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    Originally posted by StevenSavile View Post
    Heya Karen,

    Just to shake it up, I am not entirely sure I consider the 'wrong turn' to be writer's block... sure the brain gets into a tizzy and wonders why it can't make a scene or a section work, but that isn't the same as the inability to set down words on a page that at least have some semblance of skill. I've for sure taken wrong turns, especially before I started outlining more thoroughly. It happens less now. What I'd say you're talking about their is a methodology problem, or a logistics one... you know you need to get from a to b and can't figure out quite how... that's an issue that can be solved in any of many ways...

    I had a classic example of this in shadows... I needed a way legitimately for the SG-1 team to find a single creature on an enormous planet and not waste 100 pages simply looking... so of course I still hadn't actually solved the how's and why's before I actually started writing the scene. For a few days I was forced to go and gah research stuff heh, to make it work. I found my answer, but even during the looking I didn't stop working...

    I think the danger is conflating a lack of planning into something bigger and thus insurmountable. This comes back to Bekah's question (Hi Bekah!) about how do you sit down and START something so huge... for me it was pure ignorance first time out, I had no concept of how hard or easy it would be to write a novel, and sat down and in 14 days wrote a 60,000 word novel (so a short one, but a novel no less... maybe 200 pages). The thing is I don't think of it as writing a novel - 450 pages is daunting, but 450 words isn't. So every morning I will sit down and think about the SCENE I want to write that day. I won't allow the sheer weight of 450 pages to bear down on me all at once but break it down into what is manageable. 450 words or 1000 words, those are manageable by everyone.

    I have found what really helps is taking the time to think the story through.

    Even when I have it outlined, I start my day in this incredibly lazy way (ahem) I go back to bed after breakfast and the daily run of newspapers... I lie there, sans distraction, close my eyes and imagine the scene I am about to write in my head. I'll run it over every which way until I am happy with HOW it will play out. With Stargate I have 4 main characters to play pov with, so I will try it from each to see which I like best, then after about 20 mins of this almost meditative planning for the morning, I will get up and write it.

    Now, it also helps that I have a glorious terrace with a lovely sunshade so in the summer (like now) I can sit on the terrace, listening to life go by, enjoying the sun, drinking an espresso or a chilled water, and just write.

    It's hardly like work at all.
    I think the places I get stuck in the most are transition scenes, when one piece of the plot has been resolved, or they're not in mortal danger for the moment, but will be again soon, or they're just moving from one place to the next.

    But i know what you mean about playing it out in your head. Sometimes it's almost as if the story has a life of its own and I'm just writing what I see in my mind. And about 60 percent of the time, it takes me down a path i wasn't expecting, and I have to change what I was planning on for the next scene.

    Do you guys outline your entire story when you first start out? And how much revision does it get as you go?
    sigpic


    "The men cheered! The women fainted! The children waved multi-colored flags!" -Amanda Tapping

    SG-1 FanFiction
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      Originally posted by Bekah See View Post
      Do you guys outline your entire story when you first start out? And how much revision does it get as you go?
      Well, I am an engineer, so just about everyone would cry foul if I claimed to be entirely free-form about anything. All four of my novels, both coauthored and solo, were pretty carefully outlined from the start. It's practically required when tag-teaming, just to make sure both authors are working toward the same basic picture. Also, I find it's a good way to gauge the flow and pace of the story, and it helps me keep concepts organized in my mind so I don't repeat an expository point (or forget to make the point altogether).

      Does that mean the finished product follows the outline faithfully? In my experience: never. Like you said, Bekah, sometimes a scene will come together in a way I didn't anticipate. Or, like Karen said, we'll realize we've written ourselves into a logical corner and have to rethink. Getting out of those little jams and redirecting the story where it needs to go -- well, I'm not sure I can explain how to do that, exactly, other than to step back and look at the big picture of what needs to happen overall ... and then wait for inspiration to strike your plot-savvy coauthor.

      Oh, and as for being overwhelmed by the magnitude of writing an entire novel? You betcha, especially the first time out. Having a very experienced partner-in-crime helped me out on that front, but I think Steve's got it right: take it a little at a time and focus on each scene. For the record, all four of the Stargate novels I've worked on were between 90,000 and 105,000 words long. After the first two, I wrote a short story for the Stargate magazine and had difficulty cutting it down to 3,000 words. How quickly things change ...

      Hmm, that's thunder outside. I think I'll turn my computer off now before I fry another network card ...
      Beth
      http://www.elizabethchristensen.com
      http://www.stargatenovels.com

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        Originally posted by Elizabeth Christensen View Post
        Well, I am an engineer, so just about everyone would cry foul if I claimed to be entirely free-form about anything. All four of my novels, both coauthored and solo, were pretty carefully outlined from the start. It's practically required when tag-teaming, just to make sure both authors are working toward the same basic picture. Also, I find it's a good way to gauge the flow and pace of the story, and it helps me keep concepts organized in my mind so I don't repeat an expository point (or forget to make the point altogether).

        Does that mean the finished product follows the outline faithfully? In my experience: never. Like you said, Bekah, sometimes a scene will come together in a way I didn't anticipate. Or, like Karen said, we'll realize we've written ourselves into a logical corner and have to rethink. Getting out of those little jams and redirecting the story where it needs to go -- well, I'm not sure I can explain how to do that, exactly, other than to step back and look at the big picture of what needs to happen overall ... and then wait for inspiration to strike your plot-savvy coauthor.

        Oh, and as for being overwhelmed by the magnitude of writing an entire novel? You betcha, especially the first time out. Having a very experienced partner-in-crime helped me out on that front, but I think Steve's got it right: take it a little at a time and focus on each scene. For the record, all four of the Stargate novels I've worked on were between 90,000 and 105,000 words long. After the first two, I wrote a short story for the Stargate magazine and had difficulty cutting it down to 3,000 words. How quickly things change ...

        Hmm, that's thunder outside. I think I'll turn my computer off now before I fry another network card ...
        Great advice! Thanks to all you authors for your wonderful replies. My dream is to finally one day write a children's scifi novel, so all the advice is very encouraging!
        sigpic
        Thank you Astra Per Aspera for the sig....... My Fan Fiction

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          This may have already been answered, and if so just tell me, but I don't want to dig through pages of Q&A yet unless I know for sure the answer's there:

          Anyway, for those of you who have coauthored a novel, how does the collaboration process work? Who does what? Do you take turns writing scenes? Does one author handle certain characters while the other handles the other characters? Etc, etc?

          Steve, Bob and Todd. What chummy guys!

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            Originally posted by Gate Geek View Post
            Hey Sabine!!!!

            Is Mirror Mirror ready??? I'm hell bent on picking up my copy at GateCon! As well as having a drink or three in the bar with ya! SQUEE!
            Hey Gate Geek!

            Just very quickly--I'm at the airport, waiting to board my flight to Denver, and this computer hates me

            So, you'll definitely get a drink or three with me and you'll also get that that copy of Mirror, Mirror. The copies for Gatecon arrived last week, fresh off the press

            See you soon!

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              Wish it was available in the UK...

              Amazon.co.uk are listing it as temporarily out of stock and it's still not available direct through Fandy's website... and they haven't replied to my email asking when it will be.
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                Originally posted by Alipeeps View Post
                Wish it was available in the UK...

                Amazon.co.uk are listing it as temporarily out of stock and it's still not available direct through Fandy's website... and they haven't replied to my email asking when it will be.
                Did you use the email under the contact page on stargatenovels.com? If so, I'm not sure if they monitor that any longer. I emailed them a while back and received no response. It's like the only page they ever update is the main one.
                Steve, Bob and Todd. What chummy guys!

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                  Originally posted by Sabine Bauer View Post
                  Hey Gate Geek!

                  Just very quickly--I'm at the airport, waiting to board my flight to Denver, and this computer hates me

                  So, you'll definitely get a drink or three with me and you'll also get that that copy of Mirror, Mirror. The copies for Gatecon arrived last week, fresh off the press

                  See you soon!

                  SQUEE!!!! Great news! First round is on me!!! Any idea where you'll be setting up shop? I actually get to the hotel on Wednesday afternoon.
                  sigpic

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                    Originally posted by Alipeeps View Post
                    Wish it was available in the UK...

                    Amazon.co.uk are listing it as temporarily out of stock and it's still not available direct through Fandy's website... and they haven't replied to my email asking when it will be.

                    Ali I'd be willing to get ya a copy and mail it to you. Just let me know.
                    sigpic

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                      Originally posted by Gate Geek View Post
                      Ali I'd be willing to get ya a copy and mail it to you. Just let me know.
                      Seriously?! You.... are a STAR!!

                      Will send you an email...
                      sigpic

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                        Originally posted by Alipeeps View Post
                        Seriously?! You.... are a STAR!!

                        Will send you an email...
                        Anything for a friend and fellow whumper! I'll try to get it shipped from Vancouver so you don't have to wait longer than you are already.
                        sigpic

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                          Originally posted by Gate Geek View Post
                          Anything for a friend and fellow whumper! I'll try to get it shipped from Vancouver so you don't have to wait longer than you are already.
                          *hugs and squishes you tight*

                          Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy!

                          *blows raspberries at crummy Amazon*
                          sigpic

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                            Originally posted by A Wraith Named Bob View Post
                            This may have already been answered, and if so just tell me, but I don't want to dig through pages of Q&A yet unless I know for sure the answer's there:

                            Anyway, for those of you who have coauthored a novel, how does the collaboration process work? Who does what? Do you take turns writing scenes? Does one author handle certain characters while the other handles the other characters? Etc, etc?

                            I'm sure there's some discussion of this topic among the 50+ pages of chatter in this thread, but I was only willing to look back through the first half-dozen or so before getting lazy. Thus, here are a couple of tidbits from those first few pages about the approach Sonny and I take. In general, she writes chapter skeletons -- far too developed to be called outlines -- that get us from point A to B to C; I come in behind those and write the specific dialogue and some character bits; and then we bounce each chapter back and forth a few times, tweaking each other's work, until it's in decent shape.

                            Originally posted by sonny1 View Post
                            I think the crucial thing with a partnership is that we both had a clear idea where things were headed in the story, so we could each write sections then email them to each other. Then we’d each re-write the other’s work, which is an incredibly fast way of picking up problems. That requires absolutely no ego and equally, no hesitation to overwrite the other person if something isn’t working. The Chosen is a complex story, and that required some careful set ups at the outset. Certainly two head allowed us to develop this far faster than one.

                            Exogenesis was a little different in that I had the complete story in my head before we started, but Beth took the ball and ran with it, literally to the finish line, using a similar technique of writing, passing it along, and writing over something until it's whupped into shape.
                            Originally posted by Elizabeth Christensen View Post
                            With regard to writing with a partner: Sonny and I have a great setup, because we have complementary strengths. She's a master at devising complex plots and mapping out action sequences, while I focus more on characterization and dialogue. And we have a built-in sanity check for each other's work, which results in a better product when it reaches the editors.
                            To add to this: plot development has gone a little differently for each of the three books we've done together. On The Chosen, I had a general "what if" idea and Sonny really developed the details. For Exo, as she said, she had the whole concept pretty well formed from the start, but the Sheppard story arc in particular was an idea of mine that we wove into the overall plot. As for Blood Ties -- well, that plot was entirely Sonny's baby, so I mostly just did dialogue and tried my best to keep up. Although the Iraq scenes required a fair bit of input from me, or more specifically from my Air Force pals.
                            Beth
                            http://www.elizabethchristensen.com
                            http://www.stargatenovels.com

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                              Oh, almost forgot: while skimming those first couple of pages of the thread, I noticed a comment from Skydiver, one of the moderators, that invited any author/forum-dwellers to PM her in order to get the "Fandemonium Author" tag on their profiles. So, Steve and Karen, there's your ticket -- assuming Karen's given up on resurrecting her old profile and is switching over to Gategusher on a permanent basis ...
                              Beth
                              http://www.elizabethchristensen.com
                              http://www.stargatenovels.com

                              Comment


                                Thanks for the response Beth and the quotes. I guess I should have looked back. Anyway, I think it is interesting how you two collaborate and compliment each other's writing styles. Cool!

                                Steve, Bob and Todd. What chummy guys!

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