simple reason asgard ships are better than lantian ships

[!!??]

1. On point 1. The Ancients are millions of years older than the Asgard. So the extra 10,000 years for the Asgard would be spent trying to catch up. Which they have done a good job of but they're aren't there yet.

I agree with most of your post except this part. The asgard had the database to guide their knowledge. Yes we don't know how much of the database they used but even a small bit of it could speed up their development. If you had a guide to the things you want to know would you ignore it. The asgard had 10,000 years of their lifespan to learn all of the stuff and weren't hindered by teaching new members of their race the science which could increase their development by 100s-1000s of times normal. So i would say that they had an about equivalent chance to come up with their technology. The rest of your post .

[Buba uognarf]

I agree with most of your post except this part. The asgard had the database to guide their knowledge. Yes we don't know how much of the database they used but even a small bit of it could speed up their development. If you had a guide to the things you want to know would you ignore it. The asgard had 10,000 years of their lifespan to learn all of the stuff and weren't hindered by teaching new members of their race the science which could increase their development by 100s-1000s of times normal. So i would say that they had an about equivalent chance to come up with their technology. The rest of your post .

Well I mean I'd say the database is what allowed them to get as far as they have so quickly. They had a start point to develop new technology. But they've only been through a small part of it so it couldn't have been the only factor.

Although IMO alot of the Asgard develop is due to contact with the Ancients.

[!!??]

Well I mean I'd say the database is what allowed them to get as far as they have so quickly. They had a start point to develop new technology. But they've only been through a small part of it so it couldn't have been the only factor.

Although IMO alot of the Asgard develop is due to contact with the Ancients.

Yeah but why not take in to consideration their lifespans. They lived thousands-tens of thousands of years without dieing. Meaning that they don't have to relearn anything they just keep adding on to the knowledge.

[JSPuddlejumper]

Our expectations of the Ancients and reality turned out to be two different things.

I remember watching SG since the mid 1990s.

Season 1 to 7 of SG: Ancients were characterized as being uber smart beings, that built by far the greatest technology in existence and who had no faults.

Reality: Ancients were semi-retarded humans with poor fighting spirit/tactics/abilities, whose technology while very advanced was hardly the best in every single field.

Now imagine Earth humans (second coming of Christ, uhh Ancients), far superior fighting tactics/abilities, and finally we got superior technology to the Ancients (Asgard beams, shields).

Earth humans with far inferior technology was able to defeat the G'ould, with just semi-working Atlantis and pathetic railguns Daedalus gave huge defeats to the Wraith.

Now if the writers wanted to wrap up the Wraith arc: Either build more Daedalus class with Asgard beams, or call in the Ori fleet (should finish off the Wraith in 1 week).

[Buba uognarf]

Yeah but why not take in to consideration their lifespans. They lived thousands-tens of thousands of years without dieing. Meaning that they don't have to relearn anything they just keep adding on to the knowledge.

We don't know how long the Asgard have been around as clones. It may not have been as many as 10,000 years. I never said it was the sole reason for their development, I said it was IMO a major reason.

[Buba uognarf]

Our expectations of the Ancients and reality turned out to be two different things.

I remember watching SG since the mid 1990s.

Season 1 to 7 of SG: Ancients were characterized as being uber smart beings, that built by far the greatest technology in existence and who had no faults.

Reality: Ancients were semi-retarded humans with poor fighting spirit/tactics/abilities, whose technology while very advanced was hardly the best in every single field.

Now imagine Earth humans (second coming of Christ, uhh Ancients), far superior fighting tactics/abilities, and finally we got superior technology to the Ancients (Asgard beams, shields).

Earth humans with far inferior technology was able to defeat the G'ould, with just semi-working Atlantis and pathetic railguns Daedalus gave huge defeats to the Wraith.

Now if the writers wanted to wrap up the Wraith arc: Either build more Daedalus class with Asgard beams, or call in the Ori fleet (should finish off the Wraith in 1 week).

Thats ALL speculation. Not even worth breaking down into smaller points.

[JSPuddlejumper]

Buba, you can't handle the truth.

As the Daedalus class own's more Aurora's (whatever crap Weir is riding on and other Aurora's left over), the point will become even more crystal clear.

[John Caldwell]

Who says they do? (Refering to the raw firepower statement about how shields work) Take Gould shields for example - the low velocity thing? Or when the atoniek armbands happened, the oscillating thing? Drones can bypass some shields but not others? Ion cannons work but all of a sudden Anubis changed a few settings on his shield and they're absolutely useless?

I'd say the evidence is pretty clear that, at least in the case of the Gould, shields and weapons can be adapted to each other.

[JSPuddlejumper]

"Anubis changed a few settings on his shield and they're absolutely useless?"

Obvious plot hole.

Tollans had dozens of those cannons.

[Buba uognarf]

Buba, you can't handle the truth.

As the Daedalus class own's more Aurora's (whatever crap Weir is riding on and other Aurora's left over), the point will become even more crystal clear.

LOL! I can't handle the truth? I've responded to everything you've written with actual evidence from the show. Your whole argument is based on speculation.

Ok I'll give you that both the Asgard beams and shields are very strong and very effective against Aurora's. My point is simply that thats not the best the Ancient s could come up with and their very best would infact own the the Asgard.

And BTW Joe Mallozi said;

PG15 writes: “I thought the Replicator Aurora class ships were kind of weaker than their Lantian cousins in BAMSR. They barely fired any drones and their shields seemed to have come down really fast.”

Answer: Two points - 1. The weapons systems on the Earth ship have been upgraded following the events of Unending. 2. The replicator Aurora-class ships are very good replicas of their original Ancient counterparts. But they are not the originals.

http://josephmallozzi.wordpress.com/...ys-with-dolls/

So there you go ^^^. Asuran Aurora's aren't as good as pure lantian ones.

[!!??]

Hey jspuddlejumper still waiting on your explanation for certain colors=better sheilds.

[John Caldwell]

Your point about specific weaponary would only work if the weapons didn't rely on raw power.

I would argue this point. The Asgard weapons can be installed on the Daedalus and the Apollo, but they only use Naquadah reactors (as far as we know) At the same time, much, much, much more effective than Drone weapons. Again, as far as we know Drone weapons are powered by a ZPM. If power were all that mattered, would you not expect the Drones to be more effective?

It doesn't appear to me to be a large jump to conclude that weapons infact do not rely solely on raw power.

An earth analog would by shaped charges vs. unshaped, or fragmentation grenades vs. simple explosives.

How do you respond to that?

[JSPuddlejumper]

Color coding=better shields was explained quite well by somebody else. If I see the thread I will bump it up.

But as examples: Atlantis shield color, Asuran satellite shield color, Ori shield color, Daedalus class ships, O'Neills. = white (best) or somethimes bluish/white (second best).

Obivously the producer is back tracking to explain the plot holes (massive ones at that). WTH couldn't the Aurora's fire dozens of drones at once? Drone fire from the planet??? No weapons platforms over Asuras???

Explaination: Otherwise the attack would not have succeded. Only way the attack to succeed was: 10+ Daedalus class ships would be needed to shred those Aurora's OR 10+ Ori ships. If they introduced the Ori fleets: Both the Asurans and Wraith would have been destroyed easily.

Does anybody believe that machines are incapable of building other machines? WTH, the Asurans would build Aurora's to strictly to specs (far better than the Ancients could). Hell, if the MW Replicators got hold of a O'Neill, and started building them, they could do better than the Asgard. ETC.

Intelligent machines will always build better machines than their fleshy counterparts. That is simple logic.



Obviously the Ancient Aurora's can't scratch Asgard shield strength. White color=most advanced shields, what don't you get about that? Ancient Aurora's shield color is equivalent to Beslinker class vessles.

If the Ancients were capable of equipping Atlantis like shields to their warships they would have. Obviously they couldn't. The war with the Wraith lasted many many years...


Hopefully, Weir has strapped on a ZPM. Otherwise, that Aurora would truly be pathetic.

[Buba uognarf]

I would argue this point. The Asgard weapons can be installed on the Daedalus and the Apollo, but they only use Naquadah reactors (as far as we know), yet they're much, much, much more effective than Drone weapons. Again, as far as we know, Drone weapons are powered by a ZPM.

How do you respond to that?

Well who says the Asgard beams are much more effective than drones? They're only more effective on single shot.

And puddle jumpers fire drones without a ZPM. I think the ZPM is somehow needed for the control chair.

[!!??]

Color coding=better shields was explained quite well by somebody else. If I see the thread I will bump it up.

But as examples: Atlantis shield color, Asuran satellite shield color, Ori shield color, Daedalus class ships, O'Neills. = white (best) or somethimes bluish/white (second best).

Obivously the producer is back tracking to explain the plot holes (massive ones at that). WTH couldn't the Aurora's fire dozens of drones at once? Drone fire from the planet??? No weapons platforms over Asuras???

Explaination: Otherwise the attack would not have succeded. Only way the attack to succeed was: 10+ Daedalus class ships would be needed to shred those Aurora's OR 10+ Ori ships. If they introduced the Ori fleets: Both the Asurans and Wraith would have been destroyed easily.
Does anybody believe that machines are incapable of building other machines? WTH, the Asurans would build Aurora's to strictly to specs (far better than the Ancients could). Hell, if the MW Replicators got hold of a O'Neill, and started building them, they could do better than the Asgard. ETC.

Intelligent machines will always build better machines than their fleshy counterparts. That is simple logic.



Obviously the Ancient Aurora's can't scratch Asgard shield strength. White color=most advanced shields, what don't you get about that? Ancient Aurora's shield color is equivalent to Beslinker class vessles.

If the Ancients were capable of equipping Atlantis like shields to their warships they would have. Obviously they couldn't. The war with the Wraith lasted many many years...


Hopefully, Weir has strapped on a ZPM. Otherwise, that Aurora would truly be pathetic.

Lol that is all speculation. You have no cannon proof or scientific proof to back up that some colors=better shields. Omg wow most of your posts are speculation and don't even use fact to back them up. Wow i don't even feel like arguing with you unless you have at least scientific backup even though you really need cannon backup.