Stupid n00b question-Hyperspace

[ibwolf]

If you think that is good... There is another scientist who and I jest you not, has built/building a real life time machine. Apparently it uses a theory of special relativity to warp space and time into a vortex that allows a stream of electrons to be sent into the past.

The machine uses a matrix of lasers to deform space-time, now while these lasers are one, which is estimated to be for 150 years, you can send a sign "electrons" back through time from another point in time when the machine exists. This only works between the time the machine was front actived to the day it is switched off. So someone in 2145 could sent a signal in a stream of electrons to the guy in 2005 telling him of something important that is going to happen in the next few years.

What my concern is that though the guy says that isn't possible, that someone in a few years will find a way to do it and use the machine as a probability engine to re-shape the future to their liking. Just imagine if Pres. Bush got hold of it and found out that China was going to invade Taiwan and then continue onto a global conquest. Sometimes it is better not to know! :/

There is actually a very good book by James P. Hogan called Thrice upon a Time that has a machine just like that as its center plot piece. Very good read. Amazon

[Croatoan]

The Asgard are from the Galaxy of Ida, so I think it is a few million more lightyears away.

I also wondered about hyperspace speeds. My figuring of it relates it to internal combustion engines. The faster you go the faster you consume fuel. The Goauld/Asgard ships are probably very very fast, but when you have to go long distance you have to slow down as not to consume all your fuel.

Basically its a consumption rates problem. Even with a super power source you are still likely to deplete it over time. The Asgard obviously have a very powerful power plant that is meant for short intergalactic hyper fast trips, but it is unlikely that they could maintain those speed if they travelled to say Pegasus. In fact their engines might not be able to travel that far without consuming all of their fuel.

Its all well and good having a v8 engine, its FAST, but definitely not built for distance. The Asgard probably developed their engines purposely to make fast trips into our galaxy, which requires a short inter-galactic range but at incredible speeds. Even if well a fully fueled ship I doubt the Asgard could zip over to Pegasus even at the a slower pace without depleting the tanks so to speak.

I think the modifications that O'neill made to the Cargo ship were designed to remove the speed cap from the engines to allow it to pull in more power and therefore travel faster. The side effect being that it would damage the engines very quickly or deplete the powerplant in a very short time.

The cargo ship made a sprint across the galaxy and then to another galaxy. In a few days at hyperspeeds it wasted the engines completely. I think the Goauld are probably capable of travelling to other galaxies but don't see a need too. Plus any ship they would send would require quite a lot of spare parts and modifications to insure the ship survived long enough to get to another galaxy. The Mothership that Jacob,Carter,Sam,Jack,Daniel were on when they blow up the sun which carely capable of trans-galactic travel, but at a pace. This pace makes the travel unappealing to the Goauld. Though they would live long enough to complete the journey their Jaffas wouldn't. Especially a Goauld wouldn't risk it.

Thoughts?

In real world terms your dead on with the realities of science. However, in most explanations I have read regarding faster than light travel or hyperspace in science ficition realm which is undoubtably what this falls under its been explained that "hyperspace" is a deminsion of space and time that doesnt require the principle of consumables as you have layed out. The tollans explained it best with the stick, in the scene from the episode in which we first encouter them.

Hyperspace is about warping the fabric of space so that time and distance are relatively shortened.

Also keep in mind that all power sources we have currently explored as a species. Wood, oil, gasoline, Coal, Hydro-Electric, Wind, etc are all depleatable in that eventually you either run out or dont have access to the materials such as wind or running water to continue producing power. This is because they are inefficient we only get a miniscule amount of energy out for the resources we put in.

In the stargate universe many of the advanced cultures utilize alternate "renewable" or "high efficiency" conversion types of energy. In most cases they propabably get 90% output or even more compared to our 10-15% energy conversion rate with some of our power technologies. A renewable powersource would get 100% efficiency or 99.99% and would enable them to get almost all of what they put in out.

The ancients ZPMs powered the shields on atlantis for several thousand years. Thats several times more powerful than anything we currently poses technologically. I personally chaulk all this up to the fact that we cant even fathom some of the technology behind a majority of the advanced technology we may encounter in a scifi universe mostly because our own science isnt even to the point of understanding the basic principles behind a majority of it.

Sorry for being long winded.

Croatoan

p.s. look up the episode where the tollan are brought to earth the first time. Listen to when the guy that has the hots for sam talks about some of the basic principles of their science when he referes to our science its kinda smug like oh yeah we did that....way back when....kinda like we do when we listen to some of our grandparents stories about early scientific things.

[power_ranger]

It was called "Emigma"; season 1 I think




Danny hands him a notebook. He looks at it, and takes some device off of his arm, and puts it on the ground. He activates it, and it hums, and a light shines up. Danny watches as the light shoots up, and disappears into the starry sky.

JACKSON: Listen, I'm no astronomer, but won't that take thousands of years to reach the Nox world?

OMOC: Why would it?

JACKSON: Well, that's just a laser, right? I mean... light takes a long time to travel that far.

OMOC: (Takes a twig in his hands) The distance between these two points seems far. Until you do this. (He bends the twig to where the ends meet)

JACKSON: OK... OK, I remember this from college physics. One of our scientists, Einstein, explained this the same way. You are talking about actually folding space.

OMOC: No. You wouldn't understand.

JACKSON: No, I guess not. I just hope the Nox do.


How did the Tollan send their message without "folding" space?

[aAnubiSs]

By entering a dimension where time and gravity are the same, but 1km in hyperspace is acctually 1 lightyear(or any other numbers). There's no folding going on there

[jpf190279]

Hyperspace is some lame "plot convenient" means of explaining travel between the stars using a techno-babble word. Hyperspace is technical nothing, it is only used in physics to explain some other spatial dimension that we don't really understand yet.

The Hyperspace in my M-Theory post was used to explain the void outside our universe, in which the multi-verse exists.

P.S.

Energy is depletable regardless... Even zero point energy. Just think about it for one second and it will become evident why.

[aAnubiSs]

ZPE is depletable yes, but it is made into electrons or whatever way they power their stuff.

[jpf190279]

ZPE is depletable yes, but it is made into electrons or whatever way they power their stuff.

Actually I was talking about how it utilises vacuum energy to create energy. Its all to do with the big bang and quantum foam. But the principle I was think about is that if you create a contain 1 meter by 1 meter and trap zero energy inside it. You tap it for energy... The problem is that ZPE is actually a sea of energy that was left over from the formation of the universe, it is called Zero Point Energy because if you remove everything from a given point in space there is still energy. This energy is... well someform of subatomic particle like anything else. Now if you design a device to collect the energy or utilize it to generate power you run the risk of disrupting the particles stopping the effect, or worse if you tap the particles directly, you can transmute it into something other than ZPE at which point you have depleted that source.

Now if you had a ship powered by ZPE you could indeed have a massive power generator but in order to generate power you would have to tap the ZPE, once the has tapped that location you deplete it. But that is nothing to worry about since the sea of energy covers the universe. But you still drp the power level slightly.

Now if 1,000,000 alien races across the universe utilized ZPE to power FTL devices using spatial folding/warp technology, you might start to see ZPE levels in localised areas starting to lower faster than in other parts of the universe, as the sea of energy attempts to balances itself out.

Look its hard to explain.

Think of it as a water planet, and ships sailing on it. Each ship uses a bucket of water every few minutes to power the ship. But the water to transmuted into something different like hydrogen and oxygen... Since its changed it is depleted. If there is a lot of ships and all the ships are doing the same then eventually the planets sea is going to lower.

Now if you are taking in a lot of water from one location at a fast pace you can deform the level of the ocean resulting in the sea rushing in to fill the missing water, this eventually balances out. But it may take a while to do this.

[ColonelWilliams]

If energy can't be created or destroyed, then how could energy be created by something that the laws of physics applies to? ("Big Bang") unless you say that the big bang cannot be explained by science... just a thought

[Jakebbq]

To be able to get unlimited energy one would need a frictionless material... and if I could invent that I'd be the richest man by a few trillion billions.

there is a frictionless meterial originaly made by the chinese called silk you should have heard of it if you rub 2 pieces of silk to gether there is no friction so if u have silk on your bed and wear silk pajamas run and jump on your bed you will slide off

[Rodan5757]

there is a frictionless meterial originaly made by the chinese called silk you should have heard of it if you rub 2 pieces of silk to gether there is no friction so if u have silk on your bed and wear silk pajamas run and jump on your bed you will slide off

Technically in order for that to be completely true you would need to negate the friction caused by gravity, as well as, air. We are not in a frictionless environment, even if the material itself happens to be.

I don't doubt you will slide a bit, but it wouldn't be "cartoon on a banana" slippyness.

[freyr's mother]

What's c?

c is the speed of light constant Its around 6 trillion kps

[freyr's mother]

So what happens when you set of a a-bomb then...wouldn't a lot of energy be "created" and/or released?..

Sorry about my lack of knowledge...the whole science thing ain't my thing...

aren't we getting off topic here btw?...

According to the law of thermodynamics, energy cannot be created or destroyed. The energy was released.

[Lex Reekie]

If energy can't be created or destroyed, then how could energy be created by something that the laws of physics applies to? ("Big Bang") unless you say that the big bang cannot be explained by science... just a thought

Big Bang theory is that everything 'banged' (bigly) from one point, a singularity. And at that singularity the laws of physics wouldn't have applied. We would have to have a better understanding of quantum physics to better explain it.

If you can't grasp the idea of nothing being smaller than a singularity, try my analogy... (I love computer analogys)...

Visualise the universe a a massive JPEG, you can zoom in on it for a while, gradually seeing how each part of the image is made, but eventually u'll zoom so close that you'll see an indivual pixel, you cant see any closer than that single pixel, like a sigularity because nothing could possibly be smaller. But that pixel is made of something too, just like the JPEG was made of pixels, except we dont have a zoom tool that can zoom into pixels yet.
lol sorry i'll stop now.

[Rodan5757]

That was acctually a very good analogy for the Singularity of the Big Bang Theory, I'll have to use that sometime and call it my own.

It is true that the big bang is out of reach as far as modern day sciene is concerned...but so is turning a planet into a sun, or using a black hole to create an interdimensional portal (If you've never seen the episodes, I think that was vague enough). My point is not to say that The Big Bang is a theory that is better placed in sci-fi, rather that sci-fi takes up leaps and boaunds beyond what we are capable of, towards was is possible given the understanding.

I can go into techno-bable galore explaining Reletivity, Thermodynamics, and String Theory..as well as Quantem Mechanics. All of which are required to explain The Big Bang as well as *energy*, which all comes back to explaining Hyper Space...so I'm not too far off topic here. However, unless asked, I won't explain further because it is not neccessarily needed. The Big Bang is a theory, because it has holes that modern day science can not completely prove...nor dis-prove. Many modern day scientific *facts* are in fact theory, with a solid basis, many of which may be modified or completely dropped in the near future. That doesn't mean that they don't apply to our understanding of the universe and all that is out there.

[jebus]

I would like to know what the relativistic effects are of travelling faster than c, as if your velocity is >c then gamma becomes imaginary

also, why do you need continuous energy input to maintain a constant speed when it >c

and why has the ability to travel >c not been exploited to deliberatly go back in time?