wormholes, blackholes, projecting gravity, time dilation and quantum gravity

[aschen]

I'm curious why the black hole caused the event horizon to be dragged backwards like during the initial vortex.

The event horizon is basically a contained are of energy, where matter is dematerialized and rematerialized, right? In real science, we have already bent light using gravity. Light is nothing more than a certain KIND of energy, so would an event horizon really be that far of a stretch?

also why they chose (and could plausibly claim) that time dilations could happen in advance of gravity fields?

It's science ficiton.

and how mass on the other side of a wormhole could transmit gravity across it? we never saw such fascinating subject treated again on the show.

Thus far we have seen someone jumping through the stargate and retaining their velocity, yes? Who's to say gravity is so different?

[terraatlantus]

The event horizon is basically a contained are of energy, where matter is dematerialized and rematerialized, right? In real science, we have already bent light using gravity. Light is nothing more than a certain KIND of energy, so would an event horizon really be that far of a stretch?


It's science ficiton.


Thus far we have seen someone jumping through the stargate and retaining their velocity, yes? Who's to say gravity is so different?

but the event horizon would project the gravitons away from it would it not? so would not the event horizon be dragged towards the control room?

[_Owen_]

the blackhole pulled the event horizon back because blackholes suck everything in, matter, light, all forms of energy, the event horizon is energy, it has been proven that time dialates inside black holes, and the gravity was transmitted through the gate because it was transmited through the wormhole like energy

[Hywel]

- there would be no desintegration going on

That's what I thought - think Star Trek DS9. But when I thought about it, isn't it possible that the Ancients made the design choice to have the Stargate disintigrate you into energy in order to transmit it? Maybe this would mean the wormhole rquires much less energy, as it would only need to be big enough to transmit energy through it, as opposed to whole objects. So it's the Stargate device itself that disintigrates you, not the fact you're travelling through a wormhole.

[_Owen_]

That's what I thought - think Star Trek DS9. But when I thought about it, isn't it possible that the Ancients made the design choice to have the Stargate disintigrate you into energy in order to transmit it? Maybe this would mean the wormhole rquires much less energy, as it would only need to be big enough to transmit energy through it, as opposed to whole objects. So it's the Stargate device itself that disintigrates you, not the fact you're travelling through a wormhole.

the wormhole in ds9 is a natural wormhole, it is true that with a natural wormhole you would not dematerialize because the event horizon on a natural wormhole is just basically the door into the wormhole, on the stargate the event horizon dematrerializes you sothat you can travel through it without a ship, you are dematerialized so that you are not exposed to the effects of the vacum of space, and can travel at greater speeds as energy

[gatebuster64]

Well the event horizon is a mass and since black holes have enormous gravity, it could attract the event horizon towards it.



In theory the wormhole could've transmitted gravitons which would've caused an increase in gravity, this would be the most likely answer if it wasn't for the fact that gravitons are still to be proven to exist. But I guess in Stargate they just exist

if gravity were to pull the event horizon then it would be pulled through the wormhole, not to the back of the room. in order to figure out why the time dilation preceeds the gravity you first need to know why gravity dilates time.

for those who want to know the ratio between amount that time is dilated and gravity it is: R=square root(1-[2GM/(RC^2)]) where R is the ratio of dilated time to standard time, G is the gravitational constant, M is the mass of the body distorting time, R is the distance from that body, and C is the speed of light

p.s. to this date i don't know why gravity distorts time but i'm working on it

[gatebuster64]

did my previous post scare everyone from this thread?

[Jimbo-DR]

Well, the only reason I can think of is just Stargate physics ... those are just unreal
If wormwholes would exist in real life :
- they would be transparent in the first place (you should see through them to the other side)
- they wouldn't travel in the third dimension, but would use a double fourth dimensional drag and drop effect.
- there would be no desintegration going on
- they'd be 2-way

Stargate chose to have a blue one-way wormhole to make it easier to write stories. Otherwisely the exploring would be unnecessary, they could be killed without stepping through instantly while dialing odd worlds because of poison, heat, radiation and so on.
That vortex thing spinning backwards was just meant to give a visual effect of the gravitational field going through the stargate, so that viewers kan see it's coming through. The show dismisses the fact that the space behind the event horizon has nothing to do with the wormhole, and therefore it's very odd that the event horizon would be pulled backwards ... as there is nothing but air behind it.

Why the time dillations advanced the gravitational field ? Well, it's a nice addy to the show, isn't ? I could not imagine how that would be possible in real time, really.

Wormholes are so far beyond our science that you could only be speculating as much as anyone else on here is. You can't possibly no for sure anything about wormholes or we would be much farther along to creating one than we are right now.

[Jarnin]

You can't possibly no for sure anything about wormholes or we would be much farther along to creating one than we are right now.

You apparently don't understand the difference between research and applied science. Research figures out how something occurs. Applied science tries to make that occurance happen when we want it to.

We know how to make wormholes; the problem isn't knowing how, the problem is the coming up with the ingredients you need in order to make one.

Wormholes are thought to occur naturally in the universe, but they don't stay open for very long; basically they close up right after they form. In order to keep one 'open', you'd have to offset the wormhole's tendacy to slam shut, and the only way known to do that is by pumping something called 'negative mass' into it. We don't even know if there is such a thing as negative mass at this point in time, as it's never been observed.

The funny thing is that if negative mass exists, then we could make things like inertial dampeners. Because negative mass would offset mass, if you have a ship that has a mass of 1 million metric tons, and you add 1 million metric tons of negative mass, your ship would have an average mass of zero. That means you could accelerate to the speed of light, which is currently impossible for anything that has mass.

[SG-1ssm]

True... that was pure sci fi and i loved it!! Great ep!!unfortunatley, i failed physics in high school so i can't give you any comments or speculation on that part. My brain hurts now from just reading that post!!

I will go find some science peeps who might be able to help you...... i know theres some floating around here somewhere....

Forunitally, I got an A in physics, and might be able to shed some light on the situation.

I'm guessing the time dialation might might accually be for if you were being sucked into the blackhole, and as you go faster and faster time (from your perspective) slows down.

And the black hole its self has a lot of mass, and that's what makes the gavity that pulls you in.

[gatebuster64]

Forunitally, I got an A in physics, and might be able to shed some light on the situation.

I'm guessing the time dialation might might accually be for if you were being sucked into the blackhole, and as you go faster and faster time (from your perspective) slows down.

And the black hole its self has a lot of mass, and that's what makes the gavity that pulls you in.

atomic clocks ran slower at sea level than at mountain peaks and they were stationary in respect to Earth

The Laws of Thermodynamics are like a game. Here are the rules.
1. You can't win
2. You can't break even
3. You can't quit

I've read that in a book sometime ago:
1. matter can't be created from nothing so no net profit
2. entropy in the universe always increases so you always lose
3. absolute zero can't be reached, if it could you wouldn't have to wory about entropy

[Avatar28]

Okay, a couple of points.

The reason the ancients chose to go with the method they did for the stargates, de/rematerialization, is because the wormhole is most likely microscopic in size. In order to have a wormhole actually big enough to transmit something you would need an insane amount of energy and a gate the size of the earth's orbit or something. Talk about your super gates! It may not have been quite that big, but it was really REALLY big. By using a microscopic wormhole the ancients can send the energy through along with your pattern and just reconstruct it on the other end.

[wanderingbynight]

I was listening to an article on the radio today (well, now yesterday i guess) and they were talking about a star and a black hole that are orbiting eachother and why the black hole didn't eat the star. Apparently it was recently discovered that blackholes have a magnetic field (magnets!) that draws some matter towards them so it isn't just gravity alone. This is why some gases were drawn into the hole and some weren't.

I don't really know if this answers anything on this thread and I'm so tired right now i can't tell if it makes any sense the way i typed it up , but i just thought it was intiresting. If this looks like giberish in the morning I'll edit.