The Covid19 thread

[Gatefan1976]

I would say he lacks faith Tood.
What I think most church goers are missing is the sense of community that a church can provide, and that I get 100%, but community and faith are not the same things. As for MG's other points, I left them alone to avoid an argument.

[Gatefan1976]

Oh, the "fight club" rule... right...

[Annoyed]

See my response to MG.

Do you need a church to pray to God?
If a church can figure out a way to maintain the social distancing laws and make a good case for it, then go for it.

Did you read my post?

But that isn't to say that some state dictators haven't abused their authority to discriminate against religion. About a month ago, some local churches had what I consider a very good idea - Hold their services in drive-ins. Allows them to hold services, while at the same time, maintaining effective social distancing. But some petty state level bureaucraps said no, you can't do that. If I was the church, I'd be looking to hang those bureaucraps by their necks in the courts. First Amendment and all that rot, don't ya know.

Do you need a church to pray?

As far as I know, no. But I don't know enough to say that for sure. And I'm nearly certain that the gathering of the congregation in a house of worship must be an integral part of at least one religion.

[jelgate]

Liquor stores despite the name sell more than just alcohol. That is why they can argue an essential business. They also sell water for example.

[mad_gater]

Liquor stores despite the name sell more than just alcohol. That is why they can argue an essential business. They also sell water for example.

maybe liquor stores in Michigan are different...but here in the People's Republic of NYS liquor stores are just that...liquor and wine...no water unless it's that hard seltzer water I've been seeing around lately

[Gatefan1976]

Did you read my post?

Yes, I did. We agree on maintaining social distancing, but if you read MG's post, that's not his point. As I said, if you can work out a way to do it, go for it.

As far as I know, no. But I don't know enough to say that for sure. And I'm nearly certain that the gathering of the congregation in a house of worship must be an integral part of at least one religion.

Nope, it's not. Weddings and funerals are about it, but there is no need for them to just pray to your god. As I said, it's the sense of community people are missing, not the ability to worship.

[Womble]

I see them use those protestors pull out this phrase a lot: "Give me liberty, or give me death!"
[/I]

Sometimes I wonder why they don't pull that phrase out in the context of, say, freedom of public urination.

P.S. So Israel is almost out of lockdown... but as soon as schools opened we got 79 new Covid-19 cases in one day. 18 of them in the same school. if it reaches 100 per day, we'll be back in lockdown.

Oh, and the health ministry inspected the airport's readiness for processing travelers under new regulations. Apparently it was not ready, so we won't get to renew international flights until mid-July.

[Annoyed]

Yes, I did. We agree on maintaining social distancing, but if you read MG's post, that's not his point. As I said, if you can work out a way to do it, go for it.


Nope, it's not. Weddings and funerals are about it, but there is no need for them to just pray to your god. As I said, it's the sense of community people are missing, not the ability to worship.

It doesn't matter if they can pray at home or not. If they want to worship gathered together, that's their right.

And as you said, several churches did indeed come up with a way to hold services and maintain social distancing; hold the services at drive-ins. But some state level dictators said no, you still can't hold services. That is what I have a problem with.

[Annoyed]

S

P.S. So Israel is almost out of lockdown... but as soon as schools opened we got 79 new Covid-19 cases in one day. 18 of them in the same school. if it reaches 100 per day, we'll be back in lockdown.

Oh, and the health ministry inspected the airport's readiness for processing travelers under new regulations. Apparently it was not ready, so we won't get to renew international flights until mid-July.

I think we're going to see that scenario play out many times over as the people running this circus push for premature re-opening. The question is "will those idiots have the brains to realize they were wrong and shut things back down again and keep them shut down until we have a better handle on this?"

I'm betting not.

We shouldn't be re-opening until we have gotten to the point that there is no further need for social distancing, masks, or whatever else. The very fact that such is required is a clear indicator that the danger has not passed. Forcing people back into their cubicles before that is simply placing lives at risk for the pursuit of money.

[Skydiver]

What churches ran afoul of was state regulations stating ‘no gatherings larger than 10’

That’s how some that did their online virtual service pulled it off, they had a ‘crew’ of less than 10, and those drive in services were larger than 10. Do I think drive in services should have been shut down? Eh. Not much different from the resurgence of drive in movies.

While I can see the comfort people get from the sense of community, I”m not a church going person. I choose to do my ‘worshipping’ enjoying nature and trying to do more good than harm. I don’t NEED to be in a building once a week. So my cynicism is firmly in place, especially when we get those ‘I’m going to church so god will protect me and keep me from getting sick’ folks. Sorry, my knowledge of science overrides your belief in the protection of an invisible being.

If these church goers were all going right back home to self-isolate for the rest of the week, I may feel differently. But their ‘right’ to gather is endangering the lives of untold thousands of people. And that’s where a lot of issues comes into play.

[Falcon Horus]

It doesn't matter if they can pray at home or not. If they want to worship gathered together, that's their right.

As long as a social distance was maintained and no large groups touching items together... but were they keeping to the rules or were they convinced they couldn't be touched.

Cause holding a service is one thing, but actually making sure everybody can do so in a safe enough manner is a different thing.

I believe, there were people from different families going in the same car -- that's not maintaining the social distance.

***

There's this Ikea in Germany, for example: German IKEA Lends Parking Lot to Local Mosque So 800 Muslims Could Celebrate End of Ramadan Together

Or the best one this week -- Leo the Canterbury cat dissappearing into the priest's hassock. Cheeky little bugger:
Cat disappears into priest's robes during online sermon

[Annoyed]

What churches ran afoul of was state regulations stating ‘no gatherings larger than 10’

That’s how some that did their online virtual service pulled it off, they had a ‘crew’ of less than 10, and those drive in services were larger than 10. Do I think drive in services should have been shut down? Eh. Not much different from the resurgence of drive in movies.

While I can see the comfort people get from the sense of community, I”m not a church going person. I choose to do my ‘worshipping’ enjoying nature and trying to do more good than harm. I don’t NEED to be in a building once a week. So my cynicism is firmly in place, especially when we get those ‘I’m going to church so god will protect me and keep me from getting sick’ folks. Sorry, my knowledge of science overrides your belief in the protection of an invisible being.

If these church goers were all going right back home to self-isolate for the rest of the week, I may feel differently. But their ‘right’ to gather is endangering the lives of untold thousands of people. And that’s where a lot of issues comes into play.

Myself, I'm an agnostic. So the religious aspects are null to me. Same with the "social comfort" aspect; I'm a hermit by nature. Even in in normal times, I go out of the house only when necessary. So this doesn't bother me on a personal level.

My objection is that we have overbearing govt. officials specifically denying religions their right to worship as they please, and the targeted application of shutdowns to religions who were meeting published guidelines.

[mad_gater]

What churches ran afoul of was state regulations stating ‘no gatherings larger than 10’

That’s how some that did their online virtual service pulled it off, they had a ‘crew’ of less than 10, and those drive in services were larger than 10. Do I think drive in services should have been shut down? Eh. Not much different from the resurgence of drive in movies.

While I can see the comfort people get from the sense of community, I”m not a church going person. I choose to do my ‘worshipping’ enjoying nature and trying to do more good than harm. I don’t NEED to be in a building once a week. So my cynicism is firmly in place, especially when we get those ‘I’m going to church so god will protect me and keep me from getting sick’ folks. Sorry, my knowledge of science overrides your belief in the protection of an invisible being.

If these church goers were all going right back home to self-isolate for the rest of the week, I may feel differently. But their ‘right’ to gather is endangering the lives of untold thousands of people. And that’s where a lot of issues comes into play.

the way I see it...I wanna live my life with no government interference whatsoever save for that which is necessary to rightfully prosecute me for REAL crimes....and in the process of living my life the way I choose...if I happen to get sick and die then I happen to get sick and die and I hope and pray to God that I've lived my life in close enough accordance with His objective moral principles

I think that we as a society have become so afraid of dying that we've become too afraid to live

[mad_gater]

What churches ran afoul of was state regulations stating ‘no gatherings larger than 10’

That’s how some that did their online virtual service pulled it off, they had a ‘crew’ of less than 10, and those drive in services were larger than 10. Do I think drive in services should have been shut down? Eh. Not much different from the resurgence of drive in movies.

While I can see the comfort people get from the sense of community, I”m not a church going person. I choose to do my ‘worshipping’ enjoying nature and trying to do more good than harm. I don’t NEED to be in a building once a week. So my cynicism is firmly in place, especially when we get those ‘I’m going to church so god will protect me and keep me from getting sick’ folks. Sorry, my knowledge of science overrides your belief in the protection of an invisible being.

If these church goers were all going right back home to self-isolate for the rest of the week, I may feel differently. But their ‘right’ to gather is endangering the lives of untold thousands of people. And that’s where a lot of issues comes into play.

state regulations that made the erroneous presumption that all churches are small...but as I aid before many churches are large enough to hold services containing a lot more than 10 people while still maintaining a good amount of personal space

meaning these regs were probably made up by people who never stepped foot inside a church a day in their lives

[Skydiver]

state regulations that made the erroneous presumption that all churches are small...but as I aid before many churches are large enough to hold services containing a lot more than 10 people while still maintaining a good amount of personal space

meaning these regs were probably made up by people who never stepped foot inside a church a day in their lives

THe no gatherings larger than 10 applied to everything. Churches were not singled out, it applied to classes or meetings or festivals or anything. It did not target religions.

However religious institutions were the main folks that said ‘frak the rules, I don’t have to follow them we’re having services sunday’.

There were a few bars and restaurants, yet churches sought to hide behind being a religious building to not have to follow the rules that everyone else was following.

Even if there is enough room in the building for people to be separate inside, much of hte issues could stem from common use space - restrooms. How to get that many people in and out a very few doors while maintaining the 6 foot distance.