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  1. #1
    Site Admin GateWorld's Avatar
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    Post Stardust City Rag (105)

    Visit the Episode GuideSTAR TREK: PICARD - SEASON ONE
    STARDUST CITY RAG
    EPISODE NUMBER - 105
    When the La Sirena arrives at Freecloud, the crew's search for Maddox requires them to go undercover -- using Seven of Nine as bait for the local crime lord.

    VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >>
    Last edited by GateWorld; February 22nd, 2020 at 06:33 PM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    There is so much so wrong in this episode that i probably wont see this season to the end.
    sorry about my lack of language skills as it is not my daily language and have learned it by my self as not from any help of others or a school

  3. #3
    Air Force Chief of Staff Falcon Horus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Oh my goddess... I wanted to hug Seven so badly. Also bad-ass...
    Also Icheb...

    Why must she be put through the ringer like this?!?
    Secretly likes the whump but

    And damn it... Agnes... why...
    You tagging along was suspicious from the get-go but damn I wanted to be proven wrong so badly.

    Rios with his feather. Elnor disappointed he doesn't get a pop-up add.
    The EMH popping up at random.

    Bad-ass Seven of Nine blowing Jay to kingdom come (Necar from NCIS New Orleans in a different setting ). I want one of those blasters (next prop project -- hell yeah).

    And also... I can't say this enough... that intro... my goddess, I love it.
    I wish I didn't have to download this cause oh my goddess, I want to throw all my money at it so that we can have loads more Picard. This better be released on DVD with lots of extras.
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  4. #4
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Finally, a good episode. It feels like the other four episodes were the dull prequel.

    Seven of Nine did not and does not fit into the Federation or Starfeet...seems obvious. So she becomes a Galaxy Ranger!

    So Agnus was the Dr. Smith character...wow...shocking did not see that obviously coming.

    And....at the start they drink.....Kona.....Kona?! The Balock drink? Wow...they SO should of had Ron Howards little brother in this episode even just like as a waiter or something....

  5. #5
    Major Infinite-Possibilities's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Not that I didn't know this was coming from the trailers, but it is pretty disappointing to see Seven of Nine come back only to be almost like a completely different character. It seemed like there was virtually no trace of Jeri Ryan's previous performance of the character.

    To be honest, the only time that I felt like I was maybe really seeing a conversation between Jean-Luc Picard and Seven of Nine was at the very end.

    Bummer about Icheb, though.
    Last edited by Infinite-Possibilities; February 21st, 2020 at 12:02 PM.
    "First Weir, then Samantha Carter, and now, you! It's a pity you humans die or get reassigned so easily, or I might have a sense of satisfaction now!"

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  6. #6
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zargon View Post
    Finally, a good episode. It feels like the other four episodes were the dull prequel.

    Seven of Nine did not and does not fit into the Federation or Starfeet...seems obvious. So she becomes a Galaxy Ranger!

    So Agnus was the Dr. Smith character...wow...shocking did not see that obviously coming.

    And....at the start they drink.....Kona.....Kona?! The Balock drink? Wow...they SO should of had Ron Howards little brother in this episode even just like as a waiter or something....
    I wouldn't have seen the twist with Agnes unless someone suggested it as a theory last week. I get the feeling she's going to regret it all though.

    Also, Kona? I think you mean Tranya.

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite-Possibilities View Post
    Not that I didn't know this was coming from the trailers, but it is pretty disappointing to see Seven of Nine come back only to be almost like a completely different character. It seemed like there was virtually no trace of Jeri Ryan's previous preference of the character.

    To be honest, the only time that I felt like I was maybe really seeing a conversation between Jean-Luc Picard and Seven of Nine was at the very end.

    Bummer about Icheb, though.
    I disagree. This felt very much like Seven. Or rather a natural extension of where Seven was when we left here.

    Quote Originally Posted by lopo30 View Post
    There is so much so wrong in this episode that i probably wont see this season to the end.
    Lopo, I think you watched a different episode to the rest of us.

  7. #7
    Sarah Lance pscard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zargon View Post
    Finally, a good episode. It feels like the other four episodes were the dull prequel.

    Seven of Nine did not and does not fit into the Federation or Starfeet...seems obvious. So she becomes a Galaxy Ranger!

    So Agnus was the Dr. Smith character...wow...shocking did not see that obviously coming.

    And....at the start they drink.....Kona.....Kona?! The Balock drink? Wow...they SO should of had Ron Howards little brother in this episode even just like as a waiter or something....
    Balok's drink was called 'tranya'.
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    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Balok
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  8. #8
    Sarah Lance pscard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    There's been a lot of verbal and visual 'Easter Eggs' in this series. Did anyone else see the lighted sign advertising Mot's Hair Emporium, Quark's Bar, and Dabo Tables?
    Last edited by pscard; February 22nd, 2020 at 11:13 AM.
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  9. #9
    Sarah Lance pscard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite-Possibilities View Post
    Not that I didn't know this was coming from the trailers, but it is pretty disappointing to see Seven of Nine come back only to be almost like a completely different character. It seemed like there was virtually no trace of Jeri Ryan's previous performance of the character.

    To be honest, the only time that I felt like I was maybe really seeing a conversation between Jean-Luc Picard and Seven of Nine was at the very end.

    Bummer about Icheb, though.
    I noticed that too but attributed this change to her character's growth of returning to her humanity. On the other hand, many of the characters are portrayed as 'broken' and cynical.

    I don't understand why they included 'Bruce Maddox' and 'Icheb' (portrayed by different actors) only to kill them off. Hopefully we'll see them again in flashbacks.
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  10. #10
    Colonel P-90_177's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by pscard View Post
    I noticed that too but attributed this change to her character's growth of returning to her humanity. On the other hand, many of the characters are portrayed as 'broken' and cynical.

    I don't understand why they included 'Bruce Maddox' and 'Icheb' (portrayed by different actors) only to kill them off. Hopefully we'll see them again in flashbacks.
    Icheb was the one thing I didn't really like so much in this episode. For a start the flashback scene was a bit too full on. Jeri Ryan is a good enough actress that she could have sold it by just describing what had happened and we still would have got the horror of it all. Also I think there could be other ways to get across her more cynical attitude without killing off Icheb and with Seven being a hero character I think it may have been a step too far to have her kill in revenge outright.

    All that being said though, that is purely me speaking as a long time Trek fan. From an outside perspective it makes sense that these people don't all have happy endings and Seven never did play by the rules all that well so her becoming a Ranger makes good sense. The idea that Ex-Borg drones would be a highly sought after commodity on the black market also makes perfect sense. So if nothing else it is highly believable.

    I don't think this is going to be the norm though, even for Seven. I don't believe Patrick Stewart would have signed on if the show didn't still contain Rodenberry's hope for the future. The difference being that just like season one of Disco this is a story told over multiple chapters rather than one episode.

    Of those Easter eggs you mentioned though, you're Right there were loads. Including a mention of Quark, Icheb's missing cortical node, why Seven was less de-assimilated than Picard, a mention of Dr. Soong and a load more.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    I bet Agnes is just another of the Deta offspring like the twins but in the end we learn it will be a twist that they actually come as triples and she is coded to be Bruce wife who died or what ever like Deta mom was for Soong that made Deta. As she looks exactly the age the twins are.

    And i speculate it from the fact that she got the hologram ad for fighting robots and she dont like punching anything. So basically she isnt activated. And how are you a specialist about robotics and have no clue how to operate a teleport console ?

    Why in Freecloud that is basically a casino planet no Ferengi ? They show us the very low end CGI that we basically see in the movie of Back To The future 2 a sign for Quarcs bar in there and still no ferengi on sight. Did we even see any other species in this episode other then the lie detector lizard guy ? Ok we saw one Romulan pregnant.

    I really really dont like that they take old characters from the old shows just to kill them off in a really brutal way in first minutes of the show. It's like over 20 years past the time when Voyager ended so if the world is so grim can there be some new character for Seven of nine that she can revenge kill 13 years later ?

    Why did it took 13 years to revenge Icheb ? Episode starts 7 domes and 13 years ago. Like does it really take 13 years for a ex-borg to find a solution how to revenge her sun especially with the contact they had where Icheb donated parts of him self to Seven just so she will live on.

    TNG/DS9/Voyager all had violence in there shows but it wasnt in every episode of the season and it wasnt so in the face and so brutal like stick a fat pike in the eye and then pull it out while the guy on the table screams in pain and then end the episode to kill of Bruce Maddox yet again in a brutal way.

    And there is all only women. Starts of by the women who take apart borgs, then we see in the bar that the new evil women in charge and her twins bodyguard women. Can we even see anyone that isnt women that is tied into the story except that Elnor the ship captein and Picard ? The Romulan guy who got he's head chopped of in episode 4 probably is it but he was there just so Picard gets the Elnor with him so no tie in to the story

    P-90_177 does this explains to you that is all wrong about this show ?

    And tbh we dont have any back story about Seven of Nine. What happen to her that she joined Rangers ?
    What happened to her with Chekote as they were in love in the end of voyager ? What happened to all the support she would get from every crew member from Voyager show that she turned out to be like that ?
    Especially i would like to know about Chekote as what went wrong and why she turned to be lesbian as thats what we read out of this episode that seven was in love with the mercenary women she revenge killed 13 years later after Icheb got killed ? It's like 10 years after Voyager return that all start to go downhill that she change so tragically

    Black market for borg parts for me dont make sense. We have seen a lot of cloning in TNG so why not just make a soleless body and just implement borg nano in them and there you have full tech out body to get all the parts you need. Why go after Star Fleet officer to get parts from ? What does he have that none stripped version of borg drones dont have ? isnt it easier to just make a lab where you grow these borg drones out of clones and then hack parts off from them and sell them to black market ? none of this makes any sense
    Last edited by lopo30; February 21st, 2020 at 02:54 PM.
    sorry about my lack of language skills as it is not my daily language and have learned it by my self as not from any help of others or a school

  12. #12
    Sarah Lance pscard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by lopo30 View Post
    I bet Agnes is just another of the Deta offspring like the twins
    That occurred to me too.

    Quote Originally Posted by lopo30 View Post
    but in the end we learn it will be a twist that they actually come as triples and she is coded to be Bruce wife who died or what ever like Deta mom was for Soong that made Deta. As she looks exactly the age the twins are.
    Just like Soong's creations: B4, Lore, and Data.

    Quote Originally Posted by lopo30 View Post
    And i speculate it from the fact that she got the hologram ad for fighting robots and she dont like punching anything. So basically she isnt activated. And how are you a specialist about robotics and have no clue how to operate a teleport console ?

    Why in Freecloud that is basically a casino planet no Ferengi ? They show us the very low end CGI that we basically see in the movie of Back To The future 2 a sign for Quarcs bar in there and still no ferengi on sight. Did we even see any other species in this episode other then the lie detector lizard guy ? Ok we saw one Romulan pregnant.

    I really really dont like that they take old characters from the old shows just to kill them off in a really brutal way in first minutes of the show. It's like over 20 years past the time when Voyager ended so if the world is so grim can there be some new character for Seven of nine that she can revenge kill 13 years later ?
    Just as 'Ramirez' got killed off in 'Highlander II: The Quickening'.

    Quote Originally Posted by lopo30 View Post
    Why did it took 13 years to revenge Icheb ? Episode starts 7 domes and 13 years ago. Like does it really take 13 years for a ex-borg to find a solution how to revenge her sun especially with the contact they had where Icheb donated parts of him self to Seven just so she will live on.

    TNG/DS9/Voyager all had violence in there shows but it wasnt in every episode of the season and it wasnt so in the face and so brutal like stick a fat pike in the eye and then pull it out while the guy on the table screams in pain and then end the episode to kill of Bruce Maddox yet again in a brutal way.

    And there is all only women. Starts of by the women who take apart borgs, then we see in the bar that the new evil women in charge and her twins bodyguard women. Can we even see anyone that isnt women that is tied into the story except that Elnor the ship captein and Picard ? The Romulan guy who got he's head chopped of in episode 4 probably is it but he was there just so Picard gets the Elnor with him so no tie in to the story
    Did you noticed how closely Bjayzl resembled Deanna Troi???

    Quote Originally Posted by lopo30 View Post
    P-90_177 does this explains to you that is all wrong about this show ?

    And tbh we dont have any back story about Seven of Nine. What happen to her that she joined Rangers ?
    What happened to her with Chekote as they were in love in the end of voyager ? What happened to all the support she would get from every crew member from Voyager show that she turned out to be like that ?
    Especially i would like to know about Chekote as what went wrong and why she turned to be lesbian as thats what we read out of this episode that seven was in love with the mercenary women she revenge killed 13 years later after Icheb got killed ? It's like 10 years after Voyager return that all start to go downhill that she change so tragically

    Black market for borg parts for me dont make sense. We have seen a lot of cloning in TNG so why not just make a soleless body and just implement borg nano in them and there you have full tech out body to get all the parts you need. Why go after Star Fleet officer to get parts from ? What does he have that none stripped version of borg drones dont have ? isnt it easier to just make a lab where you grow these borg drones out of clones and then hack parts off from them and sell them to black market ? none of this makes any sense
    Why not use a replicator?
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  13. #13
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    This may be a hint that Agnes could be a synth. In the scene in which she has to hit the pop-up boxing robot in it's head reminded me of Rock 'Em Sock 'Em Robots where you have to "knock it's block off". In this toy, one of the robots is blue as was the one Agnes fought.
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  14. #14
    Sarah Lance pscard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Another easter egg is when Mr. Vup tells Rio "Quark of Fereginar was especially impressed with your handling of his trouble with the Breen."
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  15. #15
    Air Force Chief of Staff Falcon Horus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Agnes being a synth -- crossed my mind briefly. However, assuming the Romulans got to her before joining Picard's merry band, wouldn't she have somehow activited depending on her "operating system"?

    ****

    I'm amused that I'm not the only one to have picked up on the "sexual" tension between Seven and Jay (?) -- albeit I'm fairly certain Lopo wouldn't approve of it at all. In fact, he seems to think only men should be involved in any fighting or killing of others, or be heroes of a TV-show.

    Though as far as that tension goes, it's quite clear that Jay (or however she was named) played "Annika" to get to Icheb for parts.
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  16. #16
    Major Infinite-Possibilities's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by Falcon Horus View Post
    Agnes being a synth -- crossed my mind briefly. However, assuming the Romulans got to her before joining Picard's merry band, wouldn't she have somehow activited depending on her "operating system"?

    ****

    I'm amused that I'm not the only one to have picked up on the "sexual" tension between Seven and Jay (?) -- albeit I'm fairly certain Lopo wouldn't approve of it at all. In fact, he seems to think only men should be involved in any fighting or killing of others, or be heroes of a TV-show.

    Though as far as that tension goes, it's quite clear that Jay (or however she was named) played "Annika" to get to Icheb for parts.
    Yeah, I wasn't sure if I should mention this initially, but whenever they interacted, I was wondering exactly what the show was implying about the nature of their relationship.
    Last edited by Infinite-Possibilities; February 22nd, 2020 at 03:40 PM.
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  17. #17
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    The Doctor is either a hidden android or she has a mental illness. She can effectively kill in cold blood when she feels like she needs to (not just Romulan assassins taken by surprise but someone she loves) but feels bad about hitting a hologram robot. The general aversion to violence and ditzyness doesn't seem like a complete act, mostly because she doesn't come across as a sociopath, especially since she seemed to feel genuinely bad about killing Maddox (nice and slow), but she seemed to show more hesitation over hitting a hologram than killing someone she cared for.

    I wish they hadn't killed Maddox off so quickly. It was sad that Seven lost Icheb, I agree with P-90_177, that it wasn't necessary to show his brutal death, especially in the opening and that it may have been better to just have her mention it. I've always thought her relationship with Chacotay (can't spell his name) was weird and came out of nowhere in Voyager's last season, so (seemingly) having it not work out after they got back to the Alpha quadrant seemed fine to me. I also don't have an issue with Seven not staying with Starfleet and becoming a ranger, especially if Starfleet seemed to be changing. I can see her isolating herself from her old friends on voyager and pushing them away if they tried to help her after what happened to Icheb. Maybe she asked them to give her space and they were trying to respect that. We don't know exactly what happened to the rest of Voyager's crew or what happened between them and Seven, and I don't think we need to know all that, since it's not Seven's story or the story of Voyager's crew. I don't find them not being able to stop/help Seven unbelievable. I wish she'd had a happier life, since I really do love the character, and I hope this isn't the end for her and that she gets a chance at happiness.

    I enjoyed everything on the ship before they got down to the planet and everyone's act in the casino. I'm really loving Rios (and his holograms). Can't wait until the next ep.

  18. #18
    Major Infinite-Possibilities's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    If the Doctor is a synth, then shouldn't she be helping Picard? The Romulan/Starfleet conspiracy appears to be against synths.
    "First Weir, then Samantha Carter, and now, you! It's a pity you humans die or get reassigned so easily, or I might have a sense of satisfaction now!"

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    "Elizabeth..."

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by pscard View Post


    Did you noticed how closely Bjayzl resembled Deanna Troi???


    Why not use a replicator?
    Everytime she was onscreen all I could think of was that she looked exactly like a taller, thinner Troi.

    Maybe it's like a collector thing, need/want an original.

  20. #20
    Major General VampyreWraith's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stardust City Rag (105)

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite-Possibilities View Post
    If the Doctor is a synth, then shouldn't she be helping Picard? The Romulan/Starfleet conspiracy appears to be against synths.
    If she doesn't know what she is like the others and she was led to believe by Commodore Sunglasses that synths were evil destroyers or whatever she might not think it's a good idea to help Picard. If she is a synth, she could be an earlier model without the same programming/protocols.

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