow up Atlantis by doing something similar. Like in Critical Mass. And that was only ONE ZPM.

BTW, My posts are being moderated, is that because I'm new? It's Irritating.

Mine are aswell, its cos we are new

[stargater1990]

I think the reason there are so few ZPM is that is was difficult to the ancients to make one. If you are in a total war like the ancients against the wraith you want to give your ships all the advantages against the enemy.
If you can make ZPM easily then just give every Aurora multiple ZPM and make many, not as efficient as posible but cheap (in resources and time to build), energy weapons to use them.
Wraiths stealing the ZPMs are not a problem as they could make the ship self-destruct (and detonate several small nuclear weapons next to the ZPMs) if a wraith comes close to the ZPM.

actually i think that they could make ZPMs easily. i mean theres nothing to indicate a shortage of ZPMs back then, they are only rare now, which if you think about it they havent been made in 10000 years so thats to be expected.

and my guess as to why they only put 1 ZPM on each aurora was because 1 ZPM was all that was nessisary to make it as strong as it was designed to be. afterall, why use 2 or 3 when they arent really being used.