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    It seems to me that a lot of people on this thread are missing what I believe is the point about Woolsey. You are not supposed to be happy, from an in universe perspective, about Woolsey. At this moment he is the wrong choice. That is what makes him the perfect choice from a out of universe perspective.

    I think it goes back to the perceived problems with Carter this season. From an in universe point of view she was the perfect choice. A brilliant scientist who also had a strong military background. A person with a storied and respected history who either already had the respect of many at Atlantis or would quickly be able to gain it. Heck from a career point of view she had long since been ready to move up the chain of command in the same way Riker was on Next Gen. The problem is from the point of view of writing her into episodes she was almost to perfect. She did not have the fish out of water element that Jack had when he was put in charge. She was used to leading in a variety of situations even if never on this scale. If would have rang false for her to be stumbling or overly uncertain of herself. Nor did she have the untested newcomer vibe that served Landrey so well. If anything she was so well established as a character that trying to change her would have been disastrous. Add into this the fact that she was coming from a show where she usually played a far more active role in the plots. Finally there was also the fact that the writers had to be affected by the uncertainty of her long term role on the show. They basically needed to take a few episodes to build around establishing her a new character arc.But they faced the dilemma of potentially wasting that time if she just going to (justifiably) move on to bigger and better things come the end of the season. Time that could have been spent on characters whose continued role in the show was more certain. I sympathize, if not excuse, with the writers for basically fluctuating as writing her as Elizabeth lite or rehashing SG-1. In many ways there was little else they could do with Carter as commander of Atlantis especially in view of her limited availability.

    Now lets look at Woolsey. Yes he has been a butt of the joke before but I would remind everybody that so was Rodney the first few times we saw him. As a matter of fact I remember reading similar comments being made about him when Atlantis was first announced. I hear Caldwell being thrown around but I do not believe he would work as well. Putting Caldwell in charge would be little different than putting John in charge. At the very least he does not bring the same instant drama that Woolsey does. Think about it. For at least the first few episodes (if not longer) every time a crisis comes up it will be accompanied by a type of tension that has never existed before. Namely is this moment that Woolsey gets us all killed or worse. Sure in the beginning there doubts about if Elizabeth could handle being leader of this experiment of an expedition but nothing like what Woolsey will bring to the table.

    Also there are so many directions they could go with his character. They could go pull an early MASH with the humorous leader who manages to just squeak through when the chips are down in thanks to large part his staff. They could go the McKay way and turn him into the lovable nutbag who at times makes you crazy but is good enough at his job to make putting up with him worth it. They could go the evil jerk route ala Romano from ER where you have a real sob who never seems to get what is coming to him and you actively root for him to die. Heck they could even recreate some of the dynamic from the pilot that existed briefly between Robert Patrick's character and John. Imagine a Woolsey who is not all that impressed with the great John Sheppard and brings in some one to supplement him as the highest ranked military officer on Atlantis. Or they could go someplace else completely. And remember people it is not like it is now writ in stone that Woolsey is charge of Atlantis now and forever. If there is one thing Atlantis has proven, far more than SG-1, the only constant is change. That is actually what I love about this show. The downside of course is that I loose characters I deeply, deeply loved like Carson and Elizabeth (for the record SHE would have been my first choice for new commander . The positive is that we get a show that is more realistic than many of its brethren in the way characters come and go from it.

    Ultimately Woolsey is a character with lots of possibilities who also opens even more possibilities for the dynamic and plot of Stargate Atlantis. I write this as someone who has already seen these writers take characters and situations that might seem less than ideal and make them work. Rodney, Vala, and Landry are proof of that. Maybe this will work. Maybe it wont. I do not know. What I do know is this franchise has for more than decade brought me enjoyment and entertainment. What I know is this is a show I talk about in the same breath as Firefly, Farscape, and DS9. What I know is I love this show. Finally what I know is that sometimes I need to just repeat to myself, "It's just a show,I should really just relax..." Best wishes for all and thanks for the time.

    Comment


      Originally posted by morjana View Post
      It will be interesting to come back in a year from now to read the comments in this thread.
      *bookmarks under "do-not-open-until-April-2009"*

      There, it's a time capsule.

      Originally posted by StorytellerSJK View Post
      It seems to me that a lot of people on this thread are missing what I believe is the point about Woolsey. You are not supposed to be happy, from an in universe perspective, about Woolsey. At this moment he is the wrong choice. That is what makes him the perfect choice from a out of universe perspective.

      I think it goes back to the perceived problems with Carter this season. From an in universe point of view she was the perfect choice. A brilliant scientist who also had a strong military background. A person with a storied and respected history who either already had the respect of many at Atlantis or would quickly be able to gain it. Heck from a career point of view she had long since been ready to move up the chain of command in the same way Riker was on Next Gen. The problem is from the point of view of writing her into episodes she was almost to perfect. She did not have the fish out of water element that Jack had when he was put in charge. She was used to leading in a variety of situations even if never on this scale. If would have rang false for her to be stumbling or overly uncertain of herself. Nor did she have the untested newcomer vibe that served Landrey so well. If anything she was so well established as a character that trying to change her would have been disastrous. Add into this the fact that she was coming from a show where she usually played a far more active role in the plots. Finally there was also the fact that the writers had to be affected by the uncertainty of her long term role on the show. They basically needed to take a few episodes to build around establishing her a new character arc.But they faced the dilemma of potentially wasting that time if she just going to (justifiably) move on to bigger and better things come the end of the season. Time that could have been spent on characters whose continued role in the show was more certain. I sympathize, if not excuse, with the writers for basically fluctuating as writing her as Elizabeth lite or rehashing SG-1. In many ways there was little else they could do with Carter as commander of Atlantis especially in view of her limited availability.

      Now lets look at Woolsey. Yes he has been a butt of the joke before but I would remind everybody that so was Rodney the first few times we saw him. As a matter of fact I remember reading similar comments being made about him when Atlantis was first announced. I hear Caldwell being thrown around but I do not believe he would work as well. Putting Caldwell in charge would be little different than putting John in charge. At the very least he does not bring the same instant drama that Woolsey does. Think about it. For at least the first few episodes (if not longer) every time a crisis comes up it will be accompanied by a type of tension that has never existed before. Namely is this moment that Woolsey gets us all killed or worse. Sure in the beginning there doubts about if Elizabeth could handle being leader of this experiment of an expedition but nothing like what Woolsey will bring to the table.

      Also there are so many directions they could go with his character. They could go pull an early MASH with the humorous leader who manages to just squeak through when the chips are down in thanks to large part his staff. They could go the McKay way and turn him into the lovable nutbag who at times makes you crazy but is good enough at his job to make putting up with him worth it. They could go the evil jerk route ala Romano from ER where you have a real sob who never seems to get what is coming to him and you actively root for him to die. Heck they could even recreate some of the dynamic from the pilot that existed briefly between Robert Patrick's character and John. Imagine a Woolsey who is not all that impressed with the great John Sheppard and brings in some one to supplement him as the highest ranked military officer on Atlantis. Or they could go someplace else completely. And remember people it is not like it is now writ in stone that Woolsey is charge of Atlantis now and forever. If there is one thing Atlantis has proven, far more than SG-1, the only constant is change. That is actually what I love about this show. The downside of course is that I loose characters I deeply, deeply loved like Carson and Elizabeth (for the record SHE would have been my first choice for new commander . The positive is that we get a show that is more realistic than many of its brethren in the way characters come and go from it.

      Ultimately Woolsey is a character with lots of possibilities who also opens even more possibilities for the dynamic and plot of Stargate Atlantis. I write this as someone who has already seen these writers take characters and situations that might seem less than ideal and make them work. Rodney, Vala, and Landry are proof of that. Maybe this will work. Maybe it wont. I do not know. What I do know is this franchise has for more than decade brought me enjoyment and entertainment. What I know is this is a show I talk about in the same breath as Firefly, Farscape, and DS9. What I know is I love this show. Finally what I know is that sometimes I need to just repeat to myself, "It's just a show,I should really just relax..." Best wishes for all and thanks for the time.
      Wow! I think that is the best first post by a new member that I have seen on GW. Great points, you've got green.

      Comment


        That blows. A pathetic announcement! I anticipate much crappiness to unfold over this, the last season of SGA.

        And StorytellerSJK sounds like one of the producers/writers from the show. Highly suspicious!
        sigpic

        Comment


          Originally posted by Dusk View Post
          And StorytellerSJK sounds like one of the producers/writers from the show. Highly suspicious!
          I see two possibilities here:

          1. You are being facetious in which case I congratulate you on a well told joke.

          2. You are being serious in which case I sigh wistfully and then reply with "I wish. No really as a full time film student, whose has already tried once to make it in the harsh wilderness that is the real world, I wish like the blazes that your statement was true. I could use the money. Bad."

          Either way you made me smile, albeit for very different reasons, and bringing joy to someones life is not something to be taken lightly. And that is the toasted toads truth.

          Oh and thank you for the kind words Trek_Girl42. They are greatly appreciated. I assure you they were initially received with the obligatory blush and "Aw shucks twernt nothing". Best wishes to all and till next time later.

          Comment


            Originally posted by Demerzel View Post
            Well, crap.

            I love Picardo, he's a great actor. But Woolsey has been proved several times to be wrong in several of his judgements. His last good call was to warn President Hayes about Kinsey, and that was almost four years ago.

            He panics too easily, makes bad calls, is a stuck-up snub, has no guts or courage, and has the leadership skills of a blind camel about to die of old age.

            Unless the PTB writes him differently, this will be the end of my 11 years of absolute adoration for Stargate. The Ark of Truth was disapointing
            Spoiler:
            with its total lack of space battles, the replicators AGAIN, and near no interesting story. (I won't even mention the absolutely ridiculous final "fight" between the two ascended beings. I saw better special effects in home-made videos.) So much hype for nothing and there is no indication that Continuum will be any better.

            I guess that after all this time, the PTB are finally running out of good ideas. With Stargate going down quality-wise and BSG having only one season left, I guess my unquenchable thirst for good sci-fi will only get worse. I'll enjoy what's left of the very good Season 4, and then I think that's gonna be it for Stargate, I wont go out of my way to watch it anymore.

            EDIT: I'm a big big fan of Caldwell. *HE* should have been the new commander, as he has proven able to trust his co-workers despite them having made mistakes in the past like McKay, he is known to make compromises, is a GREAT leader, and has been here for three years. God I hate that decision so much it's pissing me off.

            Thx for mentioning the movie in a way I really didn't wanna read.
            Last edited by Skydiver; 06 February 2008, 04:01 AM.

            Comment


              Originally posted by StorytellerSJK View Post
              It seems to me that a lot of people on this thread are missing what I believe is the point about Woolsey. You are not supposed to be happy, from an in universe perspective, about Woolsey. At this moment he is the wrong choice. That is what makes him the perfect choice from a out of universe perspective.

              [the rest snipped to make my reply to this post smaller]
              Originally posted by Trek_Girl42 View Post
              Wow! I think that is the best first post by a new member that I have seen on GW. Great points, you've got green.

              Ditto from me too.....It was a pleasure to read first thing in the morning....


              Deeds xx
              Last edited by discodiva; 06 February 2008, 12:01 AM.
              sigpic
              Thanks to slizzie1986 for signature
              MSOL - Official Website of Michael Shanks

              Comment


                Originally posted by FireCat View Post
                I don't know anyone who is happy about Woolsey or Keller.
                Er... me? C'mon this really starts to sound like when Michael Shanks left the show for good . People have buried Stargate in no time, but if we count a little, we'll find, that there was still five more seasons of SG-1 and four more seasons of Atlantis to come.

                It's really sweet to get attached to fictional characters so much that some people feel miserable for weeks, but is it really worth it?
                sigpic

                Comment


                  I'm happy about Keller...

                  not sure about Woolsey though... might make for entertaining storylines though

                  M

                  Click on the image to go to my fanfics.

                  Comment


                    If the Stargate universe were true, and there really was an Atlantis in need of a leader, what rational person would put Woolsey in that position?? I think Dr Lee would do a better job. Hell, ANYBODY would do a better job!! A leader of a base as powerful and important as Atlantis would require vast experience in the field, with excellent people skills, a firm grasp of diplomacy, science, attack strategy, to name but a few, and nerves of steel, with a sense of authority and respect.



                    Woolsey has NONE, I repeat, NONE of these important qualities. Having him lead the entire Atlantis operation will be like putting a check-out chick in charge of the UN. I'm serious, this is a HUGE mistake, and I'm not just saying that to be disagreeable and angsty. I truly believe that the show will suffer with this turn of events.

                    Is it Amanda's fault? Hell no! It's that cage of monkeys they call 'writers' that have instigated this. I have appreciated their contribution to the franchise to some degree over the years, but this officially strips them of any such respect anymore. Given the amazing repertoire of characters/actors they could have called upon to take charge of Atlantis, the writers have instead decided to grace Robert Picardo with a role he most certainly does not deserve. And it is nothing personal or against the actor.

                    His role as a sniveling, whiny coward from the IOA who gives the Stargate program a tough audit now and again is just fine, and well-suited. But the jump to Atlantis commander is like launching Marty from Wormhole X-treme to the ship Captain of a new Earth warship. Would it make for comic relief? Sure. Would it make for drama sci-fi? Um...no wait, let me think about it, um...no. Not in a million million years!

                    Bringing Keller to the front is a worthy shift in cast on the show. Bringing Woolsey to the front and top and centre is diabolical. It gives me seizures.

                    If Sci-Fi doesn't renew the show for another year after this, I won't say I'll be surprised.
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                      Hmmm, I think this is an elaborate plot by TPTB to make the 'Anti Season 5' thread the longest in internet history

                      I have to admit, I love the irony here... as usual you have people berating the writers because they think they know better, only this time it's over the inclusion of character who frequently displays the very same behaviour. You'd think these people would love seeing their own idiosyncrasy on screen.
                      Last edited by fellip_nectar; 06 February 2008, 03:10 AM. Reason: replaced a poorly chosen noun
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                      Comment


                        Originally posted by fellip_nectar View Post
                        Hmmm, I think this is an elaborate plot by TPTB to make the 'Anti Season 5' thread the longest in internet history
                        I don't think we're allowed to have an Anti Series 5 thread, the three that have been opened are now locked by the mods.

                        Anyway RIP Atlantis I seriously doubt there'll be a series 6 after this I gave up watching series 4 after the opening episode, I thought if things looked like they'll be getting better I might give series 5 a look but after this, I don't think I'll bother, I'm sure there'll be something better to watch. Will the last one watching please switch the TV off

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by prion View Post
                          Atlantis is soooo screwed with Woolsey in charge!
                          I have to admit that I am perplexed as to why they would choose Woolsey to command Atlantis when he has clearly shown that he's not capable...don't get me wrong...I love the actor and the character is fine but not as commander...
                          what were they thinking?? Again...don't get me wrong...no offense to the writers and all but seriously...I think this is one of the most bizarre moves yet!
                          Good luck is all I can say...it's going to be very interesting!
                          Re reading this post is kinda weird ...I really mean no offense to anyone...I'm sorry but I just think it's a bizarre move to put Woolsey in command!
                          I'm looking forward to how Daniel Jackson comes to Atlantis...I hope it's an ep with Sam...and maybe Jack too!
                          "Live Peace - Speak Kindness - Dwell in Possibility"
                          Hug Your Loved Ones!!
                          ~Amanda Tapping

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Reefgirl View Post
                            Anyway RIP Atlantis I seriously doubt there'll be a series 6 after this I gave up watching series 4 after the opening episode
                            I've really enjoyed season 4 so far, sometimes even more that season 2, maybe equal to season 3. So I'm really intrigued, what made you quit watching the show, particularly after the opening episode...
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                              Woolsey - NO!

                              Keller - NO!

                              Will I bother watching these two irritating people? NO!

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by chelle db View Post
                                I have to admit that I am perplexed as to why they would choose Woolsey to command Atlantis when he has clearly shown that he's not capable...don't get me wrong...I love the actor and the character is fine but not as commander...
                                what were they thinking?? Again...don't get me wrong...no offense to the writers and all but seriously...I think this is one of the most bizarre moves yet!
                                Good luck is all I can say...it's going to be very interesting!
                                I gotta think (and hope) that all will be explained in the first episode of Season 5. One would hope that the writers are smart enough to acknowledge Woolsey's lack of leadership skills and work that into the plot and script. THe character seems to learn well from his mistakes and I would think that'll work in the plot development throughout season 5. (I know, a lot of thinking, hoping and praying). Bringing in a "true" commander type would just be more of the same - this can be shown as an IOA mandate.
                                I like Picardo and I'm looking forward to it.
                                If you're not going to learn from your mistakes, don't make any!

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